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Upgrading '87 Cannondale SR500 to 7sp w/brifters

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Upgrading '87 Cannondale SR500 to 7sp w/brifters

Old 06-15-13, 04:42 AM
  #1  
Pibber
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Upgrading '87 Cannondale SR500 to 7sp w/brifters

My SR is full shimano 105. series 1050, i think. I've bought some 105 brifters, in keeping with said components, but the only ones i can find are 2x8. i'm buying a 7sp cassette, but the only one i can find is hyperglide. obviously, this bike is uniglide. are there any problems with doing this switch, such as, the spacing for the cassette? will i have to redish the rear wheel? is there enough space back there for a 7sp cassette? the spacer ring(?) between the hub and the cassette; will pulling that off allow the new cassette to fit? should i just set fire to it and run?



pic just a couple days after purchase.
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Old 06-15-13, 05:15 AM
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Pibber, Your bike, if original, has a 6S freewheel hub, not one that uses a cassette on a freehub. To use the 105 integrated shifters you'll need a new rear wheel, or a wheelset to match wheels. This is a common modification as the 130 mm spaced hub fits well into your 126 mm spaced rear dropouts without any modifications providing there is no pre existing defect in the rear triangle. Test your existing derailleurs for compatibility with the new shifters.

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Old 06-15-13, 06:37 AM
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There is significant disagreement about the wisdom of squeezing a 130mm 8/9/10s hub in a 126mm AL frame. (Later Cannondale frames allegedly have 128mm compromise spacing but yours is certainly spaced at 126.) It's clearly not good for the frame; the question is how bad it is. Redishing a wheel to 126 would be fine.
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Old 06-15-13, 08:37 AM
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If you are lucky, you might have an early Uniglide freehub on there but probably not. If you do have a Uniglide freehub, you should be able to go to a bike shop and source up an old 7 speed hyperglde freehub and rob the freehub body off of it and replace your Uniglide freehub body with the 7 speed Hyperglide freehub body, that should be a straightforward swap.

If you have a freewheel, I would just trash the freewheel hub and rebuild the wheel with a 7 speed Hyperglide freehub but I like looking for excuses to rebuild wheels.The 8 speed 105 brifters should work just fine with the 7 speed Hyperglide cassette. The spacing between 7 and 8 speed is so close that it pretty much is a non-issue. That way you can keep the 126mm rear spacing intact, 7 speed freehubs are easily kept at 126mm without excessive dish.
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Old 06-15-13, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by bradtx View Post
Pibber, Your bike, if original, has a 6S freewheel hub, not one that uses a cassette on a freehub. To use the 105 integrated shifters you'll need a new rear wheel, or a wheelset to match wheels. This is a common modification as the 130 mm spaced hub fits well into your 126 mm spaced rear dropouts without any modifications providing there is no pre existing defect in the rear triangle. Test your existing derailleurs for compatibility with the new shifters.

Brad
ohh, so i've got a thread on, not splines. so, this issue should be rectified first, right? i'm pretty new to this, the mechanics of the bike. i can make it go forward, i'm almost an expert on that. structurally speaking, the bike has no issues that i can see. it's never even hinted at being squishy or given me any weird shakes or vibrations or even balked at a climb, so far....can i assume you mean slap the sti's on and see if they shift the derailleurs when you say test them? and, after your information, i've done a web search. seems i'm on the tail end of this conversion wave and the 7 speeds i'm looking for are difficult to find.
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Old 06-15-13, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by peterw_diy View Post
There is significant disagreement about the wisdom of squeezing a 130mm 8/9/10s hub in a 126mm AL frame. (Later Cannondale frames allegedly have 128mm compromise spacing but yours is certainly spaced at 126.) It's clearly not good for the frame; the question is how bad it is. Redishing a wheel to 126 would be fine.
yeah, i didn't want to go to an 8 because of the spacing. i knew that would create more issues than i could deal with without considerable headaches and money being thrown at the problem. i bought the bike for $250. got lucky there, for sure.
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Old 06-15-13, 08:55 AM
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I wouldn't spread an aluminum frame. But it sounds as if you have a freewheel and 7 speed freewheels are easy to find. Your shop can sell you one; or you can get this from Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Shimano-Tourne...mano+freewheel
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Old 06-15-13, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by peterw_diy View Post
There is significant disagreement about the wisdom of squeezing a 130mm 8/9/10s hub in a 126mm AL frame. (Later Cannondale frames allegedly have 128mm compromise spacing but yours is certainly spaced at 126.) It's clearly not good for the frame; the question is how bad it is. Redishing a wheel to 126 would be fine.
My 126 mm spaced '89 has had a 130 mm spaced hub since the mid '90s without a problem. I don't know if anyone else has had one in service for this long, but it has become a common practice. Of course if the OP is uncomfortable doing this, I wouldn't try to convince him.

