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Campy Ekar Adapter and other 13s questions.

Old 03-19-23, 03:03 PM
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rosefarts
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Campy Ekar Adapter and other 13s questions.

I know Iím going to get ripped for this. Most BFers seem angry that anyone ever went higher than 8 speed and doubly angry that triples went out of style (triply?).

That said. I donít quite like how my 10-44 11 speed works out on my gravel bike. Itís a bit jumpy. This is a standard SRAM 10-42 where the 42 has been replaced by a 44. Iíve posted about not quite being elated about this before. Especially in the higher gears.

The new SRAM XPLR has a 10-44 12 speed but is XDr and in my case would require a new rear hub, there isnít an XDr driver available for it.

E-thirteen makes a 9-45 which would actually make the high gear annoyances worse.

Enter Campagnolo and the reason for this post. Ekar has a 13 speed 10-44 which is about as ideal as mathematically possible. Then I heard about this https://www.jensonusa.com/Campagnolo-N3W-Freehub-Driver-Body-Adapter

If Iím reading correctly, I can put a standard Campy driver on my hub, which is relatively easy and affordable, and this adapter and bam I can mount 13 cogs of Italian lust to my hub.

Really? Is that a misprint? Is it really that simple? Iíll order all the ingredients this afternoon if thatís true.

I can already hear you screaming Chain! Shifters! Derailleur! Chainring! Wonít somebody please tell him about cable pull!

I run the Archer Trail D1x shift thingy on my bike. So Iíll definitely need a new chain. Iíve read that my current NW ring will work with some minor modifications (filing of the wider teeth).

Iíll just need to back out the stops and reprogram the Archer. The XT derailleur should be more than sufficient in this situation.

Am I way out there? Seems deceptively simple.
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Old 03-19-23, 03:14 PM
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That's a piece that fits on an Ekar driver so you can install normal Campy cassettes. It only works on the Campy Ekar equivalent of XDR, if you have that already. It won't turn any other freehub body/driver into something else.
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Old 03-19-23, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
That's a piece that fits on an Ekar driver so you can install normal Campy cassettes. It only works on the Campy Ekar equivalent of XDR, if you have that already. It won't turn any other freehub body/driver into something else.

That makes more sense. But this line from Jenson

ďWith the release of their new 13-speed Ekar groupset Campagnolo have gone ahead and done something thatís rarely seen in the drivetrain world. Theyíve released the N3W freehub adapter which allows riders to convert their 10, 11, and 12-speed freehubs to be compatible with the new 13-speed Ekar groupset.Ē

Sounds like if youíve got a wheel that is Campy compatible at least 10 speed, that the adapter will work for the cassette.


Seems super unlikely and the reason I asked. Afterall, a 10-11 and some 12 speed Campy equipped bikes would be rim brakes. So to swap an old bike to a system that only uses an integrated hydro Ergo shifter is impossible unless you have something goofy like I have.
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Old 03-19-23, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by rosefarts View Post
That makes more sense. But this line from Jenson

ďWith the release of their new 13-speed Ekar groupset Campagnolo have gone ahead and done something thatís rarely seen in the drivetrain world. Theyíve released the N3W freehub adapter which allows riders to convert their 10, 11, and 12-speed freehubs to be compatible with the new 13-speed Ekar groupset.Ē

Sounds like if youíve got a wheel that is Campy compatible at least 10 speed, that the adapter will work for the cassette.


Seems super unlikely and the reason I asked. Afterall, a 10-11 and some 12 speed Campy equipped bikes would be rim brakes. So to swap an old bike to a system that only uses an integrated hydro Ergo shifter is impossible unless you have something goofy like I have.
Not quite.

If you have a Campy hub, you can get an Ekar freehub body for it and still re-mount a Campy 10,11 or 12 using this adapter. If you have an Ekar hub, this adapter will work to allow you to mount the older type cassette as well.

If you have an aftermarket Campy compatible hub, you can't put a Campy brand freehub on it of any kind. The only other possibility is if you have an aftermarket Ekar freehub, this device might adapt it to regular Campy cassettes.

This adapter extends the splines on an Ekar driver so the 3 smallest sprockets have something to fit onto.
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Old 03-19-23, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
Not quite.

If you have a Campy hub, you can get an Ekar freehub body for it and still re-mount a Campy 10,11 or 12 using this adapter. If you have an Ekar hub, this adapter will work to allow you to mount the older type cassette as well.

If you have an aftermarket Campy compatible hub, you can't put a Campy brand freehub on it of any kind. The only other possibility is if you have an aftermarket Ekar freehub, this device might adapt it to regular Campy cassettes.

This adapter extends the splines on an Ekar driver so the 3 smallest sprockets have something to fit onto.
I really wish people like you wrote the ads for stuff like this.

