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Carlton Giro d'Italia help

Old 03-16-17, 02:39 PM
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Carlton Giro d'Italia help

The other day I pickup a faded old Carlton Giro d'Italia. I am unable to post pictures...to new, so this thread might be completely useless...
The orange frame has Carlton on the down tube in white lettering w/ black outline.
Carlton headbadge
Blue Giro d'italia sticker in the middle of the seat post tube.
Frame has the "fastback seat stay" (like Raleigh professional)
Frame has a serial number of Y9XXX (also has 726 and a B stamped on the bottom bracket)
No chrome on fork or rear rear of frame - all paint
Forks have the sloped top crown
Cranks are TA - original?
Zeus front and rear drop outs
Weinmann brakes

Any idea of what year, with a "Y" serial number. I could not find any info on the net.
Feels like a light frame - Reynold 531 maybe?

Thank you for the help!!

I am excited...this will make a nice addition to my current collection which includes a 1972 Gitane TDF and 1970 ish Zeus

Last edited by sjstretch; 03-18-17 at 10:11 PM.
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Old 03-16-17, 03:29 PM
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Make a few posts in the into thread/chat it up. 6 or so....come back to this thread and try posting pics. The only y designation I found for carlton cycles was 1937!!!! Pics are a must. Seat post size/components and pics of all mechs would be great. Can't wait to see it. Welcome to the forums
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Old 03-16-17, 03:44 PM
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-----

Welcome to the forum sjstretch!

Thank you for sharing this most interesting cycle.

As to tubing used in the frame one easy check you could make is to measure the diameter of the seat post/seat tube interior.

The manufacturer employed the Zeus Gran Sport dropout set on several different quality models in the ~1965-70 time. Catalogue page below.

Hope you are able to post some photos of the bicycle so readers will be able to give you more information about it.

Thanks for posting.



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Old 03-16-17, 06:15 PM
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The Giro d'Italia was reportedly introduced by Carlton for the 1965 model year. If we work backwards from known early 1970s Raleigh Pro serial numbers, then Y would be 1964, assuming they didn't skip any letters. Certainly, the first of the 1965 models would have been built in late 1964, so there is the probability of it being a first year Gd'I. Also, the early models do not appear to have any chrome, based on extant catalogues, though they do mention Campagnolo dropouts. The Gd'I is not present in the 1970 catalogue on the Bulgier site. See here: ON THE DROPS: Raleigh Professionals Marks I-V, 1968-1981
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Old 03-16-17, 06:24 PM
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I'm have the frame measurements and will post when I get back to the house. Pictures are ready just need enough posts.

It has the high end Zeus dropout.

More info later soon

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Old 03-16-17, 07:58 PM
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More info

Tube measurements...
Head-tube - 31.8 mm
Top tube - 25.5 mm
Bottom tube - 28.7 mm (look like a 2U stamped on tube)
Seat post - ID 27.4 mm (maybe 27.2 hard to tell) it has a 27.2 seat post
- OD 28.7 mm

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Old 03-16-17, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by sjstretch
The other day I pickup a faded old Carlton Giro d'Italia. I am unable to post pictures...to new, so this thread might be completely useless...
Put your photos on a photo-hosting site, like Flickr or Imgur, and link them here. You don't need 10 posts to do that, and the photos will likely be bigger.
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Old 03-17-17, 06:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Kevindale
Put your photos on a photo-hosting site, like Flickr or Imgur, and link them here. You don't need 10 posts to do that, and the photos will likely be bigger.
I did try that with Imgur and Photobucket, but I still get the notice of a 10 post requirement. I have posted pictures on many other forms before, so think I just need to get my post count up. I am happy to do that. I do think that these types of requirements result in a better forum.

Thank you for the help!
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Old 03-17-17, 07:27 AM
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Pictures









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Old 03-17-17, 09:47 AM
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You can get around the 10-post thing by directly placing the link into the post body, instead of thru the little icon above. Not that it matters now, you've got the photos working. Your frame has that red metallic paint with very UV-sensitive red on top of the metallic base, like my Tommasini. Actually, the red on yours looks both UV sensitive and very easily rubbed off, since a lot of it is gone from the bottom of some tubes.

It's a very cool frame. What are your plans for it?
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Old 03-17-17, 10:26 AM
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Plans, plans...I am not sure yet.

Part of me wants to leave the paint as is.
Part of me wants to refinish it...

What I have been doing, as I get new old frames/bikes, is setting them up as single speeds to ride and enjoy. Then rounding up, cleaning and repairing the correct parts to get them back to stock or at a minimum period correct. All of this is time consuming and challenging.