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Old 06-15-13, 09:17 AM
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here's what i'm working with

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Old 06-15-13, 09:21 AM
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I have never been a fan of stressing the heat treated aluminum Cannondale frame in a direction for which it was not designed, tho many others have done it apparently without incident.
I have used several "tricks" to utilize 8,9,or 10 speed rear setups in the 126mm Cannondale dropouts with great success.
See my post here: https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...=#post15400599
If you chose to stay with freewheel, I recommend Dura Ace or Sante freewheels. As for aftermanket FW's, IRD Defiants are great replacements.
None of these are real cheap, but cassettes are not,either.
I own several (to put it mildly) 80's Cannondales and have done loads of diffrent things with the drivetrains.
Great bikes! Good luck.
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Old 06-15-13, 09:23 AM
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no spreading. i just wanted a bit more range for climbing.
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Old 06-15-13, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by bikemig View Post
I wouldn't spread an aluminum frame. But it sounds as if you have a freewheel and 7 speed freewheels are easy to find. Your shop can sell you one; or you can get this from Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Shimano-Tourne...mano+freewheel
i'm already 13-24 so the 13-28 would be perfect, really.

https://www.amazon.com/Shimano-MF-HG3...ef=pd_sbs_sg_2
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Old 06-15-13, 09:53 AM
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be careful

a 7sp freewheel is wider than a 6 speed freewheel
and there might be clearance issues between the small cog frame and chain

you can still find 6 sp freewheels quite easily
with different ranges
and that would be a very simple swap

for a less expensive switch than brifters
consider a set of bar end shifters
much better ergonomics than down tube shifters
but not quite up to brifter quality
bar end shifters are awesome for touring and casual riding
but not much use for organized racing

also
my experience with trying to mix 8 speed shifters and 7 sp cassettes has not been entirely positive
i could never quite get it to work right

edit
here is an example of a 6 speed freewheel
https://harriscyclery.net/product/shi...w8109-qc49.htm
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Old 06-15-13, 09:56 PM
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I would look into rebuilding the wheel with a Shimano 7 speed freehub. They should be pretty cheap and you could reuse your old spokes since the spacing will be so close. I would use new nipples though.
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Old 06-15-13, 11:09 PM
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here's what i'm working with
followed by picture of a Freewheel , not a freehub.. all current F/W have hyperglide type teeth.

I had great reliability with a Phil Wood freewheel Hub, the axle bending issue disappears.

have a Mavic 501 freewheel hub to sell or build something with , its NOS .

no spreading. i just wanted a bit more range for climbing.
dont need more 'speeds' just a lower gear ratio.. , look for a longer cage RD..
and a freewheel with 13 to 32 or 34 teeth

then consider a different crankset like a Triple , 53,42, 26, perhaps?

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Old 06-16-13, 01:21 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
followed by picture of a Freewheel , not a freehub.. all current F/W have hyperglide type teeth.

I had great reliability with a Phil Wood freewheel Hub, the axle bending issue disappears.

have a Mavic 501 freewheel hub to sell or build something with , its NOS .
yeah, so i've learned in this thread i don't have a hub, but a fw. cool. it gives me info, a starting place. i'm more worried about whether or not the 7spd thread on will fit without having to redish or spread her legs, so to speak. i absolutely do not want to spread her out anymore than she already is. i love the way this bike rides. literally, i dream about riding her. yes, she's a she. i don't know why, it just is. all that said, i'm ignorant as to the obvious plethora of choices that are at my disposal. i'm a n00b, as far as this goes.

however, i do know, or at least i suspect, that dropping a 7spd onto my bike will work from what i've read. one of my main points of contention with this attempt at an upgrade is whether the removal of the suntour ring/plate/disc thingy behind the existing cassette will make room for the new 7spd. i'm hoping that this will make room and negate the need for spreading or anything drastic to make this upgrade happen.

