Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Bicycle Mechanics
Reload this Page >

Pulley wheel not spinning freely

Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

Pulley wheel not spinning freely

Old 09-23-08, 11:23 AM
  #1  
Jesper64
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 70
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Pulley wheel not spinning freely

I've just removed my rear derailer (Ultegra RD6600) to give it a bit of a clean. I removed the pulley wheels just so I could clean the teeth a bit better. After installing them back I've noticed that the upper pulley wheel does not spin very freely at all. It's a sealed ceramic bushing (according to what's written on the pulley). When cleaning the pulley wheel I did open up the seal had a look inside, it was clean and adequate amounts of grease still so I didn't bother degreasing it and regreasing it. Basically there is no free spin in the pulley wheel at all and whilst not stiff to turn doesn't turn that freely either. The tension pulley is spinning freely but uses a different bearing system. Comparing the Ultegra G-pulley to a 105 derailer that I have, the 105 definitely spins alot easier.

So my question is, is the upper pulley meant to not spin freely like I've described or have I somehow rooted it whilst taking it apart? If I was to degrease and regrease it, is normal grease fine for the ceramic bushing?

Cheers for any help.
Jesper64 is offline  
Old 09-23-08, 11:31 AM
  #2  
DMF 
Elitist Troglodyte
 
DMF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dallas
Posts: 6,926

Bikes: 03 Raleigh Professional (steel)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Apparently that's normal with these pulleys.
__________________
Stupidity got us into this mess - why can't it get us out?

- Will Rogers
DMF is offline  
Old 09-23-08, 06:54 PM
  #3  
Jesper64
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 70
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Cool, thanks for the quick answer.
Jesper64 is offline  
Old 09-23-08, 07:33 PM
  #4  
BCRider
Senior Member
 
BCRider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The 'Wack, BC, Canada
Posts: 5,466

Bikes: Norco (2), Miyata, Canondale, Soma, Redline

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I've never seen a pulley that did NOT spin freely other than some viscous drag from the grease. And that would not be felt at all by your finger but it would mean that if you spin it that the pulley would slow to a halt quickly like in a turn or less if it's really gooey.

However I've had issues when I swapped the pins by accident. Try switching them and see if that perks up the top pulley. Also you didn't get mixed up and put the lower on the top by accident by any chance? Done that too when I got cocky and figured I knew it all....

The top pulley should actually have a little bit of side to side float on the pin. If that's gone you may have pinched a side cup when you put the pin back in or something else equally as silly.
BCRider is offline  
Old 09-23-08, 07:41 PM
  #5  
Jesper64
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 70
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Upper and lower pulley's are definitely not mixed up. Also pretty sure I didn't swap the pins around because I cleaned only one at a time. The top pulley still has side to side play so don't think it's a pinched cup and I've also inspected the cups and they look fine.
Jesper64 is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 10:14 AM
  #6  
HardyWeinberg
GATC
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: south Puget Sound
Posts: 8,702
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 448 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Originally Posted by Jesper64 View Post
After installing them back I've noticed that the upper pulley wheel does not spin very freely at all. It's a sealed ceramic bushing (according to what's written on the pulley). ... The tension pulley is spinning freely but uses a different bearing system. Comparing the Ultegra G-pulley to a 105 derailer that I have, the 105 definitely spins alot easier.
I have the same deal w/ my XT pulley wheels (lower cartridge spins freely by hand, upper ceramic does not). I haven't noticed any problems in terms of actual bicycle function, just spinning them by hand when out of the derailer.
HardyWeinberg is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 10:23 AM
  #7  
G piny parnas
messenger
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: WLA
Posts: 599

Bikes: pinarellos and a colnago

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
quite possibly you left out a small shim or tightened it too tight? and crushed something.maybe if you put a wafer thin spacer it will spin freely---
G piny parnas is offline  
Old 09-25-08, 08:10 AM
  #8  
Jesper64
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 70
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Don't think it's a spacing issues as I was very careful taking it apart and putting it back together. The bushing in the centre of the pulley presses against each of the plates and holds them apart. Also there is side to side play in the pulley to allow for slight derailer adjustment.

