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Sturmey Archer Cog Question

Old 05-23-13, 04:24 AM
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Sturmey Archer Cog Question

Hi folks, thanks in advance for the input on possibly replacing the rear cog on my vintage 1970 AW IGH.

I have two cogs, both dished types, a 19 tooth and a 17 tooth. Originally equipped with the 19 tooth, I replaced it with the 17 tooth and like the top end speed much better.

I'd like to squeeze even more from the bike and am considering a 15, or even 13 tooth as an optional rear end. Those two tooth count cogs are only available in the flat (not dished) cog configuration. Will the flat cogs fit the AW, or will moving the rear of the chainline outward 1/8 to 1/4 inch (by not having a dished profile) affect anything adversely?

Thanks again!

Last edited by North Coast Joe; 05-23-13 at 04:44 AM. Reason: got my innies and outies mixed up
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Old 05-23-13, 05:26 AM
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It's unlikely to be a problem, but even if it is you can use spacers under the cog to adjust the chainline if needed.
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Old 05-23-13, 08:35 AM
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Yea anything under 16t is flat but the offset is not much.. ,

FWIW ... Sachs, for Brompton , made a thinner 3/32 " 13 & skip tooth 15t. [3 are shorter]
on those hubs the special driver, allowed both cogs to fit. 3 by 2 , 6 speed.. chain shoved back and forth..

my old 3 speeds had washers on both sides of the cog , that can go both on 1 side if you wish..
pop off the snap ring ..

you can play with the chainring end and , If the chain ring is not fixed onto the crank-arm,

but instead, bolts on, then a set of shim washers can go around the chainring fixing bolts .

to put the chain-line perfect .. ... Imperfect will work too..

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Old 05-23-13, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson
It's unlikely to be a problem, but even if it is you can use spacers under the cog to adjust the chainline if needed.
Assuming it's a 3-spline British AW hub, there may be 1 or 2 1/16" spacers to fine tune chainline. If I remember correctly the dish on the larger sprockets was less than 1/8", so flipping it made a difference if about 3/16" or so. (counting on memory here). So using the spacers, you can still move the flat sprocket a up to 1/8" total. Get the chainline as good as you can, but there's some room for error and the bike will be fine.
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Old 05-29-15, 12:46 PM
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Sorry to drag up an old thread but its better than starting a new one I want to go the other way around with this idea here

I am a newbie to Sturmey Archer AW Hubs but I am now hooked while fitting one in place of the old 5 speed derailleur

I have a 20 inch wheel off a Puch fold up bike fitted with a 3 Speed Sturmey Archer AW hub, date stamped 1975, I am fitting this to my 1990 Universal Uni-Sport.

The wheel has a 14 tooth cog, this is flat.

I want to buy and fit a 22 tooth which is dished.

My flat 14 tooth cog has two spacer rings behind it.

If I put a dished cog on, then the chain will then be out of line, would I get away with reversing it and using the spacers to get the chain true, I have no room at the front for adjustment as it is one piece on the crank. Obviously having the front and rear so close together there is not much room for the chain being out of line before it causes a problem, I had this with 1st gear on the derailleur system that I fitted years ago, noisy in 1st and stretched the chain and kept coming off even with new chain, wore the cogs too

Can anyone see any problems here putting a 22 tooth cog on a small fold up bike? I have a 46 tooth on the front.

I need it geared to tug a sidecar and also at times a trailer. Is 22 too much?

Cheers
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Old 05-29-15, 01:08 PM
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46T x 22T on a 20" wheel is going to be a pretty low gear. Is that what you want?
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Old 05-29-15, 04:15 PM
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Yes low is what I am after to go up hills easier with a 23kg dog on the side or back

When I had the 5 speed set up with a mountain bike front ring welded on, (that was about 44 teeth) with the standard 5 cogs on the rear, it went along ok with a top speed of about 18-20 mph pedalling like mad! So yes, something slightly higher geared than that.
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Old 05-29-15, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Mk3.
Yes low is what I am after to go up hills easier with a 23kg dog on the side or back
Ok. So going back to your question:

I want to buy and fit a 22 tooth which is dished.

My flat 14 tooth cog has two spacer rings behind it. If I put a dished cog on, then the chain will then be out of line, would I get away with reversing it and using the spacers to get the chain true
Yes, it should be fine. If you have two spacers behind the flat cog, take one out and put the cog on with the dish facing out, and the other spacer outside the cog. That should get the chainline pretty close, which is all you should need. The tooth profiles on cogs and chainrings designed for non-derailleur bikes tend to be taller than those of derailleur bikes and resist derailment better.
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Old 05-29-15, 09:01 PM
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Sturmey makes a flat 22T cog. Just find a LBS with a United Bicycle account and have them order one:

United Bicycle Supply Hub Parts Sturmey Archer
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Old 05-30-15, 03:13 AM
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Cheers guys, you lot are superb for info, I now have the choice of using the spacers or sourcing a flat one to keep her dead true, excellent job
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Old 05-30-15, 08:10 AM
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you swap spacer's positions to alter the chainline plus flipping the dished cog one way or the other.

will not find a flat 22t cog unless you make it in your Machine Shop.
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Old 06-02-15, 05:17 PM
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Managed to borrow a 19 tooth rear cog (dished) off a mate

Pic below shows the size difference.

I measured the distance between a spoke and the inside of the original cog, and then moved the spacers when fitting the dished item.

Originally both spacers/shims/washers were on the inside of the flat cog, now I have one either side of the dished cog.

As I put the wheel back on I suddenly became aware of what I had actually done,,,, the chain was now a lot shorter!

This means the spindle nuts now sit right on the end of the rear fork slots, but just enough to make it secure so off I went on a ride

Up my usual hill, it went ok, a lot better than the 14 tooth, but I needed a bit more to tug the sidecar along with ease.

So I ordered a 21 Tooth chrome dished sprocket, and a PTFE coated 114 link chain (I only need about 90 links but better safe than sorry)

I will update when I get the bits fitted.
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Old 06-06-15, 06:15 PM
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Wow what a difference!

New chain, 21 tooth rear, and the 46 tooth front I welded on, rides lovely up hill in 1st, and on the flat in 3rd.

Very pleased

Many thanks for advice
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Old 06-06-15, 07:01 PM
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Congrats, you made it yours and the way you needed it to be. That's what matters in the end.

BTW- great job on the side car.
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