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Updating my bike. Please check my work.

Old 01-13-22, 11:17 PM
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the sci guy 
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Updating my bike. Please check my work.

I’ve got a 2001 Cannondale R1000 that I’m removing all the original components and updating to modern. I’ve done a bit of research into what I need but I have a few questions about some specifics. Need y’all to check my math.

I have a 105 crank that’s a few years old, it’s a FC-5800. I believe this is the new bottom bracket I need: https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/produ.../SM-BBR60.html

I assume I don’t have to worry about things like spindle length with this type of setup, right? Kinda more like plug ‘n’ play, right, because there’s isn’t a spindle so the BB puts the crank in the right spot?

Second; the headset. It currently has a Cane Creek S2 Aheadset. I don’t care for the way it looks with a threadless stem - the transition from head tube to headset to spacers to stem is ugly since it’s got external bearing cups. I’ve been looking at what modern stuff Cane Creek has to offer and I was curious if this vintage of bike can take a zero stack (not integrated) headset such as this: https://canecreek.com/product/hellbender-70/

Or even something similar to this: https://www.fsaproshop.com/products/...ta-i-e-headset

I haven’t had a chance to pop out the existing headset and measure the internal diameter of the head tube but I will do that this weekend.

Everything else is pretty straightforward. I think I’ve got some bars and a stem picked out (Zipp service course), need to order a set of 105 brifters and the FD/RD & cassette.

My last hangup is wheels. No idea what brand to go with - there are so many! Was thinking of some H Plus Son Archetypes though. Max tire clearance for the frame is 700x25. Don’t want carbon or deep dish, just some nice light quality alloy wheels for about $300-400.

Anyway, thanks for any insights into the BB and headset.

Last edited by the sci guy; 01-14-22 at 07:59 AM.
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Old 01-14-22, 06:33 AM
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Your BB link goes to a headset. But a BBR 60 HT II BB will be fine assuming the C'Dale is a threaded BB shell (English 68mm)
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Old 01-14-22, 07:47 AM
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Check out Fulcrum wheels at Chain Reaction.
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Old 01-14-22, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted by dedhed View Post
Your BB link goes to a headset. But a BBR 60 HT II BB will be fine assuming the C'Dale is a threaded BB shell (English 68mm)
Fixed link. Sorry I did this on my phone last night and pasting links into it it actually turned the entire post into a 1 big link. I thought I fixed it, whoops!

But yes, to respond to your query, yes the current BB is an english threaded BB-5500 Octalink - pretty sure I measured it at 68mm.
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Old 01-14-22, 08:44 AM
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Is the FC-5800 crank a replacement for your current crank? If so the bottom bracket you linked to is correct. It is an 11-speed crank, requires an external bearing HTII bottom bracket and the spindle is built into the drive side crank arm. So, yes, the spacing is preset. The last Octalink 105 crank was the 9-speed FC-5500/5503 and is that what you are replacing?

As to headsets, Zero stack cups need a minimum of a 44mm ID headtube and are available for 1-1/8" straight or 1-1/8x1-1/2" tapered steerers. Both the FSA and Cane Creek headset links show a minimum of 44mm headtube diameters.

As to wheels, I've had great service from Shimano prebuilt wheelsets. I have a pair of WH-R560 wheels on one bike with well over 40,000 miles. They have never needed any truing and the hubs are the excellent Shimano cup-and-cone type. The current WH-RS300 wheels are probably the equivalent.
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Old 01-14-22, 09:58 AM
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It looks like good advice regarding the components, but as I read this, close to $1K worth of new parts and labor are about to be ordered in order to 'update' a 20 year old but functioning bike? I don't know. What does $1K spent on a new BiKE net? A carbon fork at least. Decent wheels, current drivetrain, and the original bike thrown in for free! Or is MY math off? N+1 whenever possible.
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Old 01-14-22, 11:24 AM
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Concur 5800 and bbr60 work together, have this on an 85 team miyata

check out velomine for the wheels with Archetype $399 https://www.velomine.com/index.php?m...oducts_id=5274