After a bit more Google-Fu (seems spinning freely isn't a common term whereas resistance is), I think it's a function of the rubber seal on the derailer. A couple other posts here and here, report similar issues with the upper jockey wheel. I've since fitted it and seems to be running fine
Jesper64 is offline  
Old 12-29-08, 08:14 PM
  #9  
cccorlew
Erect member since 1953
 
cccorlew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Antioch, CA (SF Bay Area)
Posts: 6,946

Bikes: Roubaix Expert, Motobecane Ti Century Elite turned commuter, Cannondale F500 Mtn bike, Some old French thing gone fixie

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 84 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Hummm. I was changing my chain and noticed the same thing (Same Ultegra RD6600) . Bottom spins freely, top doesn't. It isn't stuck. it turns, but doesn't spin at all.

What did you do to "fit" it?

I opened mine and lovingly cleaned it, but no diference.
cccorlew is offline  
Old 12-29-08, 08:25 PM
  #10  
cccorlew
Erect member since 1953
 
cccorlew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Antioch, CA (SF Bay Area)
Posts: 6,946

Bikes: Roubaix Expert, Motobecane Ti Century Elite turned commuter, Cannondale F500 Mtn bike, Some old French thing gone fixie

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 84 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
UPDATE:
Endless Googling and such seems to suggest that the non-spinning top pulley on an Ultegra is normal.
cccorlew is offline  
Old 12-29-08, 08:55 PM
  #11  
Jesper64
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 70
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by cccorlew View Post
UPDATE:
Endless Googling and such seems to suggest that the non-spinning top pulley on an Ultegra is normal.
Yup seams to be the case
Jesper64 is offline  
Old 12-30-08, 04:43 AM
  #12  
jcpups608
...let me ride
 
jcpups608's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 416

Bikes: '07 trek madone ssl, DA.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I think the ultegra 6600 sl has bearings not a ceramic shim guide pulley and they might work w/ the 6600 if it's an issue for you. The DA full bearing pulleys don't spin super freely either though imo.
jcpups608 is offline  
Old 04-21-13, 06:09 PM
  #13  
392da0c0
blah
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I realize that this thread is quite old, but for the sake of those who will still find it by web search, I'll add my two cents.

Yes, it appears the upper (aka "G-pulley") does not spin as freely as the lower one (aka "tension pulley"). The culprit is the rubber seal, not the ceramic bushing.

I just got a pair of brand new 6700 ones and they exhibit the same behavior right out of the box - even if I hold them with my fingers! The amount of squeezing that I apply to the sides does not seem to matter. Also, if I remove the seal and washer on the G-pulley, so that I can hold the ceramic axle directly, the pulley spins like there is no tomorrow!

I don't know why Shimano does it that way - maybe just an "acceptable compromise" for Ultegra? Anyway, friction-facts dot com measures the resistance of Ultegra pulleys as equivalent to 0.607 W, while Dure Ace is down to 0.159 W - almost half Watt difference.
392da0c0 is offline  
Old 04-21-13, 08:37 PM
  #14  
dddd
Ride, Wrench, Swap, Race
 
dddd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Northern California
Posts: 6,470

Bikes: Cheltenham-Pederson racer, Boulder F/S Paris-Roubaix, Varsity racer, '52 Christophe, '62 Continental, '92 Merckx, '75 Limongi, '76 Presto, '72 Gitane SC, '71 Schwinn SS, etc.

Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 510 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 7 Times in 7 Posts
The dura-ace top pulley has an extremely sophisticated pair of tiny ball bearing retainers that allow it to float on a straight spindle, and sealed with very much reduced diameter seals which entail much lower seal friction.

The rubber seals on Ultegra and XT top pullies traditionally have been very easy to get the lip pinched under the dust shield at some hidden spot, which further increases friction and quickly chews off the offending segment of the seal lip. Very easy to do while re-installing the pully with the chain getting in the way!

I apply light oil to my XT derailer's top pulley seals before each race, which helps quite a bit but is temporary.
dddd is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.