Well, how many of our grandfathers caught fire back then? A DARN FEW! And if you don't smoke around it and don't have an open flame near by, how the heck is it going to catch fire? Of course it's got some degree of risk, but so does riding your bike! As far as a carcinogen goes you can wear cloves can't you? I don't recommend using gas by if one is careful it does work.

Even if you and they did not burst into flames there's still that pesky little carcinogen issue. Like Evans said "we're supposed to know better".

No one, to my knowledge, has kept any sort of track between middle age and early old age cancers that may be linked to frequent and copious skin contact with gasoline. That doesn't mean that it hasn't happened on a frequent basis. Why take the chance when it's been shown that gasoline does contain known carcinogens?

In fact those of us looking to prolong our later year good health would be well advised to use nitrile rubber gloves that are highly solvent resistant during ANY handling of solvents. And only use the more aromatic solvents in areas with good ventilation. Some solvents either never come out of our systems or come out extremely slowly. But they can be absorbed through the skin or via the lungs quite readily.

I thought that some of them had washers between the plates or something or maybe like a bicycle version of an o-ring chain.

Better than what? The stuff works. Something else our forefathers knew was there are dangers associated with anything.
How you handle these dangers is what proves your wisdom. I use rubber gloves, I wear goggles and I clean the chain by agitating it in an enclosed container. Kerosene, gasoline or plain ole paint thinner is used, most of the time.

I recently emptied a can of moisture displacing compound on the chains, and it worked a treat. SO that is something you might consider.

Once clean, I lube with good old fashioned bar and chain oil after reinstalling.

Sorry, I didn't realize you needed to get EVERY SPECK of grit out of the rollers. I guess that's why I'm not getting 10,000 miles on my chains.

Besides, if you grip the chain so the rollers roll while you spin the crank, capillary action takes the brake klean into the rollers and pins. The rollers spin the dirt out. Like I say, it works great. You should try it. Use the nappy white towels in the 60 pack at costco. bk

So, I just went out to the garage, and set the bike up on my work rig. I kept reapplying brake klean to the towel & chain until no more dirt showed on the towel. I had to 'apply' cleaner four times. Mind you this is a recumbent that uses two chains, minus two links. There sure was a lot of black stuff on the cleaning towel. Flossed between the links with a pipe cleaner. Barely got any dirt on it. Applied Pro Link Gold with a clean white towel, and it came out clean. This is a clean chain. Perfectly clean? I doubt it. But cleaner than it will be in a few miles of riding a clean, paved trail. bk

Well, OK. But from this last description I'd say that you're using more than "just a spot". The paper towel would need to be quite wet with the brake cleaner to have enough to wick into spots and back out again.

Yes, a towel does hold a fair amount of fluid. bk

You guys need to read about Chain-L at: http://www.chain-l.com I've been using this stuff now for 3 months and so far it's been great and has done everything they promised it would do. Of course long term chain wear is still in limbo till I get some miles on it. But I started using Chain-L when I put a new chain on one of my bikes and thought, "why not try Chain-L on the new chain". So on one of the bikes I'm using Chain-L and will be watching to see how long it will last. Normally on this particular bike I get about 10 to 12,000 miles on a chain, and at my rate of riding plus riding other bikes it may take 5 years or so to get an accurate idea. So in order to that the best way I bought a Park CC2 chain checker, which I felt would give me a far more accurate reading then using the ruler method I used for 35 some odd years. So maybe I can get an idea earlier then that, not sure. But if the Chain-L continues to perform like it is, I may switch all my bikes over before the test is over on the one chain.

Darwinism at work.

Holier-than-though claptrap, as usual.

Owning my own power equipment repair shop for 12+ years I have tried a lot of cleaners and degreasers, started with Spray Nine that I used to buy in a 55 gal drum ( very expensive ) and it worked the best but it could damage the finishes on some of the equipment. After trying to cut cost I started to try the different brands out there like Simple Green,White Lightning,Greased Lightning and a few no named brands and so far the best bang for my buck has been a cleaner called Purple Power it cost between $4.99 and $6.99 a gal depending where you buy it. I mix it in a one gal pump sprayer used for gardening as I do go through a lot of it when doing lawnmowers. So far it has not damaged any finishes on bicycles but it will remove fine details on some things like the pinstripes on older Schwinns so you still need to test( on newer bikes with clear coat I don't even worry about it ).
http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/m...urplepower.jpg

yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup

I've been disappointed with my chain cleaner + Simplegreen so far. Even with like 5 refills/runs, it still gives off tons of black gunk.

I think you mean <$12 a gallon, assuming you mean less than.

Not to mention gasoline doesn't dry "clean" without residue to destroy any lubrication. When I took my chain off I soaked it in paint thinner, then used a citrus degreaser(Schaeffer's Citrol) to get most of the solvent and dirt off and followed it with a blast of brake cleaner. Biodiesel works awesome as well.

I have been using dishwasher detergent to clean everything on my bike. It degreases pretty well, I believe.

I have also used charcoal lighter fluid as a solvent I spray on the chain, chain rings, derailleur, etc. It degreases really well.

To get my chain especially clean, I put it in an empty gatorade bottle, add charcoal lighter and shake it or agitate it. The solvent comes out really dirty. This can be repeated with clean solvent.

