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Need help w/ Shimano 333 3 speed hub

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Need help w/ Shimano 333 3 speed hub

Old 12-14-06, 12:02 AM
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TimJ
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Need help w/ Shimano 333 3 speed hub

I took apart a 333, 3 speed hub and can't get it working again. I found an exploded schematic for it and everything appears to be put back together how it should be but the sprocket won't engage and it won't shift.

These first couple pictures show the sprocket assembly and in particular the little springs for the... flippy deals. I don't know what they're called, but the 4 little things that swing out- these engage the hub, right? As you can see, the springs are bent. I put the hub back together, with the springs bent back to how they're supposed to be, and if I turn the sprocket in reverse, the hub just clicks and sounds fine. If I turn the sprocket forward, it doesn't engage, kind of turs with a grating sound, and the springs come out bent.



I don't know what's going on here. My guess would be maybe the sprocket assembly isn't completely seated and the flippy deals simply can't grab where they're supposed to- but I don't know.



This photo shows the axle. The little pins worked loose and I don't know if I'm putting them in correctly. The orientation here seems to be correct from the schematic I have- the shorter one next to the gearing with the notches facing eachother. But I don't know how they should seat properly. Again, I can get the hub back together as if it's correct- everything fits, but basically I just sort of put the pins in and lower into the hub and kind of feel around till it fits.



See I only took off the sprocket assembly and then the cone on the other side, and then the pins worked loose so the axle came out. I didn't completely dissassemble it. All I need to know is how to get these parts I took apart back together correctly. Any knowledgable help would be appreciated.

Last edited by TimJ; 12-14-06 at 11:24 AM.
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Old 12-14-06, 12:55 PM
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No one? No one at all?

Fingers crossed...
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Old 12-14-06, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by TimJ
I took apart a 333, 3 speed hub and can't get it working again. I found an exploded schematic for it and everything appears to be put back together how it should be but the sprocket won't engage and it won't shift.
See: http://sheldonbrown.com/333

Sheldon "Call Dr. Kevorkian" Brown
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|  The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing.  | 
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Old 12-14-06, 01:37 PM
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I've read that page before, actually. Come on, no advice except "avoid it"? It's too late for that. The bike in question is this adorable woman's bike in dark green with fenders and a front rack and a headbadge featuring a black panther. That's the brand, or name, of the bike- Panther. It's freaking adorable, and would make a super-cool roundabout town bike for some hipster cutie. The bike was an inexpensive department store bike but was hardly ever ridden and the hub is in perfect condition. Well, was until I took it apart.

I ain't giving up, I tore this bike completely apart- cottered crankset and all- I need to rebuild this hub!
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Old 12-14-06, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by TimJ
I've read that page before, actually. Come on, no advice except "avoid it"? It's too late for that. The bike in question is this adorable woman's bike in dark green with fenders and a front rack and a headbadge featuring a black panther. That's the brand, or name, of the bike- Panther. It's freaking adorable, and would make a super-cool roundabout town bike for some hipster cutie. The bike was an inexpensive department store bike but was hardly ever ridden and the hub is in perfect condition. Well, was until I took it apart.

I ain't giving up, I tore this bike completely apart- cottered crankset and all- I need to rebuild this hub!
Why not just look for an old beater with a functional SA three speed hub and harvest the wheel from it? I bet you can get one cheap and end up with a better hub.
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Old 12-14-06, 01:46 PM
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Because I want to put this perfectly preserved hub back together correctly, that's why.
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Old 12-14-06, 02:14 PM
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Buy a new one for $22.00?
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-SHIMANO-3-3-...QQcmdZViewItem

I still have and ride my old late 60's bike with the Shimano 3-speed, but never had a reason to take it apart and it's still going strong. Only needed to add oil in the hub after all these years and miles. Sorry...no help here.

