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Track frame ID help

Old 07-16-17, 07:56 PM
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Doriftopyret
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Track frame ID help

Hi all
I bought a track frame a while a back have slowly been building it.
It had already been resprayed by previous owner when I got it. And was stripped before he got it.
I've spent hours searching and have come up with nothing so thought I'd ask some experts.

The few things I do know are:

Looks to be Reynolds lugs (may be wrong)
60cm seat tube. 58cm top tube.
Shimano SFP10 dropouts.
British thread BB.
Seat post measures at about 26.0mm. Maybe 26.2mm. Maybe 26.4mm.
Only marking on the frame is the "150" on the BB shell.

I really would like some info on the frame. Especially a manufacturer. Would like to have some decals made up for it etc.

Any and all help welcomed.
Thanks.
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Old 07-16-17, 07:57 PM
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Will post some pictures shortly
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Old 07-17-17, 06:47 AM
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/152769757@N08/
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Old 07-17-17, 11:32 AM
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Those long point lugs and semi wrap seat stays make me think British. That's about all I got. Good luck!
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Old 07-19-17, 08:30 PM
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Well
I got the digital vernier on the seat tube.
It's definitely 26.2. Unsure if that makes things easier or harder though.
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Old 07-21-17, 08:56 PM
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-----

Sends mixed signals.

For a track frame late enough to be constructed with Shimano ends one would expect beefier seat stays and a somewhat tighter geometry. OTOH it is clearly not intended for training/mixed application as crown is not drilled and no tab has been added. Appears builder employed regular dimpled road chainstays when dimples would seem superfluous. Blades also appear to have a normal road ovality.

Pillar size suggestive of a PG tubeset.

Nicely done whatever it is.

-----
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Old 07-23-17, 11:20 PM
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Thanks

Seeing as it does have the Shimano drop outs what sort of age would I be looking at for it?
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Old 07-24-17, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Doriftopyret View Post
Thanks

Seeing as it does have the Shimano drop outs what sort of age would I be looking at for it?
Hello again Joshua,

The first use of Japanese frame building materials by western makers to any significant degree was ~1973-74. In terms of nations the two which made the greatest use of them early on were Belgium and the Netherlands.

From looking at the other clues present do not see how it could be much later than "1970's."

National possibilities - as mentioned by romperrr above the seat stay caps and longpoint shell would tend to suggest the possibility of a UK build. These features do not rule out other anglophone nations, nor even the low countries.

The frame's head lugs appear they may be a BOCAMA pattern. These are frequently, though not always, marked with the manufacturer's "BCM" hallmark on the front of the headlugs. It is sufficiently shallow that it sometimes disappears due to sanding, sandblasting and/or respraying. Attaching two photos of what it looks like. The first where the marking is nearly gone and the second where it is clear. You could check the frame under strong light to see if it is present. Unfortunately, this does nothing to advance and identification of the frame maker.





Suspect tubeset employed to construct frame to be non-Italian due to chainstay dimples. Italian dimples exhibit a sharp crease in the bottom as one might expect from a knife edge pressed into soft putty. Non-Italian dimples have a rounder bottom.

For a national origin I would encourage exploration of the possibility of a low countries build. Forum member @non-fixie is expert on the products of these lands. He may be able to comment and shed some illumination upon matters...

Paint finish question - in all the photos save the one of the dropouts the colour looks to be a metallic gold. In the dropout photo the colour shows as a metallic red. Is this due to ambient lighting? Something else?

Sorry forum has not been able to be of greater assistance with your question.

-----
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Old 07-24-17, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by juvela View Post
...The first use of Japanese frame building materials by western makers to any significant degree was ~1973-74. In terms of nations the two which made the greatest use of them early on were Belgium and the Netherlands.

From looking at the other clues present do not see how it could be much later than "1970's."

...Paint finish question - in all the photos save the one of the dropouts the colour looks to be a metallic gold. In the dropout photo the colour shows as a metallic red. Is this due to ambient lighting? Something else?...
Regarding the Shimano SFP rear track ends, they were produced 1975-1981 inclusive, possibly 1974. Curiously, track ends do not appear in the 1974 catalogue, despite other track components. The 1973 rear track ends are markedly different and the style changed again for 1982. Of course, it's always possibly that the builder had some in stock long after they were discontinued.

The colour looks like gold, faded to red at the stay and fork ends. Fade paint became popular in the late 1980s and I'm assuming it is a repaint from that period or newer.

Sorry, I can't help on the ID of frame.
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Old 07-24-17, 03:40 PM
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Thanks for the heads-up. That's a good-looking frame, even if it's a fixie.

Alas, track frames are not my area of expertise, and I've seen only very few close-up. I'll second @juvela in that the use of Japanese steel often points to Belgium as the country of origin. The fact that it apparently has a serial number might help narrow down the possible builders, although it could have been added by someone else, as quite a few Belgian shops produced 'blank' frames for others to brand (and sometimes number).

OTOH, given the unusual composition: could it perhaps have come from somewhere behind the former iron curtain?
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Old 07-24-17, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by juvela View Post
Paint finish question - in all the photos save the one of the dropouts the colour looks to be a metallic gold. In the dropout photo the colour shows as a metallic red. Is this due to ambient lighting? Something else?

Sorry forum has not been able to be of greater assistance with your question.

-----
The paint was actually done a couple of years ago by the guy I got it off. It's metallic gold that fades to red at the drop outs/fork ends.

Thanks for all the info. At least I have somewhat an idea about it.
Guess it will have to stay decal free in its build though haha.
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Old 07-24-17, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Doriftopyret View Post
The paint was actually done a couple of years ago by the guy I got it off. It's metallic gold that fades to red at the drop outs/fork ends.

Thanks for all the info. At least I have somewhat an idea about it.
Guess it will have to stay decal free in its build though haha.
Thanks to you and to @T-Mar for the information regarding the paint finish. It finally dawned on me dull "braine" just after posting what was going on there...

One thing you can check, if only to eliminate, is the interior of the frame's head tube. Good to examine that area to make sure that no headplate mounting fastener holes have been filled in. When present, the holes can be an aid to checking against any specific candidate head emblems.

You wrote in your initial post that BB had "British thread" but you did not mention shell width. There is such an animal as a 70mm BSC/ISO shell. If this were present it would support the idea of a possible Belgian origin but would not eliminate it if the width is 68mm.

Sorry the forum has not been able to help you more.

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Last edited by juvela; 07-24-17 at 05:27 PM. Reason: addition
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