I just ordered some with Silver Archetype rims and the white industries hubs which are more $$

talk to them if you don't like the colors in the standard offers
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Old 01-14-22, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
It looks like good advice regarding the components, but as I read this, close to $1K worth of new parts and labor are about to be ordered in order to 'update' a 20 year old but functioning bike? I don't know. What does $1K spent on a new BiKE net? A carbon fork at least. Decent wheels, current drivetrain, and the original bike thrown in for free! Or is MY math off? N+1 whenever possible.
a thousand dollar new bike gets you 8 speed claris, sunrace, as an example Specialized Allez https://www.specialized.com/us/en/al...=302106-184447
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Old 01-14-22, 11:51 AM
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One more thing to add

5800 crank will work with both english/bsa threading and Italian threading BB shells, just get the english or italian version of the BBR60. I have used my 5800 crankset with a de rosa with italian threading and a Miyata with english threading

no worries about spindle length
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Old 01-14-22, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by squirtdad View Post
a thousand dollar new bike gets you 8 speed claris, sunrace, as an example Specialized Allez https://www.specialized.com/us/en/al...=302106-184447
This bike is also full Claris, All Shimano, except for the brake calipers. Carbon fork. $600 two years ago. 23lb with the fenders and kickstand. If the frame is the soul of a bike, then getting a 20 year newer frame is worth $1K all on its own. The drivetrain components are gravy.
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Old 01-14-22, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
This bike is also full Claris, All Shimano, except for the brake calipers. Carbon fork. $600 two years ago. 23lb with the fenders and kickstand. If the frame is the soul of a bike, then getting a 20 year newer frame is worth $1K all on its own. The drivetrain components are gravy.
Not sure I would agree a newer, but lower end frame is automatically better, but that is a much larger discussion, I do think that components do matter, especially in terms of ease of maintenance and durability

seems like what is similar to the $600 trek you listed is now $1000 https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/b...ode=blue_black

11 speed 5800 105 is a night and day difference from 8 speed Claris
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Old 01-14-22, 01:08 PM
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I wouldn't automatically agree a newer frame is better either. Especially if fit on that older frame is what is desired and proven acceptable by the user of it.

However one old bike, my 78 Raleigh Competition GS, I bought all the 105 5800 parts to upgrade it just like I did with my 91 Schwinn Paramount. Just before installing them and making the modifications to the braze-on for cable stops and adding bottle bosses, I got to thinking and pondering and what-ifing. I weighed the bare frame and fork and it was just over 6 pounds. About the same as my Paramount. The bike would never be a sub-21 pound bike on the budget I wanted to allow for it. So right then and there all my desire to upgrade it ended though I really like the way that bike fit me.

I then got a healthy case of new-bike fever and went out and got a brand new bike that so far is the most fun bike for me to ride that I have ever owned. And it's not just sub- 21 pounds, it's sub-18 pounds! Which I know isn't light by todays standards of new high dollar bikes. But it is light for me.

I can only imagine that the OP's frame being from this century must be a better candidate for trouble free exchanging of old components to new modern Shimano road groups introduced during the last six years through today.

Last edited by Iride01; 01-14-22 at 01:22 PM.
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Old 01-14-22, 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
It looks like good advice regarding the components, but as I read this, close to $1K worth of new parts and labor are about to be ordered in order to 'update' a 20 year old but functioning bike? I don't know. What does $1K spent on a new BiKE net? A carbon fork at least. Decent wheels, current drivetrain, and the original bike thrown in for free! Or is MY math off? N+1 whenever possible.
This bike has a carbon fork. This particular frame (model + year) was one of my holy grails. I found it in my size after searching for about 2 years - and I found it in NJ and I live in Texas. Luckily I had a friend that bought it for me and shipped it to me. The colorway, the frame aesthetics and geometry. The late 90's/early 00's Cannondale CAADs are gorgeous and they are sooooo light. Sure it's great with that old 105/Ultegra setup, but I wanted to make it even better. Plus, those old Flight Deck hoods are designed with the old style clamps where it sticks more straight out instead of being designed to clamp to the curve of drop bars.
$1,000 gets you nothing worthwhile in a modern bike. Any bike with 105 or Ultegra is pushing $3,000 at this point.

