Mavic hub/wheel issue.
 

Hi Folks,I have a Mavic wheelset that I would like to use on my Dawes Galaxy. The hubs, labeled Paris-Gao-Dakar, appear to be model 501 with sealed bearings. They are laced to Mavic Open 4CD rims. The OLD for the rear is 130mm as measured and specified. The literature says that they can use either a 7 or 8 speed freewheel.

Here’s my problem. I had a Sachs-Maillard 13-26, 8 speed freewheel with a FY92 code on it. When I thread it on tightly, the flange on the axle is flush with outer face of the freewheel. Not enough clearance between the FW edge & the dropout. I’ve also tried a Sunrace 13-28, 8 speed. The flange sticks out about 1.5mm from the edge of that FW. Still, not enough clearance.

My question, is there a way to change the DS spacing on these hubs? I can re-center the wheel if needed.

The pictures are an attempt to show the problem.

Thanks & regards,

Van
PS: Does using a freewheel make this a C&V issue?
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f687784865.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...df0a2c0b76.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...737263dc3a.jpg

You very successfully cropped out the thing that matters most, namely the axle.

From what I see, it seems to be a conventional threaded axle, with spacers and a lockout.

If so, it's an easy matter of swapping about 4mm of spacers from the left to the right. The goal should be to establish the minimum clearance for the chain in high gear.

After resplacing the axle, you'll need to redish the wheel back to center.

FWIW - I suspect that the prior owner set it up for 7s. If so, there's the off chance that it was originally 8s, and wasn't relished, so m a ybe the stars will a lign for you.

I'll bet there is the perfect (about) 3mm spacer on the left that you can move to the right.

Weird that people keep throwing this around or that around when I've posted this here probably a dozen times already...

http://www.mrrabbit.net/docs/freewhe...OLD_sizing.pdf

In this case, you need to measure from the freewheel thread stop to the outside of the locknut.

It has to be 40.5mm to accept an 8-speed freewheel.

=8-|

Oh, are you famous?

Hello again,
Apologies for the in complete info & crappy pix.
These hubs do not have a threaded steel axle. The "axle" is a very thick walled 12mm aluminum tube. The ends are turned down to 10mm for the rear & 9mm for the front. The flanges are held in place with a small circlip which is difficult to see in the pictures. The center hole is 5mm to accommodate the skewer.
Although Mavic's data says that these will work with an 8 speed FW, the distance the thread stop & the flange is only 39mm. Thanks, @mrrabbit!
It doesn't appear that there is a way to alter the DS spacing. Maybe a narrower FW. Or, have 2mm machined of the thread stop.
Hope the pictures clarify things.
Thanks again,
Van
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cbfa66edb8.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...4bb9a0f3d2.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f2ef5529f2.jpg

What's the nut on the unthreaded axle for?

@Senior Ryder 00 - Yes this is a C&V type question.
Looks like a 530 hub. Axle lengths are listed below, 126, 130, and 135. You may only have a 126.
I converted my Colnago from a 6 to a 7speed hub without any modification. Clearence was available. You must take the needed clearance for the chain to move from the smallest sprocket to the next one in terms of the stays. Not all frames will accommodate actual usage of increasing the number of sprockets even if the wheel set will mount on the frame. Example below.

6 speed block
https://live.staticflickr.com/7301/1...39851143_b.jpgP9161255 on Flickr

7 speed blolck
https://live.staticflickr.com/5504/1...35a66477_b.jpgPA241420 on Flickr

With chain on lowest gear
https://live.staticflickr.com/7357/1...eb1b8f70_b.jpgPA121374 on Flickr

At the time, I considered looking for a longer Mavic axle to take it one more but hey, it is C&V and I doubt Mavic ever offered a longer axle as a spare part. Another thing to keep an eye out for.
https://live.staticflickr.com/5476/1...fe26619e_b.jpgP9151226 on Flickr
https://live.staticflickr.com/3695/1...776940b4_b.jpgMavic Hub description on Flickr
https://live.staticflickr.com/5520/1...ea756424_b.jpgMavicManualPg1 on Flickr
https://live.staticflickr.com/3693/1...6eebd530_b.jpgMavicManualPg2 on Flickr

Excellent hubs!

