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Drive Train Cleaning

Old 02-02-23, 06:59 AM
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Awesomeguy
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Drive Train Cleaning

I cleaned my bike yesterday , and in doing so, cleaned the cassette using a brush , and dipping the brush in a degreaser, then cleaning each ring, and same with the rear and front derailleur. I then Cleaned the chain using a degreaser, gave it a good rinse . However, when I run my chain through a cloth, I still get black gunk over the cloth, although the chain is visually clean.

Should the cloth be spotless prior to relubing the chain and derailleur pivots?
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Old 02-02-23, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Awesomeguy View Post

Should the cloth be spotless prior to relubing the chain and derailleur pivots?
Mine would be. There should be no oily residues whatsoever on the outside of your chain.
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Old 02-02-23, 07:42 AM
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The last thing you clean will transfer gunk to the first thing you clean, then the gunk will be transferred back to the last thing. The chain will hold a bunch of gunk and remain wet for some time - so it will transfer gunk to all of the clean parts.

I find when using wet lube, I need about 3 cleaning cycles to get all of the gunk off.

Only way to do it in one shot is to pull the chain off and clean all the parts separately. Soak the chain in degreaser - I like to use an old water bottle - soak the chain, shake it up, rinse and repeat a few times.


Oh and, wet lube is the devil. It's a product designed to pick up crap off the road and turn your drivetrain into sandpaper. Wax based lubes make the clean up process a whole bunch easier.
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Old 02-02-23, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
Mine would be. There should be no oily residues whatsoever on the outside of your chain.
what is your cleaning method? I feel like its damn near impossible to get it that clean. Especially if you are not removing the chain and are doing it weekly basis
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Old 02-02-23, 07:47 AM
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So , i've been told to lube the chain routinely. Espcially if you ride like i do , which is 70 miles per week. Should i be removing the chain each time to clean the chain?
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Old 02-02-23, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Awesomeguy View Post
what is your cleaning method? I feel like its damn near impossible to get it that clean. Especially if you are not removing the chain and are doing it weekly basis
As noted you have to remove and clean the chain separately from the cassette and chainrings if you insist on spotlessly clean. Getting the dirt off of the interior surfaces of each link can only be done that way. That said, why is "spotlessly clean" even needed?

Yes, wax lubes are cleaner than wet lube but have to be applied much more frequently and particularly if you get caught in the rain or on wet roads.
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Old 02-02-23, 07:55 AM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
Mine would be. There should be no oily residues whatsoever on the outside of your chain.
what is you normal cleaning method , if you don't remove the chain?
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Old 02-02-23, 08:00 AM
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Awesomeguy there are volumes on this site written on chain life and chain cleaning, use the search function and any and all chain question will be answered.
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Old 02-02-23, 08:22 AM
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I try not to lube a wet chain. lately I've been using a little low pressure compressed air, here & there to help dry chains & derailleurs

fwiw I started using straw brushes on my chain. you need really skinny ones to get between the narrow links (or pipe cleaners). once you have a clean chain, occasional touchups may not require any liquids

fwiw I've noticed that if I wipe my chain in the direction of the chain, meaning along the length, also as-if I held a cloth stationary while pedaling, that there are spots immediately before & after the link that holds debris. I can only eliminate it by wiping perpendicular to the chain. those "pockets" can make a cleaning cloth show grime even after cleaning. meaning if something is coming off onto the cloth then it's still there on the chain. whether or not it matters, is up to you

Last edited by rumrunn6; 02-02-23 at 08:25 AM.
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Old 02-02-23, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Awesomeguy View Post
what is you normal cleaning method , if you don't remove the chain?
First, I don't soak my chain in lube like some folks here do, dipping it in 40-weight or whatever. I apply it very sparingly, and immediately wipe off the excess. Any oil on the outside of the chain is useless. So my chains aren't very dirty to begin with, and don't pick up a lot of dirt. I do remove my chain for a deep clean. The last time I did so, I put it in a Tupperware container with water and dish detergent and gave it a massive shaking. I used a brush to remove all the dirt and particulate matter I could see. A good degreaser will also work. Then I dry the chain. Reinstall, lube sparingly (I use Triflow), and again, pull the chain through a rag until it's clean. I want the oil on the inside, not the outside.

(An alleged pro mechanic here once challenged me to put my hand on the chain and crank backwards and see how dirty my hand got. Something I had not done, and, truthfully, made me have doubts as to what I would find. I took up his challenge, grasped the lower chain, and pedaled one revolution backwards. My hand was clean).
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Old 02-02-23, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by easyupbug View Post
Awesomeguy there are volumes on this site written on chain life and chain cleaning, use the search function and any and all chain question will be answered.
I haven't been able to find what i asked about specifcially, if you can , shoot me a link please
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Old 02-02-23, 09:13 AM
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OP, you are evidently new to cycling or at least to bike maintenance. I will not comment on what others say they do, because nothing good can come from it.