I'd be glad to hear opinions.

here's a weird opinion, I will no longer remove my chain and soak in solvent to get it clean. I only would do that once a year anyway but I've decided not to do that practice anymore. Why you scream? Because I ran into an individual who many years ago knew a guy who worked in a bicycle chain factory. He claimed that the factory prelubes the chain, and when a user soaks it in solvent you remove most if not all the factory lube inside the chain, then you relube, but when you relube the oil does not go into the inside of the chain well at all. Thus you leave the chain less protected. His advice was to use only a chain cleaning machine to get the outside dirt off then relube and the chain will last longer.

I also heard of this before in other sources and knew a few people who practiced this, so I'm not taking the word of one guy, but it does seem interesting.

I know when I use to deep clean chain every month vs using a chain cleaning machine and then only doing a deep soak cleaning once a year I noticed no advantage to deep cleaning once a month in chain life. That's why I stopped deep cleaning to only once a year. Since I got a new chain on two of my bikes this spring, and started using Chain-L #50 lube only on those two chains I've decided never to deep clean those chains to see what happens. So far with about 2,500 miles on one of the chains I've experienced no chain wear according to the Park tool, but this could be due to the Chain-L lube more then deep cleaning or lack thereof. But in order for this to work I have to follow the directions that Chain-L provides.

Here's a letter written to Lennard Zinn about this:

Dear Lennard,
You probably will get a few of these, but how do recommend cleaning a chain on the bike? I have yet to find a better way than to remove the chain and clean it in parts washer or H2O bottle filled with citrus degreaser. Vigorously shake said bottle, rinse in hot water, and voila! Clean chain.
Paul

Dear Paul,
I recommend wiping and lubing your chain after every ride. Then it rarely gets dirty enough to need cleaning.

When it does get dirty, a chain cleaner like this works great. (picture of a chain cleaning machine)

The way pro team mechanics do it, by scrubbing it on the bike with a brush, gets solvent all over the place but obviously very effective, since you never see a cleaner bike than the bikes ready to race each day in an event like the Tour de France, no matter how sloppy it was the day before. And those guys do not remove chains for cleaning. In fact, Shimano aborted its planned inclusion of a master link with its Dura-Ace 7900 chains because pro team mechanics couldn’t see the point.
Lennard


Here's an interesting follow up topic about that from Zinn: http://velonews.competitor.com/2008/...ollow-up_73002

But regardless what you do here's some information that some may find useful others not so useful in regards to Simple Green: http://velonews.competitor.com/2005/...e-green-2_9216

Anyway, as you all have already noticed, there's a variety of different opinions on this subject. For years the school of thought was to remove the chain and deep clean it once a month. I'm just wondering if we bought into a something that had no proof that it worked, or maybe the old style chains that used bushings it was necessary to deep clean but the newer bushingless is not required but we still think it's required?


Anyway just a thought.

What I've seen with cleaning and lubing chains is that cleaner and lube go into the chain very easily. So easily that it is not a thing to be concerned with. Capillary action does the trick quite well. I soak a spot on a nappy wash cloth about the size of a quarter with Pro Link and hold it against the chain while rotating it slowly. I do this twice for a 226 link recumbent chain. It is incredible how well this gets lube into the chain. After the lube solvent dries, you can feel how well the chain is lubed by running your finger back and forth on the chain rollers. Smooth, well lubed action.

This notion about it being hard to get lube or solvent in there is myth. bk

The best, easiest, and least toxic degreaser is hot water and dawn dish soap. I have tried simple green, gasoline, engine degreaser, bike specific products and the hot water and dish soap works the best. I believe it must be because of the surfactants and detergent.

Most of the other chain cleaners are just degreasers. But you aren't just trying to remove grease/oil but road grime which may or may not be soluble in oil and therefore may be soluble in water. You need to not only remove the grease which the detergent does well, but you need to remove other particles which may be soluble in water. The surfactant allows the detergent to get into the nooks and crannies.

It does work well but you have to wipe the chain down after every ride. It smells just like chain saw oil.

There are far better...as in safer...solvents out there than gasoline. Gasoline has a flash point of -40F. That's damned cold. You can ignite it in a blizzard on the Arctic Circle in January. In more normal climes, handling it outside of a gasoline tank on a vehicle requires a lot of thought and caution.

Mineral spirits has a much higher flash point. Odorless has the highest flash point (>131 F), few aromatics, is about $7 a gallon (enough for hundreds of chain cleanings) and does a damned fine job since it's, essentially, the same material as gasoline without that pesky flammability problem. Overall a much, much better choice.

Not holier-than-thou, just better informed.

As for our grandfathers catching fire: some did. So did their kids. My bother and the neighbor kids managed to burn one the kids pretty badly while playing with gasoline. My dad managed to burn his motor home to the ground because of a leaking fuel hose. Toasted the house a bit too.

After thinking about it for a long time, I just ordered some Chain-L so I can finally try it. I'll let y'all know what I think after a while.

Tom

Mineral spirits is quite flammable. The biggest issue with gasoline isn't it's flash point or its autoignition temperature(higher than paper by the way) but the fact that it doesn't just burn, it explodes.