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updating my cranks & BB

Old 11-05-14, 02:31 PM
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thehammerdog
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updating my cranks & BB

I am going to replace my old school BB & Crank with newer BB & Crank but not sure how to figure out the proper width for New BB. Do I just measure the old one?
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Old 11-05-14, 02:43 PM
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The crank specs should tell you what length BB you need.
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Old 11-05-14, 03:08 PM
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Seller at a bike shop can see what you need and the basic idea is get the Crank & BB together .

a variety of designs exist crank comes In To meet the shorter bb or the spindle is longer because the crank is requiring it.

chain line result can be the same ..
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Old 11-05-14, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by thehammerdog View Post
I am going to replace my old school BB & Crank with newer BB & Crank but not sure how to figure out the proper width for New BB. Do I just measure the old one?
If by a newer crank you mean a external BB one, the BB spindle is a fixed distance regardless of frame, so you don't need to even consider it. For a question like this, it really helps if you ID what parts you are looking to go from and to.
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Old 11-05-14, 03:20 PM
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If you have a traditional threaded bottom bracket made in the past ~30 or 40 years, there are really only three possibilities:

English threaded 68mm shell width
English threaded 73 mm shell width
Italian threaded

Measure the width of the bottom bracket shell (the part of the frame into which the bottom bracket threads). If it is 68mm wide, then it is almost definitely standard English threads. This is by far the most common configuration. If it is 73 mm wide, it is the wider MTB specific English threads. If it is 70 mm wide, it is most likely Italian threads.

Other much less common configurations are French and Swiss threading, and Raleigh threading. You can't really get 'modern' bottom brackets to fit these.

Then, 'modern' cranksets generally come with, or fit only one, type of bottom bracket bearings. The spindle is usually built in to the crank. Get the bottom bracket bearings that have the proper threads in the style your crank and spindle are designed for.

Read this:
Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Bicycle Bottom Bracket Crib Sheet
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Old 11-05-14, 07:23 PM
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OK boys. I took the BB off tried to replace it with an old school square BB shimano I had and the BB is larger, the shimano BB slid right into the BB shell of the bike. So I clearly have something odd. Any ideas? I have a sweet Dura Ace crank I wanted to put on it.
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Old 11-05-14, 10:41 PM
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Is the inner face of the BB shell threaded? Can you take pictures of the bottom bracket/bearings that you pulled out of it?
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Old 11-06-14, 04:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Raiden View Post
Is the inner face of the BB shell threaded? Can you take pictures of the bottom bracket/bearings that you pulled out of it?
To be clear the bikes BB area is threaded and has a wider opening than the Shimano BB I tries to install. Diameter of the actual area is larger so that the BB & threads slid in with out hitting the frame. 80's era Italian bike.
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Old 11-06-14, 05:18 AM
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Originally Posted by thehammerdog View Post
To be clear the bikes BB area is threaded and has a wider opening than the Shimano BB I tries to install. Diameter of the actual area is larger so that the BB & threads slid in with out hitting the frame. 80's era Italian bike.
Your still missing key information, as in what BB/crank you are using, from what you have given, it indicates you have a 70mm Italian BB shell, but knowing what came out, and photos would really help as well, Otherwise we are all doing a best guess...
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Old 11-06-14, 05:49 AM
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+1. It's unwise to acquire a part before confirming compatibility. We've also wasted some effort because you did not first explain that your "newer" BB was still a square taper. Finally, you did not have to take apart the BB to find out it's Italian. As noted above simply measuring the length of the actual shell would have given you a good indication.
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Old 11-06-14, 08:21 AM
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Here according to Sheldon Brown this is my issue.
NOW WHAT?
I am guessing I am limited and will not get away cheaply.
[TABLE="class: tgrid, width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TH]Italian
36 mm X 24 tpi
(1.417" x 1.06 mm)[/TH]
[TD]British/I.S.O. cups fall through[/TD]
[TH]Made to Fit[/TH]
[TD="colspan: 3, align: center"]Italian shells are larger diameter, all other size cups fall right through, threads will not engage.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
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Old 11-06-14, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by thehammerdog View Post
NOW WHAT?
Who knows. You still haven't ID's specifically what you have, crank, BB, frame etc, without specific information, no one can really help you.

If you do need an Italian BB, the cost should be no more than a English threaded one.
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Old 11-06-14, 09:21 AM
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Sounds like you're messing with your Grandis. Yes, it should have an Italian threaded BB. Most of my bikes are Italian threaded. It's no big deal, except don't be screwing up a nice Classic & Vintage ride

You can use any standard cartridge BB, or an X-style BB. Just don't be messing with the PressFits, BB30's and the like.
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Old 11-06-14, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by jimc101 View Post
Who knows. You still haven't ID's specifically what you have, crank, BB, frame etc, without specific information, no one can really help you.

If you do need an Italian BB, the cost should be no more than a English threaded one.
Ok, here is the info you so much desire. I have old school Italian bike "grandis" with Galli group all gold cranks/ BB, brakes nice bike, Italian style.
Now that you know this how can you help me?
The crank arms are only 165's too short for me, it has standard size chain rings. I have an older Dura Ace & a Ultegra Crank set I wanted to put on for the length but as I said it did not fit....Now that I know what I have and threads required I will shop around.
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Old 11-06-14, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by thehammerdog View Post
Ok, here is the info you so much desire. I have old school Italian bike "grandis" with Galli group all gold cranks/ BB, brakes nice bike, Italian style.
Now that you know this how can you help me?
The crank arms are only 165's too short for me, it has standard size chain rings. I have an older Dura Ace & a Ultegra Crank set I wanted to put on for the length but as I said it did not fit....Now that I know what I have and threads required I will shop around.
What age are your "older" DA and Ultegra cranks? (Model # would be helpful)
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Old 11-06-14, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by thehammerdog View Post
Ok, here is the info you so much desire.
It's not that I desire it, it's just you have given so little info to work on, it's all best guesses, even now, just saying older Dura Ace is meaningless without knowing the model; 7400, 7700, 7800 etc, with so many different products and specs out there, you need to be real specific for accurate help to be given.
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Old 11-06-14, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by jimc101 View Post
.

If you do need an Italian BB, the cost should be no more than a English threaded one.
+1 - but you need to make sure you get a BB that has the correct length spindle. As you have found Sheldon's site (and to give proper credit posters here ALREADY told you what the problem was) look up info on BB's and spindle length. As you are not going a great job at providing info perhaps you should do some of the work yourself. Contrary to popular believe those of us who have been working on bikes a long time do not know every specification and compatibility - we in many cases just look up what you could have looked up yourself.
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Old 11-06-14, 03:22 PM
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Question. What about the spindles? I understand that not all square tapers are the same. ISO vs JIS.
Perhaps I will just clean and put the old ones back on.
I was hoping for a easy upgrade.
Thanks guys.
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Old 11-06-14, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by thehammerdog View Post
Question. What about the spindles? I understand that not all square tapers are the same. ISO vs JIS.
Perhaps I will just clean and put the old ones back on.
I was hoping for a easy upgrade.
Thanks guys.
AFAIK, all Shimano cranks are JIS, and all Shimano BBs are JIS. If you get a Shimano BB with Italian threads and the correct length spindle, you have everything you need.,
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Old 11-06-14, 04:18 PM
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7200 and 7400 Dura-Ace take 113mm italian.
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