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Could use some help identifying Raleigh SC parts/best practices

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Could use some help identifying Raleigh SC parts/best practices

Old 05-01-17, 12:59 PM
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creativeanomaly
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Could use some help identifying Raleigh SC parts/best practices

... for potential, piecemeal repairs. Still rides OK, but needs some TLC.

Red and pearl 1975 Super Course Mk II
Stronglight crank with 52/42 chainrings
Huret derailleurs
Weinmann brakes - 610 front, 750 rear (with original red rubber pads)
original Weinmann rims (27x1.25); tires have been replaced with 27x1.125 Kenda's

here's my initial checkdown list:
#1 concern is replacing cable to front derailleur, which doesn't look like it's anything especially difficult.
#2 would be chainrings on front - some teeth are really worn down. I realize this might also mean replacing more than just the rings; still doing my homework.
#3 is I'm looking for suggestions on refurbishing some slightly rusted parts, or replacing them. I'm looking at bolts and stuff in random places. (example - the bolt holding the shifting toggles is rusty, but the rest of the assembly looks fine. I'd replace the bolt, but would like to restore by cleaning rust and maybe handpaint small bits of the toggle bracket/toggles)
#4 would be any helpful tips that I'm slowly coming across, but you've accumulated already - thread counts, hidden difficulties, any advanced-user tips for a relative n00b.

Feel free to reply with links - I'm still working through searches on this site to assemble resources specific to this bike, so anything helps.

Thanks in advance,
Adam
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Old 05-01-17, 01:05 PM
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Hello Adam,

Regarding chainset -

Factory specification was for a NERVAR Sport cotterless steel set. Many examples were upgraded at the factory to a NERVAR Star set. A few were upgraded to a TA set. Have never seen one with a Stronglight set. Might be of interest to check the bottom bracket fittings to see who is their manufacturer.
Likely it represents a replacement so do not hesitate to change things out as required by your needs.

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Last edited by juvela; 05-01-17 at 01:08 PM. Reason: spellin' & punctuatin'
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Old 05-01-17, 01:52 PM
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creativeanomaly
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Originally Posted by juvela View Post
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Hello Adam,

Regarding chainset -

Factory specification was for a NERVAR Sport cotterless steel set. Many examples were upgraded at the factory to a NERVAR Star set. A few were upgraded to a TA set. Have never seen one with a Stronglight set. Might be of interest to check the bottom bracket fittings to see who is their manufacturer.
Likely it represents a replacement so do not hesitate to change things out as required by your needs.

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Thanks juvela! I'll start breaking it down now and will see what I can find. the name on every part I can see is StrongLight.
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Old 05-01-17, 02:04 PM
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The balance of the fittings mentioned corresponds with factory specification. The specification Huret gear ensemble was called Challenger. Some examples got a factory upgrade to Jubilee. Some came through with a gear ensemble which was a mix of Challenger and Jubilee. A few lucky owners received both the crankset and gear upgrades.

Have fun with the bike. Take your time and go slowly.

Bottom bracket thread is standard BSC/ISO (fixed cup is left hand thread). Steerer/headset is likely 26TPI ("Raleigh") thread.

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Old 05-01-17, 05:15 PM
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creativeanomaly
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Just a bit more info... through a little more online research the crankset is a StrongLight 93 SC cyclocross. still unsure of the bracket fittings since i need to pick up some metric tools to disassemble, but I'll share it when I know!
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Old 05-02-17, 06:53 AM
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If you have a Stronglight 93 crankset you will need the correct crank puller - the overwhelming majority of those used the original Stronglight 23.35mm diameter puller, which is a larger diameter than the 23mm T.A. side on the back of the old Park tool, and use of the Park tool risks stripping the extraction threads. If they used the the original crank bolts, you'll need either an original Stronglight tool, a high quality thin-walled 16mm socket, or one of the long-discontinued 16mm Park crank bolt wrenches (look around, I got mine for half of nothing at the LBS) to remove it.

It's a magnificent crankset, BUT it requires 122mm BCD rings. Those are still out there, but you'll have to dig around some. Haunting ebay is one method, and you cannot imagine how much I miss the old bike shop scene of 15 years ago, when you could buy a big ol' box of this stuff for a pittance. The presence of this crankset probably means you have a Super Course with a standard English threaded bottom bracket, so you could (should you so desire) fit any crankset and BB you desire that takes more easily available rings.

The stock cranks on those were steel Nervar Sport cotterless cranksets, and as juvela mentioned, many of them were upgraded to the alloy Nervar Star cranks. The Stronglights might be on the stock Nervar BB, which would move the right cranks in a trifle from where they would be on a Stronglight BB, I think.

The only potential threading issue you'll run into is probably the headset. Apparently, Raleigh used their proprietary 26 tpi headsets on SCs, though it is worth checking to be sure. They usually just need servicing, though, and new grease and bearings and they're good to go. If the bottom fails, find a cheap Tange headset and use the bottom half with the original top.

It occurs to me - have you been here yet? Welcome to the rabbit hole if you go there! https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...er-course.html
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Old 05-02-17, 10:45 AM
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Thanks! Holy s#!% that's indeed a rabbit hole; i'll skim that over the course of the next decade.

