pdlamb

Sorry, just following the information you posted. It was unclear to me that I was only allowed to quote a different post.

The point remains, though. Given my own (and some others') experience, another 32% margin for fatigue resistance on top of "doesn't cause me any problem" is unnecessary.

Given the low and uneven spoke tensions I've personally observed on factory built wheels, the fact that some break is irrelevant. Do you have any idea, though, what caused your problems with, for example, 13 gauge straight spokes? Isn't that the butt gauge of your triple butted spokes?

cyccommute 

Huh? Not following your point. I never said you were or weren’t allowed to do anything.

Again, breaking strength measurements aren’t there as a gauge of tension on the spoke during a build but are a gauge of the durability of the spoke. The tension of the spoke during the build is limited by the material of the rim. If you were using steel rims, you could jack the spoke tension up to near the breaking point without problems. But with aluminum, the metal limits how much tension you can put on the spoke.

And, just to be clear, a “stronger rim” doesn’t allow for more tension on the spokes. The few places where I’ve found any spoke tension guidance don’t list individual rim models but go for a wide range of tension for all their rims. The suggested tension seems more like a lawyerly CYA than an actual value.

The point remains, though. Given my own (and some others') experience, another 32% margin for fatigue resistance on top of "doesn't cause me any problem" is unnecessary.[/QUOTE]

Doesn’t cause you a problem. It has caused pepperbelly and many others problems. I have no idea how much you weigh but pepperbelly has listed his weight. He can most certainly benefit from a more durable spoke that a lighter rider can get away with.

I’ve seen good and bad factory built wheels. But heavier riders can certainly benefit from using better spokes than factory wheels typically use.

I’ve never used 2.3mm straight gauge spokes except long ago on a Liberia’s tandem. That was the only bike I’ve ever broken a front spoke on. Those were very difficult to find. I’ve used 2.0mm straight gauge spokes both in factory wheels and in wheels I’ve built. I’ve also used double butted before triple butted ones became available. But I’ve never used 13 gauge (2.3mm) straight spokes.

The problems I had with both straight and double butted 2.0mm spokes is that they are too light of a duty to last up to the stresses I put on the spoke.