Cacti Dodger

This is my first posting and I am probably not your regular poster. got here trying to google my way into solving a rather frustrating problem i have with getting too many flat tires.

I work in the horn of africa at the moment away from bike shops and other first world luxury. Even pumping up a presta valve is a logistical nightmare and fixing a tire involves a razor-blade, an old car tube and some crude glue. I have a 24" trek 4400 frame with 26" bontrager wheels, bought in asia a few years ago which i have been riding without majour problems around south-east asia in wet, muddy, swampy terrain.

enter the horn of africa: unbearable temperatures, rough sand, and many many cacti. I went out on two rides and had no less than six punctures. to make everything worse, i can't change the tubes (my rims are made for presta valve and around here i can only buy tubes with the thick car-valves, so they won't fit my rims). I am very frustrated as any ride requires huge logistics (support car, protection etc) and after all the hassle i have to stop ten minutes into the ride because of a cactus.

The question:
Is there any product out there (tube, tire, etc) that i could buy, preferably online (i could have it ordered in the states or in europe and then forwarded here) that would be:
- rugged enough to last in such landscape
- low-maintenance
- long lasting

of course it should fit my available system - bontrager rims - as i cannot change the rims here.

i've googled around and i heard people talking about solid tires, semi-pneumatic tires, foam tubes and other gimmicks. i no nothing about any of these products but have obviously reached a point where i should learn.

i understand that any such product would be heavier and it would handle different than the normal tire. I don't race so i don't really care about loss in performance or handling on wet terrain (this is the desert, not much rain here anyway). Also, if it would be reliable enough i don't really care if it is more expensive or ugly or whatever. I'd just like it to work by dealing with those tough cacti out in the desert.

thanks
cacti dodger

z415

I don't have enough experience to give you direct suggestions but I can tell you that long lasting tires should have a hard rubber compound so look for something 65-75sA. I doubt you would need soft rubber to get traction in sand, but you would definitely need wide tires. If you get too wide, it won't fit correctly in your frame so I would not suggest getting anything over 2.3". Other BF users might be able to give you a definitive max. size.

Consider some of these products: https://www.slimesealant.com/bike/index.php

I personally use the Slime tire liners and they work - I once have a thumb tack in my tire and it did not puncture. I would suggest that you use two or more liners if you decide to go that route. You might also consider getting tools and repair kits.

Also, I would suggest a foldable tire (aramid/kevlar bead) which is usually a performance upgrade (it is lighter, and thus faster) but it is also easier to dismount and remount because the beads that hook into the rim are bendable and pliable. I cant mount an aramid bead tire without tools. I also believe that there are kevlar belted tires, which prevents punctures.

awc380

Schwalbe Marathon XR.

Cyclist0383

Check out the Schwalbe Marathon XR or Plus.

The following site ships world wide.
https://bike-components.de/catalog/de...da481ee0948c8e

EDIT: You might also want to try Mr Tuffy tire liners.
https://www.mrtuffy.com/about.htm

well biked

Stan's No Tubes system. I don't know if you can get this where you are or not, and if you do get it you will need access to an air compressor to do the initial inflation. You can use a presta-shraeder adapter to inflate, so that's no problem. Once inflated, you can use a hand pump to top off the air pressure occasionally as needed. You can use most any fat mtb tires, and you'll elminate tubes from the equation all together. You'll need to measure the width of your rims to make sure you get the right kit. With all that said, if you use the Stan's No Tubes System, you will eliminate flats entirely, and will be able to still use conventional mtb tires.

I've used it for several years now, and after thousands of off road miles I've NEVER had a flat with it. Puncture flats from thorns or other sharp objects and pinch flats (if you like to run low pressure) will be a thing of the past. Here's the link: https://www.notubes.com/ This is not a gimmick, it works-

jbhowat

I've actually faced a similar problem with my buddy. He was tired of constant flats and wanted to be flat-free basically at any expense. I've also been to similar areas and thus I know what you're dealing with as far as resources go - not much.

I would first find somebody with a drill and bits. Go buy one of the Schraeder (those are the car-type valves) tubes. Find a bit that will be the perfect size and enlarge the hole on your Bontragers. It is better to make it too small and have to file or go a bit larger than to make it too large (obviously).

My friend has taken car hose (as in, radiator/heater, depending on the size of your tire). Cut it in half or a bit less than half and put in on the inside of your tire. You'll have to be careful getting everything mounted right, but nothing will penetrate that rubber. It will ride fairly ****ty though on-road and your tire/wheel weight will be probably doubled.

At least drill out your rims so you can get tubes...