Here is what I do. I use a locally made lube called "ATB". It is a very thin wet lube. When I can hear the chain, which is about every 300-400 miles, I put the bike in the stand. I wet a rag with mineral spirits and I wipe it down 2-3 passes. Yes the rag is filthy and it goes straight into the trash. Then I put some more mineral spirits into a cup and use a toothbrush and scrub the links, catching the drippings with another rag. Some will get back into the cup and the fluid will turn black, so sometimes I will use a second cup of clean fluid but not always. I pour the used fluid into a bottle and in a few days, the gunk settles out and the remaining fluid can be used again. Anyway, I'll make 2 passes around the chain with the toothbrush, wipe it down, let it dry for a few hours, apply new lube, a drop on each bushing, let it dry a few hours, wipe it down. Is it ever perfectly clean? No. But it's good enough. I get at least 5000 miles on my chains that way.

Last edited by LarryMelman; 02-02-23 at 10:15 PM.
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Old 02-02-23, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Awesomeguy View Post
I haven't been able to find what i asked about specifcially, if you can , shoot me a link please
Click on Search in the blue bar above this, then click Advanced Search, then in Search by Keyword click Search Entire Posts and then click Search Titles Only and put Clean Chain in the box and you should get the 142 threads I see there when you search.
ďIf you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. If you teach a man to fish, you feed him for a lifetime.Ē
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Old 02-02-23, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Awesomeguy View Post
So , i've been told to lube the chain routinely. Espcially if you ride like i do , which is 70 miles per week. Should i be removing the chain each time to clean the chain?
Wet lube/dry lube - you will hear people that prefer both.

For me, with dry lube and riding 150 miles per week, the chain gets wiped down, sometimes with soapy water, and re lubed 2x per month +/-. My current chain has 3500+/- miles on it and has never been off the bike & the driveline stays very clean.

Wet lube, if you want squeaky clean - the chain will have to come off more often.
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Old 02-02-23, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by HillRider View Post
Yes, wax lubes are cleaner than wet lube but have to be applied much more frequently and particularly if you get caught in the rain or on wet roads.
As to the ďmuch more frequentĒ application, that has not been my experience. Wax based lubricants last around 700 miles which is similar to what oil based lubricants last. As for rain, you should refresh any lubricant after rain. Oil doesnít keep the water from the internals of the chain but it does mask the sound that any rusting that occurs would make.
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Old 02-02-23, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Awesomeguy View Post
I cleaned my bike yesterday , and in doing so, cleaned the cassette using a brush , and dipping the brush in a degreaser, then cleaning each ring, and same with the rear and front derailleur. I then Cleaned the chain using a degreaser, gave it a good rinse . However, when I run my chain through a cloth, I still get black gunk over the cloth, although the chain is visually clean.

Should the cloth be spotless prior to relubing the chain and derailleur pivots?
Donít use oil. Itís as simple as that. Lots of people say to keep the oil off the outside of the chain but oil flows which makes keeping it from flowing to the outside of the chain nearly impossible. If you donít want to clean your drivetrain all the time, avoid using oil.

These are pictures of what my drivetrain looks like all the time. I clean the chain once when I install it and donít clean it again until I dispose of it. Along with sealed bearings everywhere, I do so little maintenance on the 14 bikes in my garage (my 9, my wifeís 4 and my daughters one) that I have to volunteer to fix bikes.


IMG_1155 by Stuart Black, on Flickr
2013-07-26 08.06.29 by Stuart Black, on Flickr
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Old 02-02-23, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
Donít use oil. Itís as simple as that. Lots of people say to keep the oil off the outside of the chain but oil flows which makes keeping it from flowing to the outside of the chain nearly impossible. If you donít want to clean your drivetrain all the time, avoid using oil.

These are pictures of what my drivetrain looks like all the time. I clean the chain once when I install it and donít clean it again until I dispose of it. Along with sealed bearings everywhere, I do so little maintenance on the 14 bikes in my garage (my 9, my wifeís 4 and my daughters one) that I have to volunteer to fix bikes.