Originally Posted by squirtdad View Post
Concur 5800 and bbr60 work together, have this on an 85 team miyata

check out velomine for the wheels with Archetype $399 https://www.velomine.com/index.php?m...oducts_id=5274

I just ordered some with Silver Archetype rims and the white industries hubs which are more $$

talk to them if you don't like the colors in the standard offers
Nice. Are they fairly light(ish) wheels? I used to have a set of Vuelta Corsa Superlites on my Roubaix before Hurricane Harvey flooded them and they were pretty nice, but I don't think they make them anymore. But I do really like those H Plus Son wheels.

Originally Posted by Iride01 View Post
I wouldn't automatically agree a newer frame is better either. Especially if fit on that older frame is what is desired and proven acceptable by the user of it.

I can only imagine that the OP's frame being from this century must be a better candidate for trouble free exchanging of old components to new modern Shimano road groups introduced during the last six years through today.
Like I said above, I wanted this frame. I love a level top tube 1000000x better than the sloping top tube compact frames with an overly long seatpost these days. Aesthetics matter to me, not just ride quality. Colorways, frame design are all part of the overall package for me. I love this frame.
And I agree, by 2001 most of the frame design was pretty standard (rear spacing, BB shell, etc. I think it'll be much easier than trying to put modern on a much older bike.

Originally Posted by HillRider View Post
Is the FC-5800 crank a replacement for your current crank? If so the bottom bracket you linked to is correct. It is an 11-speed crank, requires an external bearing HTII bottom bracket and the spindle is built into the drive side crank arm. So, yes, the spacing is preset. The last Octalink 105 crank was the 9-speed FC-5500/5503 and is that what you are replacing?

As to headsets, Zero stack cups need a minimum of a 44mm ID headtube and are available for 1-1/8" straight or 1-1/8x1-1/2" tapered steerers. Both the FSA and Cane Creek headset links show a minimum of 44mm headtube diameters.
Yes the 5800 105 crank will replace what was on it - which was an Ultegra FC-6500. So thank you for confirming - I will order that bottom bracket.

To your second comment - so looks like I need to confirm what the internal diameter of the head tube is then - I will pop the old headset out this weekend and measure with my calipers.

Thanks for the input so far everyone. Keep it coming! (especially any more thoughts on headsets).
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Old 01-15-22, 12:41 PM
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Because of the sloping top tubes with more seat post exposed, it gives a chance to have a little more of the road shocks buffered by that length above the top tube.

Not every time. Some seat posts are just way to rigid to offer anything towards that.

Just food for thought. I think you'll have a nice bike either way you go. Back about 2016, putting 11 speed Shimano 105 5800 on a '91 Paramount frame is what helped get me into the 21st Century. Previously I was 7 speed rear with friction shifters and being a legend in my own mind! Boy did I have things to learn. And still do.
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Old 01-15-22, 01:52 PM
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the sci guy the Archetypes are nice, no doubt, but I'll add a +1 for the Shimano WH-R wheelsets. They're great wheels that punch above their weight for the $$. You can also find them as take-offs for relatively little money, because they're 'generic' wheelsets.