Cacti Dodger

jbhowat, i like the radiator hose idea and i think that will be my best option at this point, at least temporary until i procure some more hi tech solution such as that stan tubeless thing (which actually sounds a bit too good to be true but what the hell, i'm ready to try it out). the radiator hose sounds like the kind of not-too subtle solution that may very well work in this environment.

i'm just worried that the tube will not fit in anymore after i lined the tire with radiator hose - but certainly worth a try. will head to teh market in the afternoon to get some hose.

about drilling my rims, i tell you i am a bit reluctant to do it. they are my only rims and if i screw them up i'm done for. i'd rather buy loads of presta valve tubes online and have them delivered here somewhow and get a presta-schreder adaptor. and then maybe on a trip to europe or dubai i'll just buy some new rims and then i can start fooling around.

will report on the hose prohject shortly. thanks

Cyclist0383

^^^^

You might want to rethink the Stans Tubeless system. While they might work, if you ever need any sort of replacement parts, or ever have trouble with it, you will be SOL. With a standard tire you know it can always be dealt with on the spot.

Cyclist0383

From the Stans Site:

Stan's Tire and Rim Sealant will usually last from three weeks up to three months. At that time you simply add more. (Time will vary due to different tire characteristics). It leaves no mess in your tire.

https://www.notubes.com/tubeless_about.php

well biked

I'm not sure if you're addressing me or the OP. Regardless, as I stated I've used the Stan's system for several years and thousands of miles, never a flat. For the type of problem the OP is having (riding in an area where the terrain is causing numerous flats), the Stan's system is absolutely the best solution, you can puncture the tire over and over and the sealant will seal it, usually before you even realize the tire was punctured. You just keep riding. If you need to add air at any time, you just use a hand pump like any other situation, although if the presta-shraeder issue is a problem then an adapter would be necessary because the Stan's rim strips only come with presta. As for your statement "with a standard tire you know it can be dealt with on the spot," I think that was the OP's whole point, he's using standard tires and tubes and he's getting so many flats he can't deal with it on the spot. And to clarify, you do use standard tires with the Stan's system, you just don't use inner tubes. The tires I can think of off the top of my head that I've used with the Stan's sytem: Hutchinson Python Air Lights, Panaracer Fire XC, Panaracer Trailblasters, WTB Motoraptors, and WTB Mutanoraptors.

As I stated also, there may be a problem with the location of the OP and getting the product, but if not, I think it would be the way to go if riding and not worrying about flats is a priority. It would be a good idea, particularly in the OP's situation, to buy an extra container of sealant, since replacements might be hard to come by. A quart of sealant will last for years, I'm still using out of my first quart. I've gone for as long as a year without adding sealant (but I add slightly more than the recommended 2 oz. with each application). Also, as I noted earlier, an air compressor is needed for the initial inflation of the tires, but once that's done you simply top off the pressure with a hand pump like any other tire. Initial inflation is indeed a little tricky (Stan has an installation video on his site), but once you've done it and understand it, it's no problem and is actually kind of fun.

I went mountain biking on my Stan's equipped bike yesterday on trails where shale rock is prevalent, with sharp blades of the stuff sticking up edge-wise. I've sliced tires numerous times on these trails, had many flats there (before I used Stan's), and I know people who won't ride there because it tears up tires so badly (even though it's a lot of fun to ride these trails!). I've even torn sections of rubber off my tires when riding in this area, but still, since installing the Stan's system, never a flat. I do realize the Stan's system isn't for everybody, but for a problem like the OP's, it's the one solution that should eliminate flats altogether. I recommend the Stan's system because I know it works, it's truly amazing stuff-

Cyclist0383

While it might work my experience with proprietary products in places without a distributorship has lead me to the conclusion that it is not a good idea. I'm sure it's fine for a place where you can find spares of whatever if need be, but horrible in a place where they are not readily available.

well biked

It seems that any route the OP goes, availability may be a problem. I do notice he says he can order things in the States and have them forwarded to him in Africa. One nice thing about the Stan's system, the rim strips are the only fairly expensive part, and now the strips use presta valves with replaceable cores, so all you have to do is order a few extra valve cores and extra sealant with the kit and you should be good for many years (they didn't do this at first, it was a modification that came some time after the product was introduced). All the items can be ordered directly from the website. I realize the Stan's system isn't for everyone who rides mtb's (for one thing, you do need access to an air compressor), but for constant flats like the OP is getting, it's the only thing I know of that will completely solve the problem. I have noticed on the website that they now sell a sort of presta valve injector, so that the sealant can be injected into inner tubes that have removable valve cores. I believe Continental brand presta tubes have removable cores, so that's another option, the OP could simply buy the sealant and inject it into inner tubes. I can't say if this would work as well as the full-blown Stan's tubeless system, but it if it does then there's another solution. I've never used a Slime tube, which you would think would be essentially the same thing, but from what I've heard Slime tubes leave a lot to be desired-