IMG_1155 by Stuart Black, on Flickr
2013-07-26 08.06.29 by Stuart Black, on Flickr
I own only one bike. Part of the reason, i don't want n+1, is because I like to keep my bikes in clean condition and the drivetrain to shift and run smooth and quiet. 14 bikes is impressive lol. Be hard to look after.
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Old 02-02-23, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Awesomeguy View Post
I own only one bike. Part of the reason, i don't want n+1, is because I like to keep my bikes in clean condition and the drivetrain to shift and run smooth and quiet. 14 bikes is impressive lol. Be hard to look after.
Itís no harder to look after 14 bikes than it is to look after one. Bicycles donít need as much cleaning and fiddling as many people think they do. As I said, I do almost zero maintenance on all those bikes because they donít need it. I donít really even wash them unless they are particularly dirtyÖand, for me, thatís very, very dirty. To my way of thinking this is a very sad bike.



This is a very happy bike.

IMG_1248 by Stuart Black, on Flickr

Dirt and mud and road grime are just patina that mean the bike gets used.
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Old 02-02-23, 11:37 AM
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Chain lube is a question of religion. FWIW, I don't belong to the Church of Surgical Cleanliness.

I generally use a "wet lube" aka oil. Wipe the chain down, oil it, wipe excess off. Repeat the wiping after the next ride. It usually lasts me 500 miles or more until the chain starts squeaking -- then it's time for re-lube.

My experience with wax has not been so salutary as some others'. I needed to re-wax after every rainy ride, and preferably when I got home, or the chain would rust. If I made a about 250 miles without rain, the chain would squeak, and I'd have to re-wax.

So pick your favorite, try it, see how it works. If you don't like it, change your routine.
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Old 02-02-23, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Jughed View Post
Oh and, wet lube is the devil. It's a product designed to pick up crap off the road and turn your drivetrain into sandpaper.
"Sandpaper" is a little harsh. Oil-based lubes, both wet and dry, are tacky (i.e., somewhat adhesive) and retain grit, sand, and other road debris, forming a fine grinding slurry; those who sharpen their own kitchen knives would know what I am referring to. The wet lubes just do this to a greater extent than the dry ones. In my limited experience, a waxed chain (via hot melt immersion wax) is the least tacky to the touch, compared to Muc Off Ceramic Dry, Rock N Roll Gold, Boeshield T-9, and Rock N Roll Blue. I have not tried any drip wax.

However, a waxed chain may be noisier than a chain lubricated with oil. I surmise that is because paraffin is solid, while oil stays liquid. In every waxed chain thread one or more people complain that a waxed chain does not stay lubricated as long as an oil-based chain. Assuming that the wax was properly applied (i.e., sufficiently degreased and dried beforehand), and the waxed chain is not used on a wet ride, to the extent that these complaints are purely based on sound, they may not be valid.

Now, of course, drivetrain cleanliness, longevity, and efficiency are not the be all and end all of cycling, so whatever!
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Old 02-07-23, 04:04 AM
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If cleaning is more therapy than chore for you, you'll want to remove the chain for a deep clean (eg, ultrasonic soak). If you don't want to remove the chain for deep cleaning then you'll need a chain cleaner tool, and even so it may not come out surgical clean if the rest of your drivetrain is still dirty (cassette, chainrings). The most "scalable" cleaning method in my opinion is the GCN 5-minute bike cleaning drill. That assumes you have access to an outdoor hose and you're not the OCD type.
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Old 02-07-23, 07:03 AM
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My method. Never clean the chain. Keep it lubed and ride until it's worn out. Then you clean the chainrings, cogs and derailleurs and install a new chain.
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Old 02-07-23, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by gearbasher View Post
My method. Never clean the chain. Keep it lubed and ride until it's worn out. Then you clean the chainrings, cogs and derailleurs and install a new chain.
Much the same here, although I'll wipe the chain off after lubing and after the next ride after re-lube. My chains seem to last as long that way as any other regime I've tried -- and I've tried a lot of them!
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Old 02-08-23, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by gearbasher View Post
My method. Never clean the chain. Keep it lubed and ride until it's worn out. Then you clean the chainrings, cogs and derailleurs and install a new chain.
For anyone reading who truly appreciates bikes, I would avoid this technique.
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Old 02-08-23, 08:24 AM
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Years ago, I would remove the chain (Wipperman Connex links make that easy to do). Shake in a plastic bottle 1/4 full of mineral spirits. Wipe down with a rag. Let it dry out for a day. Hang it up and relube, then wipe off the surface. I would get 3500 miles approx, with minimal wear/"stretch".

Now, it stays on the bike. I wipe off the chain with a rag dampened with mineral spirits, then relube. spin the crank a few times, wait a bit, then wipe off the outside completely.
It still lasts 3500 miles!

This shows black residue at the first ride, and the cassette isn't clean looking -- I do fold a paper towel or rag and do a simple cleaning with mineral spirits occasionally. Chainrings are easy to wipe down, so I do them quite often.
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