Kontact

But not the derailleur itself going into the spokes as Trakhak suggests.

79pmooney

I don't see the grime from a chain on the spokes around the breaks. Not do those breaks look like that sawing of a chain. The chain is sitting rather nicely in the middle of the cassette. (Yes, it could have been moved there after.)

My vote is for something like a stick getting picked up by the spokes, hitting and puling the RD back and up while breaking the spokes. That this had nothing to do with the work done recently. (I don't see evidence of the chain coming off or the cage being twisted into the spokes, usual end result of overshifting or hanger issues.)

A tool falling out of a jersey pocket or tool bag?

flanso 

Larry, perhaps the LBS will share some of the burden of the repair. To some here: try to be civil. For me: I'm going to retain my dorky looking spoke protector.

shelbyfv

Why would they?

Chuck M 

Perhaps for you. But I have a couple of 40 plus year old regular riders that don't have that kind of damage. Bikes and components given proper care and maintenance will last longer than the riders.

maddog34

Hi Larry.. best to just stand back and watch our resident Trolls pick each other apart... i'd suspect that you dropped the bike when you got back to your house to get whatever you forgot... the derailleur hanger got bent at that time and.. the pics show the typical results of a bent der. hanger and a chain wedged into flat bladed spokes.... ouchy!

best guess is that the shop will say almost exactly what i have. Are you right or left handed? right handed folks usually dismount to the left... the bike is then usually dropped away from the rider... we've all bent a der. hanger at some time. The ensuing failures hurt much worse during a race, btw.

I hope your FRAME wasn't mangled up too badly... plan on a new Derailleur and hanger along with the wheel repair or replacement....

Tip:higher spoke counts and good ol' round j-bend spokes are usually more resilient when the chain meets them...

The Trolls can now resume showing each other up.

79pmooney

Yes! Also, Larry, go with regular crossed spokes. And - buy only wheels where the drive side rear spokes are "inside pulling". Inside pulling - the spokes that come out of the hub flange aimed at the middle of the wheel, not out, look like they are being dragged along by the hub as the wheel turns. Or - looking at the wheel from the derailleur side, the spokes at the top of the flange that you see the heads of are pointed back.

The reason for this is that an inside pulling wheel will do its best to kick the chain out (and sticks or other items) when you drop them between the cassette and spokes. This was "the word" when I worked at a shop in Cambridge, MA in my racing days that the to become famous Sheldon Brown used to hang at late in the afternoon. I heard this from both our mechanic and Sheldon. Since then, I have looked at every chain overthrow to the inside to assess both damage and which way the wheel was laced. Yes, yo can do more damage inside pulling if you work at it than an alert rider can get away with outside pulling, But, rider responses equal, inside pulling is always a lot less damage (to both bike and rider).

Now, I can only relate to inside pulling chain drops for myself but that is simply because all but a used wheel or two I've ridden since 1977 have bee inside pulling. (And those outside pulling wheels get re-laced at first opportunity.)

And go with wheels with 32 or more spokes. Won't slow you down much and will do far better when the s*** hits the fan.

Kontact

You musr be seeing something I'm not. Just a rub mark.

Chuck M 

It is overall dirtier than what I would expect a less than 100 mile $500 tune to be. By the way, my derailleurs don't have marks from rubbing either.

SoSmellyAir

Good luck LarrySellerz finding replacement straight pull spokes for Mavic wheels.

Kontact

Then you are fortunate enough to never lock your bike to a rack, haul it up stairs, etc.

Many of my derailleurs have small marks, and I haven't dropped or crashed any of them. It is just a high point that tends to hang up on stuff.

smd4

Where did you hear that??

And no, not all of us have ever bent a derailleur hanger.

LarrySellerz

the hill maxes out at 20% I suspect something went amiss during the initial downshift because I had to do it quicker than normal. Once I got to the top and stopped applying so much force to the pedals the derailleur was able to complete it’s final click or something and derail the chain.

like you know when you try to shift under load and the forces involved keep the chain in the same gear anyways? I think that was a contributing factor. I have a video but it’s impossible to post those on bike forums

smd4

You can consider me “fortunate” too. Although maybe “careful” is the more accurate term.

I routinely carry my bike up/down stairs. I would never lock my bike to a bike rack. My RD doesn’t have scratches either.

LarrySellerz

I posted a video of my wheel and my story in a local racing facebook group and someone in that group who works at sports basement got in touch with me to try and make it right. Small world.

zandoval 

This is the bailiwick of the infamous...

Dork Disk!

Yep... One of those first things ya remove when ya get your new bike if it comes with one.
I have one on two of my bikes set up for light gravel and simple through the pine trees single track. After having to re-lace two wheels because of damaged spokes I put new Dork Disks on. A couple of people have given me some comments about um but no one with real experience or that works on their own bike.

Man... Sure glad you are OK... This could have been real bad!

esasjl

I wonder if the wheel is strongly dished and the combination of bladed spokes, very high tension, and minimal gap between big sprocket and spokes makes the wheel vulnerable.

smd4

It’s more likely that Larry just abuses his bikes more than anyone else on this forum.

Kontact

What does that even mean? That his spokes were cut because he shifted too hard, or because he doesn't oil his chain enough?

smd4

It speaks for itself.

Do yourself a favor and read Larry’s other posts. He’s a constant victim, kicks his bikes to make them shift, abuses or otherwise doesn’t know how to use his components, flaunts laws and probably should not be riding a bike more complex than a single speed coaster brake.

Oh, and I bet his chain has far too much oil.

Kontact

Larry is always up front with what happened. He described what happened here and it doesn't include dropping his bike on the derailleur.

Diagnosing mechanical problems is incompatible with character assassination. If you aren't interested in what happened to the bike, why post in the bike mechanics forum?

smd4

Calling ‘em as I see ‘em isn’t “character assassination.” Larry abuses his bikes and is responsible for many of his mechanical problems. This is my mechanical diagnosis.

I’m not the one who said he dropped his bike. Although that would be his MO.

LarrySellerz

took the bike to an expert who thought the limit screw wasn’t adjusted. Took it to the store that did the repair and they took a closer look at claim it was my fault. At that point I didn’t want to argue and just wanted it fixed so I’m paying out of pocket for them to fix it.

kinda of think it’s BS because I was gentle with that bike and don’t see myself bending the derailleur, but I also used the full range of gears extensively so I suppose I would have noticed if it was off by an entire “click.” The bike shop says once they fix the wheel they will see if the shifter was off by an entire click (I don’t know if I’m describing this well sorry) to help determine fault but I think they told me that not expecting to see anything.

kind of skeptical that the test the store is talking about doing would be conclusive to say they adjusted the derailleur, but I don’t know enough about bikes to argue.

This happened on a hill and it took like 25 feet for me to stop, with the rear wheel getting hammered the whole time. Any forensic clues could easily be destroyed during that.

whats done is done, I’m out $$. Guy claims he can relace the wheel and is ordering spokes lol

Amt0571

Slightly out of tune limit screw or bent RD combined with a bump and/or shifting lots of gears at once carelessly can lead to this. I've had this happen once, fortunately at low speed and at the door of my house. Since it was low speed, nothing broke, but I had to remove the cassette to free the chain, wedged between the cassette and the hub. In my case it was my fault since I didn't adjust the RD well enough.

Dork discs, that we all hate and nobody uses (including myself), were designed to avoid exactly this.

I had always wondered what would happen if this happened at speed. Now I know.

shelbyfv

Sounds like an appropriate resolution. Ask them to install a dork disc while they're at it. Might even be free.