*What color is your R-1000 ? (I'm on the hunt for a CAAD or 2.8/3.0 to go with my F-1000)


Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
This bike is also full Claris, All Shimano, except for the brake calipers. Carbon fork. $600 two years ago. 23lb with the fenders and kickstand. If the frame is the soul of a bike, then getting a 20 year newer frame is worth $1K all on its own. The drivetrain components are gravy.
I'd strip that TREK down and throw it on a CAAD-3/4 frame in a heartbeat. You're right about the frame being the soul of the bike, and those 90's Cannondales were way, way ahead of the curve. The ride and feel of those bikes is distinctive, and IMHO, the fit and finish of the USA-built 'Dales are about the best of any 'mass-market' bike ever made.
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Old 01-15-22, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Ironfish653 View Post
the sci guy the Archetypes are nice, no doubt, but I'll add a +1 for the Shimano WH-R wheelsets. They're great wheels that punch above their weight for the $$. You can also find them as take-offs for relatively little money, because they're 'generic' wheelsets.

*What color is your R-1000 ? (I'm on the hunt for a CAAD or 2.8/3.0 to go with my F-1000)

I'd strip that TREK down and throw it on a CAAD-3/4 frame in a heartbeat. You're right about the frame being the soul of the bike, and those 90's Cannondales were way, way ahead of the curve. The ride and feel of those bikes is distinctive, and IMHO, the fit and finish of the USA-built 'Dales are about the best of any 'mass-market' bike ever made.
Agree these frames are so wonderful. I will look into the Shimano wheelsets.

Hereís the bike:

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Old 01-15-22, 04:33 PM
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I admit that IN the 90's there wasn't a bike I wanted more than a Cannondale. I was a starving artist back then. It wasn't happening. I bought a 600cc motorcycle (new!) for less money than the bicycle and it was great fun till it almost killed me. When I bought the TREK in 2018, the level top tube thing was a distant memory. I could take it or leave it. Mostly it represented 27" wheels and the inability to be worked on with 4,5 and 6mm Allen wrenches. I am amazed at what $1K can buy these days and I am not nearly talented enough a rider to see any difference between a $1K bike and a $3K bike. My wife spends the difference.
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Old 01-15-22, 05:30 PM
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RE: headset, these older CAAD frames should use an external cup 34mm (EC34 standard) with pressed cups. If you measure the frames headtube, it should be about 41mm+/- just below the headset. This will confirm that it is EC34. The later CAAD will have a flared headtube to accommodate the SI system, which had 'drop-in' cartridges, and was in the 46mm range.

The EC34 is very common and easy to find to match your esthetic desire and selection of sealed cartridge or caged bearings. Check out Cane Creek, Tange, Ritchey or Chris King ($$$), as well as many others.
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Old 01-16-22, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by KCT1986 View Post
RE: headset, these older CAAD frames should use an external cup 34mm (EC34 standard) with pressed cups. If you measure the frames headtube, it should be about 41mm+/- just below the headset. This will confirm that it is EC34. The later CAAD will have a flared headtube to accommodate the SI system, which had 'drop-in' cartridges, and was in the 46mm range.

The EC34 is very common and easy to find to match your esthetic desire and selection of sealed cartridge or caged bearings. Check out Cane Creek, Tange, Ritchey or Chris King ($$$), as well as many others.
i popped out the old headset today after considerable effort (looks like zero grease was used when pressing in cups). I measured top and bottom of the headtube and got


Which confirms the 34 but please help me out here because maybe what I want doesnít existÖ
If itís an external cup headset then itís not possible to be zero stack? Are they mutually exclusive? Because itís external cup, it canít be zero stack and head tubes of this size canít be zero stack because it couldnít fit the races + the steerer in the 34mm space?

So it looks like Iím stuck with external cup. Guess Iíll need to find the slimmest lowest profile one?
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Old 01-16-22, 04:55 PM
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Yes, EC34 is exactly what was expected. 34mm would be too narrow to house both 1 1/8" headtube and bearings. ZS headsets are usually made for a 44mm bore, 41mm at the very least in most cases, and goes larger for thicker steerers.

Most EC34s will have a stack height in the 25-32mm range, with caged balls at the lower end.
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