I have so far, not found very much information on this bike and what would have been on it...so still researching

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Old 03-17-17, 10:28 AM
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I guess since this thread is in the "Whats it Worth" section. I should also ask what people feel the value of the frame is?
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Old 03-17-17, 12:27 PM
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-----

Frame's fastback seatlug is called a Brampton Victor.

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Old 03-17-17, 05:52 PM
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sjstretch -

The Y9XXX would indicate a 1967 build date according to Jerry Mortimer's chart located here.
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Old 03-18-17, 09:31 AM
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I would be inclined to give it though cleaning treat any rust then a nice wax polish and leave the original paint intact it is a great color and has nice petina which seems to go with the age of the bike. Since this is a late 60's foreign market none US bike you may not find much specific info on it. As for parts if you look at the Raliegh catalogs online from 66-68 for similar models this will give you idea of what components the bike had originally.
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Old 03-18-17, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by zukahn1
I would be inclined to give it though cleaning treat any rust then a nice wax polish and leave the original paint intact it is a great color and has nice petina which seems to go with the age of the bike. Since this is a late 60's foreign market none US bike you may not find much specific info on it. As for parts if you look at the Raliegh catalogs online from 66-68 for similar models this will give you idea of what components the bike had originally.
That's the treatment I went with on my faded Tommasini. It's not as old as yours, and not as faded, but the effect is similar. I love riding it and love looking at it. Doing a good cleaning and light polishing on the components, and new cables/tape really makes a difference.

I think the reasons given in the penultimate sentence quoted above is why you're not getting valuations -- what is this bike, what are the comps, what is the frame material, etc.? A accurate weight of the frame and the fork may help determine the quality of the tubing. If it fits you, and rides well, it's likely worth more to you than you could sell it for, unless you uncover more information.
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Old 03-18-17, 01:18 PM
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I would agree this bike is likely worth more to the OP than the market price. As 60's Raliegh/Carlton build with fastback seat stays and nicer dropouts and lugs it should have at least 531 main tubes and basically unknown fork and rear stay since they made this style of frame in both full 531db and 531 maintubes with Raliegh hi-ten fork and rear. As a project condition frame set with some nice parts I would say it's realistically worth $150-200 as shown figure $100-125 for the frame set and $75 for the parts mostly the crank.
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Old 03-18-17, 05:11 PM
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Love the headbadge!
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Old 03-18-17, 09:34 PM
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Thank you for the info...sounds like I got a good deal.

Cleaned it up today and waxed it. Just waiting on a crank puller, since I had to order one. Could not find my old one??

Fork is 1.85 lbs

I have seen a couple spot on the web, that indicate the extra three numbers "726" on the bottom bracket indicates a custom order bike. That is cool

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Old 03-19-17, 04:40 PM
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Crank arms appear quite long. Be they 180's? You asked in first post if chainset original. Likely not at 180 length.

Headset, from what can be seen, looks like it may be Brampton Aletet.

Pedals resemble Lyotard 45CA.

Look forward to following as you progress with the cleaning and build.

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Old 03-19-17, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by juvela
-----

Crank arms appear quite long. Be they 180's? You asked in first post if chainset original. Likely not at 180 length.

Headset, from what can be seen, looks like it may be Brampton Aletet.

Pedals resemble Lyotard 45CA.

Look forward to following as you progress with the cleaning and build.

-----
It is a Brampton headset stamped "made in England", "24", and "Brampton"

The crank arms are 170 - stamped on sprocket side arm.

Correct in the pedals

Thank you for the help
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Old 03-20-17, 05:01 PM
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Update...Weighed the frame at 2050 grams or 4.52 lbs.
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Old 03-21-17, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by sjstretch
It is a Brampton headset stamped "made in England", "24", and "Brampton"

The crank arms are 170 - stamped on sprocket side arm.

Correct in the pedals

Thank you for the help
Thank you for the response.

Puzzled why arms appear long. Perhaps a matter of perspective. What size are the chainwheels?

Crown may be from Harrington foundry.

Here is a closeup of the Brampton Aletet. Both serrated and unserrated versions were produced. It is a conventional cup and cone design. Ball size is 5/32".







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Old 03-21-17, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by juvela
Thank you for the response.

Puzzled why arms appear long. Perhaps a matter of perspective. What size are the chainwheels?

Crown may be from Harrington foundry.

Here is a closeup of the Brampton Aletet. Both serrated and unserrated versions were produced. It is a conventional cup and cone design. Ball size is 5/32".

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The outer chain ring is a 50 tooth and inside is a 40. The headset is the unserrated version.

Thank you

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Old 03-26-17, 07:28 PM
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Photos of the single speed setup...current weight is 21.9 lbs
Rides very nice, geared 50/24 at the moment with 700/28 Ultra Sports

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