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Campy Veloce Brifters and Avid Shorty 6 Brakes

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Campy Veloce Brifters and Avid Shorty 6 Brakes

Old 08-10-14, 01:16 PM
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jmh1313
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Campy Veloce Brifters and Avid Shorty 6 Brakes

I'm trying to run Campy Veloce brifters with Avid Shorty 6 brakes on a Surly LHT frame. I've read on some forums that they're compatible, but I'm having trouble with the setup.

The rear brake is grabbing the wheel okay, but the lever feels really loose and I have to pull it all the way into the handlebar to get enough force. I've tried using both high and low yoke angles, but I'm having the same problem with each. Can anyone help me out? Thanks.
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Old 08-10-14, 02:01 PM
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While we tend to think of all canti brakes having cable response similar to road calipers, this isn't true. It varies within a range brand/model to brand. It also changes with the length of the yoke (crossover) cable and distance from shoe to pivot.

I'm not a fan of the link systems that run the main cable to the brake, and prefer the traditional arm to arm yoke, with the main cable ending at the carrier. This gives you maximum freedom to adjust leverage and travel response to your needs and tastes.

Also the horizontal distance from the pivot to rim factors into this, and sometimes it can be necessary to space the shoe inboard on the brake to have it make contact on the rim before the brake arm passes top dead center (12 o'clock).

I can't help you beyond this because I don't know enough specific info, but if you can get it to work decently, a photo showing the brake arm and shoe in contact with the rim (one side only taken from side so the arm angle shows) will be a big help.
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Old 08-10-14, 03:10 PM
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Thanks for your reply. Here are a couple of pictures. I hope they're helpful.

I have the pads toed in quite a bit, and they're grabbing okay. I can't get the cable any tighter without the pads rubbing. In the second you'll see that the lever is depressed until it's hitting the handlebar.

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Old 08-10-14, 03:19 PM
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OK start by reducing toe-in to near zero, since any toe-in comes at the expense of travel lost between first contact and firmly flat. Next, adjust the linkage (shorten) until it's symmetrical, pulling out as much slack as possible with the brake opening about 1/16" or so on each side when you let go. If you can't achieve symmetry with the short link, try the other. Or buy a crossover yoke and carrier, which allows you maximum adjustment freedom.

BTW- if this doesn't solve it, the photo I'd need to see to advise specifics is taken along the tire so I can see the brake and cables cleanly from the side.
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Old 08-10-14, 03:46 PM
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Your first photo clearly shows you have too much slack in the cable, about 20mm. Just tighten it up until there's no bare cable by the right arm with the brakes relaxed. (You don't have too much toe in.)
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Old 08-10-14, 04:36 PM
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The cable in the picture is as tight as possible. That's with the shorter link wire. I tried the longer one and reduced the toe a bit, and it's getting closer to where I want it. The lever still feels a little loose, but at least I don't have to pull it all the way to the handlebars anymore.

The housings I'm using are the same length and curve as what I've always used for calipers on road bikes. Could that be affecting the setup I have at all?
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Old 08-10-14, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by jmh1313 View Post
The cable in the picture is as tight as possible. That's with the shorter link wire. I tried the longer one and reduced the toe a bit, and it's getting closer to where I want it. The lever still feels a little loose, but at least I don't have to pull it all the way to the handlebars anymore.

The housings I'm using are the same length and curve as what I've always used for calipers on road bikes. Could that be affecting the setup I have at all?
Cable length doesn't change anything, but the longer run means more flex in the system for any given amount of force. That's why rear brakes never have the same solid feel as fronts. Since you're getting closer, it's now a matter of dialing it in. Because of the loss to flex be very thorough about making sure the cable run is as straight as possible, and the lead-in to each stop is straight. If, for example, you see the housing moving sideways as you squeeze the lever, that's a sign of poor seating at the stop.

If all else fails, get it as good as you can, then take my advice and change the arrangement to the classic one, and put it back together with a shorter yoke.

BTW- Linkage setups usually (always?) allow you to slide them down to achieve symmetry in the "Y" arrangement. This should be done before the cable is pulled to the arm and cinched. I think you'll do better with the shorter link, if you slide it to proper symmetry.

Unlike my compadre, I don't think your cable is slack, just not arranged properly.
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Old 08-10-14, 06:56 PM
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Lots of different opinions on this other thread: Properly set up cantilever brakes

It seems that the answer is "it depends". Getting cantilevers to work well seems complicated.
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Old 08-10-14, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by rm -rf View Post
Lots of different opinions on this other thread: Properly set up cantilever brakes

It seems that the answer is "it depends". Getting cantilevers to work well seems complicated.
Like so many other things, it's complicated in some ways, but easy once you know how.
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Old 08-11-14, 03:39 AM
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To me it looks like the first image sshows the quick-release ortion of the cable to low.
shouldn't the button that's above the brake arm be the button that's held by the brake arm? That'd allow you to remove that bit of bare cable on the right brake arm.

FWIW, I too prefer the crossover cable and cable hanger to what you have. I find it makes adjusting and/or dialing in cantilevers so much easier.

Cheers from Miele Man
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Old 08-11-14, 11:13 AM
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I straightened out the cable a little more, and it's gotten better. Not great, but better. This is my first time installing center-pulls, so it could just take some finesse.

If it's still not up to snuff, I'll replace the link cable with a classic setup like you guys have mentioned.

Thank you all for your help.
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Old 08-11-14, 07:08 PM
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An update for those interested: I removed a 1 mm washer behind the shoe so the pad hits the rim at a slightly different angle. That made a huge difference, so I'm happy with what I have now.
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Old 08-11-14, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by jmh1313 View Post
An update for those interested: I removed a 1 mm washer behind the shoe so the pad hits the rim at a slightly different angle. That made a huge difference, so I'm happy with what I have now.
Now you're thinking like a mechanic. You saw an issue with the shoe strike angle and addressed it to your advantage. I'm surprised that there wasn't enough movement available with the convex/concave washers, but id the change works for you then it's the right move.
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