Not a big deal, Iím in exactly the same position as I was like an hour ago.

Its interesting that it only works for genuine campy parts.

Bitex makes a n3w driver. Next time I need to replace my tire, I may rebuild the wheel and follow this rabbit hole then.
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Old 03-19-23, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by rosefarts View Post
I really wish people like you wrote the ads for stuff like this.

Not a big deal, Iím in exactly the same position as I was like an hour ago.

Its interesting that it only works for genuine campy parts.

Bitex makes a n3w driver. Next time I need to replace my tire, I may rebuild the wheel and follow this rabbit hole then.
Like I said, the adapter itself might work on an aftermarket driver for Ekar. I don't know. White Industries might know.

But if you mean the Campy freehub/driver itself, no one really makes freehubs that work on other brands of hubs. The internal design of the freehub is an important part of the overall design of the hub. You can't take a Shimano brand freehub and put it on a Chris King hub.
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Old 03-19-23, 06:05 PM
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Yeah, I wasnít expecting to cross brands.

I currently have a Stanís 3.30 hub on my rear wheel. A standard (not n3w) Campy freehub is available for it. Jenson made it sound like I could use this and the adapter then mount an Ekar cassette.

After you clarified, it sounds like they meant you can swap older Campy cassetteís onto your new campy wheels.

This is for the guy riding a gravel bike equipped with Ekar but would occasionally like to use this wheel on his 12s Record equipped road bike.

Makes a little bit of sense but that level of backwards compatibility (over 20 years for the 10 speed) is a bit confusing. QR vs Thru Axle and Rim Brakes vs Disc. Not sure what the market is for that.
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Old 03-19-23, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by rosefarts View Post
I know Iím going to get ripped for this. Most BFers seem angry that anyone ever went higher than 8 speed and doubly angry that triples went out of style (triply?)....
Hard to read past something like this.
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Old 03-19-23, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Camilo View Post
Hard to read past something like this.
Lets call it the retrogrouch filter.
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Old 03-20-23, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by rosefarts View Post
Yeah, I wasnít expecting to cross brands.

I currently have a Stanís 3.30 hub on my rear wheel. A standard (not n3w) Campy freehub is available for it. Jenson made it sound like I could use this and the adapter then mount an Ekar cassette.

After you clarified, it sounds like they meant you can swap older Campy cassetteís onto your new campy wheels.

This is for the guy riding a gravel bike equipped with Ekar but would occasionally like to use this wheel on his 12s Record equipped road bike.

Makes a little bit of sense but that level of backwards compatibility (over 20 years for the 10 speed) is a bit confusing. QR vs Thru Axle and Rim Brakes vs Disc. Not sure what the market is for that.
It helps if you think of the N3W body as a 2-piece split standard body. So you effectively shorten it when using Ekar cassettes without the adaptor (since the smallest gear overhangs the end of the body) and fit the adaptor to make it a standard body length when using older cassettes. Obviously you can't shorten a standard body to fit an Ekar cassette. So only the N3W will work with 13T Ekar cassettes.
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Old 04-07-23, 06:14 PM
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Is there a place in the US to order from Ratio?. Specifically, I canít get this little brainworm out with the 13s Ekar and Archer shifter.

Ratio makes a compatible chainring that will bolt right onto the SRAM cranks I already have. As near as I can tell, they are the only ones that do aside from Campy.

Shipping and duties could add up.
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Old 04-10-23, 03:32 PM
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as always in these cases....matching from the same company and group is advised, most any other mix and match kludge returns less the optimum performance.

some one has to be Mr. Obvious
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Old 04-10-23, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by squirtdad View Post
as always in these cases....matching from the same company and group is advised, most any other mix and match kludge returns less the optimum performance.

some one has to be Mr. Obvious
But not Mr. Useful. If youíre looking for a kludge, keep reading.

I have heard, though not personally confirmed that a SRAM flat-top chain will work. Itís wider on the inside but has the same outside width. This was discovered by people who want to use an Oval on Ekar.

The Archer Trail I have is capable up to 14 speeds.

There is even a video online of someone using an Archer Trail and combining an Ekar 9-36 with a 42t extended cog. For a 14 speed 9-42. Using a flat-top it seems to shift fine. He uses an 11 speed chainring.

Im not interested in a 9 tooth cog for perceived reasons probably more than math. So Iíll keep it to 10-44 in 13 speed but watching that video, Iím pretty confident itíll work.

So this is going to be, if I go ahead and do it, from front to back; SRAM Force crank, Wolftooth Oval ring, Campy Ekar Cassette, and an XT derailleur. All being controlled wirelessly with my Archer shifters. Kludge that.

It very well might shift better than the OEM all Ekar system, due to the nature of cable actuation through 13 speeds vs electronic controls.

