RubeRad

So I had this ca 1970 Ideale leather saddle sitting on a bike that never gets ridden, and I thought I'd try it out on the CrossCheck, see if leather is as amazing as all the brookophiles say.



But, it's not too comfy. I'm pretty sure the issue is sagging; no matter the angle I set it at, I can feel very hard and uncomfortable the metal backplate, or the metal nose, I can't seem to get a good 'banana hammock' goin on. I screwed the tension bolt from being about 1cm from the end, to about 2cm from the end, I stopped there because that seemed like kind of a radical adjustment, and it helped a little, but not a lot.

So I assume what I'm dealing with is sag. Note the light portions of leather on the top of the saddle showing where the leather is bending over the end of the backplate)

I was planning on getting some SNOseal at some point, since the surface looks kinda cracky, but if I apply that, will it soften even more? Is there anything to apply to the leather that would tighten it up?

Can I just keep crankin on that tension bolt until it feels good, or do I need to ease the tension up gradually?

If I reach the end of the bolt, can I screw it down, and mcguyver some kind of collar/spacer to give me more tensioning ability, or would the leather be stretched beyond all recourse at that point?

davidad

The adjustment should be such that the rear is a little higher than the middle. The nose may point up. If the saddle sags you can drill holes at the bottom and lace them together.

RubeRad

Thanks, those tips are helpful. That explains why so many peoples' leather saddles looked nose-up to me, if the real point is rear vs middle.

And yes, my flaps are pretty generous, so I could quite probably lace them together. I guess something like leather boot laces would be best?

Bjforrestal

If my nose isn't tilted up on my brooks I slide off the front, 1 or 2 notches back from level is perfect for me...tension, why not try half turns if the 1 cm adjustment helped?

RubeRad

I've heard that use of the tension screw should be quite cautious, like 1/4 turn is the end of the world. I don't want to rip the leather in half or something if it needs to be gradual.

Also, even though I'm riding on the metal front and back, the leather is by no means soft. I'm wondering if lack of care for decades has ruined the seat irreparably?

Bjforrestal

I'd be a little cautious, but it's sagging. So if its sagging its loose, right? If it was me I would condition it with anything that doesn't over soften it and do minute adjustments every couple days until its where it feels good, or buy a new saddle. Again thats just what i would do. Sure wouldn't ride an uncomfortable saggy saddle for fear of tearing it. Full disclosure, I have 2 brooks saddles and have never performed an adjustment because I haven't had to. As son as I feel too saggy i will, but won't wait 30 or 40 years like the original owner of your saddle I've never owned an old saggy saddle but if I did that's what I would do

Altbark

The reality is that a saddle built in 1970 has done its duty and probably should be retired. They don't last forever. Al

TheReal Houdini

IME suspended leather saddles have a very small sweet spot, you've got to find it and stay there. I move fore and aft on my foam and plastic saddles quite a bit, not so on leather. +1 on the slightly upturned nose. Stick with it a while longer. I had put thousands of happy miles on a B-17 and then swapped out my seat post to get a touch more setback. It took a lot of fiddling over several hundred miles to rediscover the sweet spot.

kris7047th

I just bought a new Brooks saddle yesterday and it came with a wrench to tighten underneath the nose. I was told to be careful not to over tighten it .. in your case it can split the leather. Make sure you use a good leather conditioner before you tighten it. If the leather is dry it will crack/split from the pressure. I have had horses in the past and three kids showed them for years .. I always bought used/misused saddles that were high quality when new. I knew the leather was high quality and worth the effort to restore. I picked up a bone dry, mildewed smelling Keifer dressage saddle for $450 back in 1994 and restored it. You would never know it today as it is as good as new today and getting used. Saddles are saddles whether on a horse or on a bike. The same care is required for both. I like using Lexol for the restoration https://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail.h...Fe4-Mgod-GsALA

and Black Rock for the top coat for all leather products .. https://www.valleyvet.com/GetThumbnai...=225&H=300&z=2

The Black Rock keeps moisture out .. protects and you won't slide on the seat as you will with other leather products.