Thanks, too, for the detail on chainring size and their scarcity. I'm going to get some 16mm sockets and see if I can't get the thing apart for more detail for juvela, but would either of you suggest just replacing the entire crankset/bb assembly with something more modern and easier to service? I'm not sure if I intend to go the vintage rebuild route with this or make it my daily driver, but at the moment, it's my only driver. were I to go full 'restore', I'd need some new hardware to replace rusty bits, and i'm imagining that they'll be harder to find than the chainrings.
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Old 05-02-17, 11:30 AM
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On the one hand, the Stronglight uses a "technically" obsolete removal tool and harder to source chain rings. Both tool and rings are out there and if one is patient bargains can be found. I still have a set on my favorite zippy bike, a '71 Gitane set up as a fixed-gear and they are lovely and work beautifully.

Should you choose to replace it, pretty much any standard BB and cranks will fit. A trawl through the rabbit hole will provide a sense of all the bits people have successfully used on this model, which is revered for its flexibilty.

Keep the brakes - they have sufficient reach and with good pads, cables and housing work as well or better than most. Service the hubs and if they are still good true the rims. Snobs sometimes mock the plain jane Weinmanns but they make for a nice full width tire that handles road shock well.

Which Huret deraiileurs do you have? Catalog spec is for Challenger which is allegedly an underrated underappreciated classic; some got upgraded to Jubilee, a nifty collectible in itself for its feathery weight and diminutive cuteness ....
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Old 05-02-17, 12:13 PM
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so, quick update on crankset condition.
I've got the 16mm bits and they fit fine inside the threads, but definitely still need the crank puller. As soon as I got close to it, I noticed that the pedal arm away from the chain is cracked, not quite all the way through, from the inside towards the outside on the 'bottom end' (away from the pedal). so that definitely needs to be replaced, as I'm betting that it won't be usable much longer. I'm going to try and order a crank puller, but I definitely need to pick a replacement solution before I totally take this apart so I can swap it out in a day and not be stuck on public transit while the bike is on the bench.

Brakes have been working fine, didn't have a plan to do any work on them. pads still have another 40 years of life in them according to their length of life so far. Hubs actually have been serviced already, by me, though I'm having trouble truing the wheels and I'm missing a spoke on the rear wheel.

as for derailleurs, rear is almost certainly Huret Challenger; i would assume front comes with it in a set? I'd include pictures, but I'm not allowed to yet. Too n00b.
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Old 05-02-17, 12:31 PM
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Regarding cracked crank arm -

This crack is likely radial from the pedal hole. The 93 launched in 1967 and for the first few years the distal end of the arm had a heavy chamfer. Arrangement makes for a weakness at the pedal hole so many of these first generation examples fail there. After a few years the problem was recognised by the manufacturer and this area was beefed up. Model was discontinued ~1977 when it was supplanted by the 105.

The set in this photo is a mixed one with the right arm being "G1"/"Mk.I" and the left arm being "G2"/"Mk.II."



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Old 05-02-17, 12:37 PM
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thanks juvela - looks like I've got the G1, since the logo is apparent. the crack begins at the interior moving to the exterior, towards the dust cover, but not all the way through.
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Old 05-02-17, 04:21 PM
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Regarding chainwheel replacement -

The 104 and 105 models also exhibit the 122mm bcd. However the teeth are cut differently on Stronglight sets from 1977 onwards. Up until 1977 teeth were cut from one side of the stock. So if one looks at a chainwheel in profile at the teeth one side is flat and the other stepped. Starting in 1977 teeth were cut from both sides of the stock. This means that the lands on the ends of the spider arms need to be thinner for these post-77 chainwheels. I do not recommend fitting them to the older arms with their thicker lands as there is a strong risk of the chain wedging between the two chainwheels.

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Old 05-04-17, 05:05 AM
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The '75 Super Course was spec'd with the Nervar Sport crank, but many came equipped with the Stringlight 93 also. If the bottom bracket bearings are smooth I think replacing the cranks would be the easiest most practical route. You can usually find a set on ebay for $60-75.

On small rusted parts I use some chrime polish with a brass bristle parts cleaning brush. Gets rid of most of the rust.
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Old 05-04-17, 07:02 AM
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From what I'm reading, your intent is to fix up and ride, not make this a wall-hanger. If so, find a LBS that will pull the crank for you. No sense in buying an obsolete tool to use once. IIRC standard bolt circle has gone to 135mm so I'd look for a crank using that standard. Your crank bearing/axle/cups should be checked for wear and regreased. List the uncracked half of the crank on an auction site and you'll likely recover the cost of the LBS pulling it for you.
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Old 05-04-17, 10:26 AM
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If your plan is for this to be a daily driver, I would suggest pulling cranks and BB out and replacing them with something less exotic. You might do well to look at 130 bcd cranksets, the Shimano standard that so many other companies used for years - especially Sugino. 135 bcd is pretty much Campagnolo and Miche and I can't think of anyone else, though T.A. and other make replacement rings in that size. Touring and early mtb cranks with 110/74 are awesome if you can find a good deal.

The Stronglight BB will sell on the big auction site; if the left arm is uncracked, it definitely will, because usually it's the right arm that is the orphan; the rings and chainring bolts will also sell.

I am curious, though - did they put the Stronglight crank on a Nervar cotterless BB? My latest crazy project involved buying a set of Nervar Sport cotterless cranks, which are contemporary with the Stronglights in question, and which take another obsolete size, 128 mm bcd. Following the suggestion put forth by others on the C&V forum, I widened the mount bolt holes on a set of 130 bcd rings inward about 1 mm each and fitted them successfully to the Nervars. Period correct, relatively cheap and readily available chainrings, and the Nervar uses the standard 22 mm crank tool. It would involve haunting eBay and using a Dremel, but it's one more option to consider ...
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