Last edited by rosefarts; 04-10-23 at 04:37 PM.
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Old 04-10-23, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by rosefarts View Post
But not Mr. Useful. If youíre looking for a kludge, keep reading.

I have heard, though not personally confirmed that a SRAM flat-top chain will work. Itís wider on the inside but has the same outside width. This was discovered by people who want to use an Oval on Ekar.

The Archer Trail I have is capable up to 14 speeds.

There is even a video online of someone using an Archer Trail and combining an Ekar 9-36 with a 42t extended cog. For a 14 speed 9-42. Using a flat-top it seems to shift fine. He uses an 11 speed chainring.

Im not interested in a 9 tooth cog for perceived reasons probably more than math. So Iíll keep it to 10-44 in 13 speed but watching that video, Iím pretty confident itíll work.

So this is going to be, if I go ahead and do it, from front to back; SRAM Force crank, Wolftooth Oval ring, Campy Ekar Cassette, and an XT derailleur. All being controlled wirelessly with my Archer shifters. Kludge that.

It very well might shift better than the OEM all Ekar system, due to the nature of cable actuation through 13 speeds vs electronic controls.
Good luck,

at least I didn't say to to a triple
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Old 04-12-23, 08:33 AM
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I pulled the trigger. Who is ready to learn at my expense?

Using information from this video

In that video he machines out a 42t extender to fit onto a 9-36. I opted to stay away from that design because using a smaller chainring (38 vs 42) just has you pedaling on smaller bits with slightly higher percentage jumps between. That and I donít see myself machining out an extender ring, correctly.

As mentioned earlier, Iím satisfied with the 10-44 11sp, just wish that there was a little room to spin in between top and bottom. So Campy Ekar 10-44 is on the way.

I do need a new hub since my STANís doesnít take a N3W driver. Bitex to the rescue, Iíve been impressed with their quality for price in the past, and this one is going to red. Iíll probably rebuild the wheel immediately since the gravel bike sat through a pretty brutal winter in the garage, and itís probably due to get the solid sealant pool cleaned. Almost certain that I can reuse my existing spokes.

It is center mount. Iíll use this as an excuse to move from 140 to 160 because I found the adapter cleaning out my shelves the other day. I know just who to ask which new rotor to get.

The video claims that a basic SRAM flat top chain will do, with no need to monkey with my chainrings or pulleys. File that under ďIíll find out once itís doneĒ. There is another option I read about where someone carefully dremeled the wide teeth to slightly narrower and it worked with a 13sp chain. I havenít decided if thatís my plan B or buying the aftermarket 13sp ring is.

Due to the weight of my higher end Sram cassette and the campy steel 10-44, this wonít be a weight loss adventure, probably a half pound gain. I am ok with to that.
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Old 04-19-23, 06:56 PM
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Mods, can you consider updating the thread title to something like ďCampy Ekar e-shifting updateĒ or something like that.

So Iíve done it.

I rebuilt the Stanís Crest rim with the Bitex 106R with a N3W driver. That went smoothly, Ďcept I didnít get the parallels on the valve hole. I rarely do. The wheel is dished and true, using zip ties and lawn toys as a makeshift dish tool.

My mind was a little blown when I tightened on the new centerlock rotor and it fit perfectly. It doesnít rub at all. I figured Iíd have to fiddle a little.

Now weíre to the fiddly part. That 13 speed Ekar cassette is held together by 5 fat bolts. They were rubbing on the spokes. The smallest spacer in the bike shop was 1mm and too thick. I couldnít thread the lock ring on with it.

So what felt like hours of filing each bolt head thinner and checking a lot finally bore fruit. I got the cassette mounted and no rubbing. Gah!! My dremel tool is in storage along with most of my other tools a few states away, so this felt epic.

More fiddling. The 11 speed XT derailleur top pulley doesnít fit the SRAM flat top that this setup uses. I had a Rival derailleur I was thinking of giving away, and low and behold, the top pulley from it fits. A little switcheroo and it all worked. I backed out my upper and lower limit screws and fired up the Trail D1x.

The Archer Trail D1x is a pretty brilliant system. The app on my phone lets me choose up to 14 speeds. I chose 13 and pedaled through, adjusting and micro adjusting each gear as I went. Itís very easy really. Once I was satisfied, itís easy, disconnect from the app and the wireless controller on my brakes takes over. Works perfectly. It actually is quieter and smoother than Iíd expected considering the mish mash of components.

Lets break that down.

Wolftooth 11/12 42t Oval chainring
Sram Flattop chain
Campy Ekar 10-44 cassette
11s XT rear derailleur sporting a Rival 11s top pulley.

Frickin brilliant!!

Some pics, Iíll remount the tire tomorrow and do the whole tubeless tire retrue/retension thing then.

Itís hard to see this shifter in this light. Iíve posted pics of it before somewhere.


Rawr

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