Might be better to just replace/update the hub with a more modern design...with more gears/speeds. Here's an "unused/open box" Shimano Nexus 7-Speed on eBay, includes the shifter and cables, etc
http://cgi.ebay.com/Shimano-Nexus-7-...QQcmdZViewItem
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Old 12-14-06, 05:58 PM
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I don't think you're going to have much luck in finding someone who knows how to fix it. These Shimano hubs are fiendishly complicated, and there were a number of poorly documented changes to the inner workings thereof. But then, you know that if you've read Sheldon Brown's page on them. I would say that your best bet is to take the thing apart and put it back together again, see if that works. If it doesn't... honestly, who cares if the hub is perfectly preserved? It's still a junky hub (why did you take it apart if it was in good shape?). You'd seriously be better off with finding a Sturmey-Archer AW or other 3-speed hub to replace it. Other than that, I think the best advice that you'll get is "try, try again."
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Old 12-14-06, 06:19 PM
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I bailed out of trying to fix a recently acquired Shimano 333 hub for the same reason. I'm nearly done overhauling a 3-speed SA hub that will take its place on the bike.
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Old 12-14-06, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by TimJ
Because I want to put this perfectly preserved hub back together correctly, that's why.
Sheldon already gave you sensible advice about this POS hub, Fuggedaboutit! But you don't wanna, so my advice:
Well then; just do it!
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Old 12-14-06, 09:08 PM
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My neighbor had a copy of "Glenn's Complete Bicycle Book" (by Clarence W. Coles and Harold T. Glenn; published by Crown Publishers) from the 1970s. THis has a very detailed procedure how to disassemble and reassemble the Shimano 333 hub. I used it for this very purpose.

I took it apart b/c the pawls "fingers" had developed burrs and were sticking instead of swinging loose and engaging I simply filed down the burrs and then rebuilt the hub. I suspect I was very lucky.

Last edited by grayvw; 12-14-06 at 09:18 PM.
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Old 12-14-06, 10:54 PM
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I fixed it.

It actually was very logical how it all went back together once I sat down and just seriously studied it. The first thing was the sprocket and pawl assembly (I learned the flippy things are the pawls), I was putting it in with the pawls under no tension. I realized it didn't make any sense, they had to engage the sides of the hub so of course they had to stick out- the springs are there to push the pawls out, not hold them in- duh. Second was the pins. I couldn't figure out where they went in the hub and then I realized there was a bottleneck inside and one side was smaller than the other. The pins are there to grip the bottleneck and move it, so obviously the smaller pin was meant to fit against the smaller side and vice versa. It was a little tricky but once I got it that was it.

It runs beautifully now!
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Old 12-15-06, 01:42 PM
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Congrats! Sometimes the naysayers are right, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't try!
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Old 12-17-06, 01:26 PM
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I was just trying to fix my friends with not much luck. I took it apart and noticed the push rod doesn't seem to be pushing out enough. Any ideas? Is it dead?
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Old 12-17-06, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by christiank
I was just trying to fix my friends with not much luck. I took it apart and noticed the push rod doesn't seem to be pushing out enough. Any ideas? Is it dead?
The push rod pushes against the little pins which grip the cyclinder inside the hub that the pawls grab onto to turn the sprocket. So the push rod moves in accordance with all that jazz. If it's not coming out far enough maybe the spring on the opposite side is weak or busted, maybe the cyclinder inside the hub is busted somehow so it can't move fully, or maybe one or both of the pins fell out of place so the rod isn't hitting them properly.

I dunno, but the rod doesn't come out all that far. When I finished up I realized the key to adjusting the hub was just making sure the cable was under tension when the rear... uh, doohicky that the rod pushes out says "N". You're pushing the rod in when going to low and letting it out going up to high, if it can push it up to high then that's enough.
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Old 04-30-07, 12:26 PM
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TimJ, could you please go into more detail about how you placed the sliding keys into the gear hub? Thanks a lot.
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Old 04-30-07, 12:41 PM
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Please correct me if Im wrong. The smaller sliding key gets placed in the axel on the brake arm side. The larger sliding key gets placed in the axel on the gear side. If this is true, how did you get the sliding keys into the correct positions? Did you use any tools ect.? How tight did you turn the nuts when you were done assembling? Thanks in advance for all your help.
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