also, hyperglide "type" teeth don't necessarily mean it's hyperglide. i really thought this was uniglide, but i was wrong. seems that a thread on setup is less work to change out than moving uni to hyper. maybe? dunno.....
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Old 06-16-13, 05:02 AM
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Take a look at Sheldon Brown's crib sheet: https://www.sheldonbrown.com/cribsheet-spacing.html
It appears that the Shimano 7sp is 2mm wider than the 6 speed, although the chart
covers both freewheels and cassettes, and Sheldon does not specify as to which he refers in the chart.
But, it shouldn't present a problem.
7 speed setups are designed to fit onto 126mm dropout spacing, but that is not to say that a minimal
spacier shift and redish might not be required.
Generally, the spoke protector is located behind the freewheel but not on the threaded section.
Removing it probably will not gain any length in that area.
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Old 06-16-13, 05:43 AM
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I modified my 86 Cannondale to 10 speed Campy for about $350. Makes a great rain/trainer bike.

I used Suntour Ultra 7 freewheels back then.
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Old 07-01-13, 09:19 PM
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sorry to bump a dead thread, but since i'm the OP i thought maybe i could get away with it.

i bought a DNP Epoch(had to fix that. was pretty tired when i originally posted this. not a dep....) 7sp 11-28 freewheel(pretty much a silent fw, too...) that did take up some space and after messing with the axle for a week and a half i figured out i could just take a washer off the nds and slap it on the ds and it made just enough space so the fw would spin freely. no redishing, no reheating, nothing. works great!

i got my shifters, first gen 105's i think they're 1055 and my groupset is 1050. not sure if that's important, or not....i stuck my shifter cable in the right shifter and put it on. attached the brake cable and connected the rd and the rear brake up. the brake worked just fine but i couldn't get the derailleur to budge. i was convinced i had done everything right and the shifter just didn't have enough load to pull the rd. i walked away from it all for a few days because i was pretty disappointed. i really wanted it to work. after reading that i'd have a tough time doing this i felt like i couldn't do it. i almost threw away the brifters.

today i started pulling the brifters off and reinstalled the downtube shifters and reinstalled the original brake levers. i missed riding the bike as it was so i wasn't really too sad about it today. i wanted to ride it, badly. it's a great stiff ride; responsive and fast, too.

i was pulling the shifter cables free, the left shifter first, then the right. the cable wouldn't come free of the right shifter and that bugged the hell out of me. i wanted that cable out so i could use it or save it for another project. i figured out how to dismantle the shifter and pulled it free.

i realized i never installed that cable properly. i hit the lever and the catch rolled around and i nearly screamed with joy. then i realized i'm stupid. oh boy was i stupid........

within 3 hours(i was taking my time and being deliberate with every step) i had the bike's original shifters and brake levers off and replaced with the downtube cable line boss guide doohickies(WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY CALLED?!??!) and the brifters back on with brake cables ran and tightened, shifter cables <i><b>properly</i></b> installed this time and tried shifting.

it frigging worked. this time i did yell out in joy and pumped my fist. i had dropped all hope of pulling this project off only to have it all suddenly come together in one day.

there's still a little fine tuning to do, but it works. it frigging works and it rides great. i love this bike.
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Old 07-01-13, 10:01 PM
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Pibber, You aren't the first nor the last to discover that one can install, but not remove a cable from a STI shifter that wasn't completely homed prior to installing the cable...I'm one.

I do suggest finding a metal stepped housing ferrule for the chain stay side of the RD cable. I'm having trouble finding one for my '88 SR500 so good luck. If I come across any I'll let you know.

Brad

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Old 07-01-13, 10:09 PM
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well, it was homed. it was in there and it wasn't coming out until i took the shifter apart. that was scary...great learning experience, though. yeah, a metal ferrule probably wouldn't be a bad idea. thanks for the heads up, now and the possible future. if i find one, i'll drop you line as well
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Old 07-01-13, 10:42 PM
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Good job have fun riding again, I have one of these SR500's and did some upgrading to it once also.

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Old 07-02-13, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by JTGraphics View Post
Good job have fun riding again, I have one of these SR500's and did some upgrading to it once also.
nice! question: are those the original bars? i see you've still got the original stem in so i'm curious if you were able to find some modern drops that fit.
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Old 07-02-13, 03:26 PM
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Old 07-02-13, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
We speak php here, use [i] and [b].

gotcha! i'm familiar with rudimentary html from chat rooms in the past, but i haven't used it in a while. the windows here resemble them. learning the ropes, yeah?
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