I advise .. don't use that saddle until the leather has been properly restored.

kris7047th

Not true! It should serve a lifetime if properly cared for.

kris7047th

Apply a high quality leather conditioner like Lexol from the underside of the saddle as well as the top side using your fingers to get it to penetrate. The warmth of your fingers (no gloves) rub it in .. let the saddle set and re apply. Do this over how many days it will take to bring back the life of the leather. Then apply something like the Black rock as a topcoat for protection and a *seat grip* that reduces the slickness & sliding.

Trust me on this .. You do this and that saddle will look like new .. better as it's beauty will come to life!

You might be able to slip a leather strip wide enough for support underneath along the frame.

JohnDThompson 

From the picture, the saddle appears to be in quite good shape. My experience is that leather is quite durable and lasts for decades. I have six Brooks saddles here; the oldest is from 1967 and still in regular use (it's on my most-ridden bike); the newest from 1995.

1967 Brooks Professional:

RubeRad

The saddle, while old, has done less than 1000mi of duty.

RubeRad

Well that's what's confusing. It is not by any means loose or floppy, it is quite rigid. I moves very little when I press with my fingers. It is only my big fat arse that can make it sag apparently.


Well, the point of this exercise is that this is a saddle I already have. Some day in the distant future, I will have waited long enough that I feel justified in dropping >$100 on a Selle Anatomica Titanico X. But in the meantime I will either get this saddle back in shape, or switch back to my Selle Gel Flite Ti, which I am happy enough with.

RubeRad

That's interesting. I am indeed trying to find that sweet spot, but so far everything I've tried has me feeling both the backplate and the nose simultaneously; I'm trying to get my sitbones in the hammock, but so far no joy.

I think lacing may be the key.

RubeRad

Lexol, that's a new one on me! And it's appealing that it comes cheaper-per-volume because it is intended for horse-saddles. I wish I knew somebody with a horse, they would probably just give me a few ounces, I don't want to have a gallon of that stuff knocking around my garage for the next 40 years.

I'm not sure what you mean here. Wouldn't it have to be riveted or bonded to make a difference?

kris7047th

You can buy Lexol in small sizes, not just by the gallon. As for slipping some leather underneath, I would use a leather glue to adhere.

fietsbob

I dont see sagging . a saddle is by definition not flat.. take a Profile side view ..
all I see is dimples from it breaking is to your sit bones.

I have a wax treated Brooks, I Proofide treated it, 30 years ago, .. it is fine.

Alternative .. Snow Seal .. or maybe even bee's-wax Melted soaks in nicely .. saddle off , upside down .. at 100F In Oven.

RubeRad

I guess this is part of my question though; wouldn't proofide/snoseal/beeswax treatment soften the saddle and exacerbate the problem?

Grand Bois

Lexol is sold in small quantities at auto parts stores and new car dealers. It's great fo leather car seats. I've never used it in a bike saddle.

fietsbob

Not that I have noticed , there are other things that will ..

My heat melted wax absorption treatment was Once , in the late 70's, saddle New.

and I've lived in the Oregon Pac NW Coast and toured in Wet Northwestern Europe on it.

Altbark

The actual mileage on the saddle has little to do with whether it will still work for you. Has it had a good life? I have a couple of Brooks saddles that should truly last me a lifetime but I take very good care of them. 1970 is getting on there. Can the saddle be saved? Maybe, maybe not. It's not just a piece of leather covering a hard surface but something that is under tension in use. It will have a definite life. Al

RubeRad

Not at all. It has sat in a garage for most of it, sat outside for a few months recently. So as you say, I am considering the saddle to be a write-off. Either I can get it into a usable condition, or nothing lost.

RubeRad

Hey, that's good to know. I've got two cars with leather seats, so I could get more use out of it.

Shepp30 

That is why care should be taken with what you use on your saddle. The Proofide, according to the Brooks Web Site conditions without over softening, if applied conservatively and only a couple of times per season - unless harsh riding environments warrant more frequent applications. I have a large tin that I keep in the freezer, I can't imagine that I would ever have to purchase another, unless I accumulate multiple leather saddles :-)