You didn't "convert" your hub to 7 speed. All 126 and 130mm width hubs are fully compatible with 7 speed. You have enormous clearance with both 6 and 7.


However, thank you for posting the hub instructions. In the lower right of the last page it says exactly what the OP needs to do to add spacers on the right side of his axle to get clearance for the 8 speed freewheel.

Mavic 530 Rear Hub 28H 130mm Freewheel | eBay
MAVIC Front & Rear 501 32 hole matching hub set L'Erocia, Vintage | eBay - 131mm axle length.

Hi folks,
Thanks for the feedback. Now I have drawings & instructions that will, hopefully, help me solve this little problem.
Cheers,
Van

Looking at your photos, that hub has one washer installed. I don't think you need a perfect match to it - as long as the hole isn't too big and the outside won't touch the freewheel, anything will work. If you have to make something, I would start with a brass washer for reasonable strength and ease of drilling/filing.

Now that I've seen the photo, I know which hub you have. These hubs came with various axles specific to the OLD and freewheel clearance.

There was a bit of wiggle room to fine tune with 1 or 2mm spacers, but that was it.

Getting closer to a solution
 

Hi folks,
Finally got the time (& courage) to take apart my Mavic 530 hub. Although the axle does measure 130mm, there was only one 1mm spacer/washer on DS. I found another copper one in my washer stash, but will likely need more. A quick google search said that the copper ones are available at most auto parts stores. Too cold & wet for a bike ride today. Will try tomorrow & keep you posted.
Cheers,
Van

Why not just use a 6- or 7-speed Sunrace? :wtf:

I started this build with the wheels, which were spec’d as 8 speed, plus a set 8 speed STI bar ends & the S-M 8 speed FW. Also the frame rear spacing is 130mm. Why not experiment?
Cheers,

Get it on the road with an all-chrome Sunrace 7-speed for under $25. It usually requires 127-128mm spacing.

13-25

13-28

He only needs a washer. Why spend $25 when you can spend a quarter?

Well, if he can understand how to respace that funky axle, the axle is long enough to do so, the wheel is re-dished accordingly, the axle is strong enough to support the additional dish, and his old, 8-speed freewheel meets the needs for his intended method of cycling, fine.

There's a reason people don't use 8-speed freewheels. On the other hand, 6- and 7-speeds are very common.

The reason 8 speed freewheels were uncommon is that every company making an 8 speed shift system offered a cassette as a standard gruppo component. While they made DA and Sante 7 speed freewheels, Shimano largely stopped doing nice freewheel stuff with 6 speed.

And the further you dish that wheel for a freewheel, the weaker becomes the axle, especially for folks who don't ride light in the saddle.

Why go to 8? Is that so much better than 7? Like the guitar amp that goes to 11?

The axle is already 130. Putting a 7 speed freewheel on isn't going to change that.

You mean a different freewheel will not magically change the axle length?? Wow. Thanks!

So your suggestions to not use an 8 speed freewheel on this 130mm axle were pointless? Wow. Thanks!

All is well that ends well!
 

Hi folks,

My trip to the auto parts store successfully solved the spacing problems. The designation for the washers is M12 for the ID of 12mm. they come in various materials, outside diameters and thicknesses. I got copper ones 2.5mm thick. The OD is a couple of mm larger than the stock one, but doesn’t cause a problem. They were $0.75 each. Other than dealing with the circlips, these are easier to work on than the early Suntour/Sunshine sealed bearing units.

The result was 3mm clearance between the outside edge of the S-M FW and the edge of the axle flange. I only had to re-center ~1mm. Easy enough. A couple of precautions; 1. Be very careful with the little circlips. 2. The stock washer needs to be next to the bearing to prevent binding. 3. The nut on the axle not only holds the NDS bearing in place, it also place tension on the bearings. Tighten cautiously.

When assembled, everything worked as designed on the work stand. Ultegra derailleurs, Shimano STI bar end shifters, SRAM chain and the Sachs-Maillard FW. Unfortunately, I didn’t get a test ride in due to the rain. I will try to get it on the road with the first clear spell.

Thanks for all the help.

Cheers,

Van
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3aeaf8803c.jpg