Cyclist0383

I don't think you have had much experience living outside of North America, have you? Just where will one find an air compressor if one gets a flat on the roads of East Africa? Bicycle pumps are everywhere, compressors are not.

well biked

You misunderstand, you only need an air compressor when you do the initial inflation of the tires, not each time you add air. I've said that at least twice. You shouldn't need to use the compressor again until the tires are worn out, or you want to change them for some reason, or months down the road when you need to add sealant. If the OP can't use compressed-air at a gas station, for example, then yes, there's a problem. And you're right, I don't have much experience living outside North America. But little as it is, it's apparently more experience than you have with the Stan's tubeless system-

Cyclist0383

Compressed air at the gas station? Maybe in a major city. Maybe. One of the first rules of third world travel is to use things which are readily available, like bicycle pumps and reparable tubes. Keep in mind the OP is living in a place which doesn't even have Presta tubes, most likely he can find Dunlop or maybe Schrader.

What happens with the Stans system if the tire should go totally flat for whatever reason? Do you need a compressor then?

I'll say it one last time; Stan's tubeless system might work, and might even work well, but I wouldn't bet my luck on it in the middle of Africa where I can't find spares.

well biked

If a spare tube makes you feel better, all you would have to do if you had a flat with the Stan's system in the middle of nowhere is to remove the Stan's rim strip (you'll have another rim strip already installed beneath it, that's part of the system), install the tube in the tire, air it up with your portable pump, and ride on. According to the OP's description of the riding (with inner tubes) where he is, this would apparently mean "ride on" for a very short distance, because a flat would be imminent. Based on my experience with the Stan's tubeless system, I would say that if you have a flat with it, your tire is going to have some type of damage that is so bad that it's not going to be rideable anyway. So carry an extra tire? I don't know how far you want to take this, so yes, there's always going to be a "what if" scenario that could halt the OP's ride. Some other type of mechanical failure might occur, too, for that matter. But the Stan's tubeless sytem, if the OP is willing and able to order it (along with some extra presta valve cores and perhaps an extra bottle of sealant), and if he can get at least temporary, occasional use of an air compressor, is the best solution for flat prevention out there-

Cyclist0383

I'm not going to get in a pissing match with you, but one of the things the OP wants is low-maintenance. Stan's seem to be anything but. I'm sure there is a reason why around the world tourists often use Schawlbe tires and not Stan's, and I think that reason is the ability to field repair and continue.

Also the Stan's seem to be geared at the mountain bike crowd as the maximum allowed pressure is only 40psi. Hardly good for travel by bike.

well biked

You seem to have drawn your own conclusions about the Stan's system. I've seen this attitude about the Stan's system before, but it really is one of the few things you'll find that's as good as advertised. I've used it a bunch, and will tell anyone about it who's looking for puncture protection on a mountain bike, or anyone who wants to be able to run very low tire pressures (better traction) without worry of pinch flats. Yes, it's recommended you not run pressures above 40 psi. I've run up to 45psi without problems, which is a fairly typical pressure for off road fat tires. And although the OP doesn't specifically say he wants to run off road tires, if you read the description of the riding conditions he's riding in, I think it's a safe bet he is, or should be.

As for maintenance, the OP is in a tough region for bike tires apparently. He wants to be able to ride, and not have flats. So although the Stan's system is trickier to set up originally (although once you've done it a time or two, it's no big deal), the maintenance is as simple as can be. You check the air pressure occasionally, and top off as needed with a hand pump. The same as with tires with tubes. And you don't have flats. So it's not high maintenance at all-

wroomwroomoops

Schwalbe Marathon Plus

They are indestructible. Anyone who advises you anything else, is giving you the wrong advice - you can't get more tenacious bicycle tires than these. You can quote on this.

wroomwroomoops

good but don't have SmartGuard.

Also, are these even produced anymore?

wroomwroomoops

well biked: you're not seriously going to argue that Stan's is better than an indestructible tire, are you? C'mon now, let's be serious.

And Ziemas' arguments are all spot on.

neil0502

You say it's not a gimmick, but ... look at their mailing address:

202 Daniel Zenker Dr
Big Flats, NY 14814

Hmmmmmm.

well biked

The fact that you go along with Ziemas tells me I'm the one who's spot on. Thanks for the feedback-

well biked

Life's full of ironies, what can I say...........

wroomwroomoops

I had my share of problems with taking his trollbaits a few times BUT this time he's 100% right, and you're only 50% right.

Again, you can't seriously say Stan's is better than an indestructible tire. In fact, not even some exotic tire liners, or fat tube is better than an indestructible tire. You just can't harm the Marathon Plus. Take a chainsaw to it, and I'd still bet against the chainsaw. srsly

So argue the issue, not the person.