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1972 Motobecane Grand Record

Old 10-17-18, 06:27 PM
  #1  
jfliii
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1972 Motobecane Grand Record

Is it worth the $350 with the frame in the shape it is? Also, didn't these come with stronglight cranks?

seattle.craigslist.org/see/bik/d/motobecane-grand-record-with/6725502698.html
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Old 10-17-18, 06:50 PM
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https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/b...725502698.html




Motobecane catalog (1970-1972)
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Old 10-17-18, 07:09 PM
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A lot of bikes tend to gravitate to around $300 or so. I'm not surprised to see a mixed groupset with Campy shifters/derailleurs, ??? crankset, and ??? brakes.

Hmmm... The specs suggest Universal brakes, but I think those may well be the Weinmann in the photos.

It looks like the 1973 catalog lists Weinmann center pulls.
Motobecane catalog (1973)

Dates that sellers put on ads are often off just a little bit. And, catalogs may also be off some, especially if Motobecane made one catalog for multiple years.

Not much wear on that seat, but the paint has seen better days, and likely will get worse over time. I have a Mirage that the paint looks just about like that. Yet, Mom's Grand Jubilee looks almost immaculate. But, I wonder if Motobecane has had issues with the paint, especially if the bike has seen some sun and weather.

I'd rather see the bike for a little less. $250??? But, truthfully, at $350, you're not too far off on the price.
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Old 10-17-18, 07:15 PM
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I think the bike is high but not crazy high. I paid considerably less for mine which is in better shape paint wise but I live in Des Moines, not Seattle.

This is the thread on my find:

Help w/Motobecane Grand Record find

Plus yours has a brooks leather saddle in good condition and what look to be original pedals whereas mine did not

The bike is likely worth around $400 fixed up and $300 as is. Still this is a nice bike and they don't come up everyday.
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Old 10-17-18, 07:46 PM
  #5  
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Of course, as with everything, make sure the bike actually fits.

That ad says 21".

I was guessing 52 to 53cm.

I'm a bit flexable on bike sizes, but I'd guess the bike would best fit someone in the range of 5'4" to 5'8" or so.
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Old 10-17-18, 08:01 PM
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bought mine (77) a couple weeks ago on ebay and got it delivered to Houston and a replacement NR rear derailleur installed for less, so I think it's a bit high. Also, I'm not seeing any of the original decals or accent stripes Has it been repainted?

In a discussion about 70s Motobecanes not too long ago, one of the experienced folks commented that the Grand Records sometimes came in with Nervar cranks, so it may be original to the bike, though not matching any catalog.
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Old 10-17-18, 08:24 PM
  #7  
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Thanks to all of y'all for your help. Wanted to double check myself before I made a possibly dumb decision. Sounds like it's about what I was thinking. High, but not crazy high. I felt like I had read about the nervar /stronglight but wanted to double check.

It's 54cm, so likely a tad small for my 5'10 frame w/ 32 inseam, but not crazy. I'm taking a look tomorrow and will post updates.
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Old 10-17-18, 08:38 PM
  #8  
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Originally Posted by desconhecido View Post
Also, I'm not seeing any of the original decals or accent stripes Has it been repainted?
Look to be original paint to me from the photos. You can see decals on the downtube - the lack of details on the top tube and lack of striping on the stays worried me as well though
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Old 10-17-18, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by desconhecido View Post
bought mine (77) a couple weeks ago on ebay and got it delivered to Houston and a replacement NR rear derailleur installed for less, so I think it's a bit high. Also, I'm not seeing any of the original decals or accent stripes Has it been repainted?
You can definitely see the Motobecane logo on the downtube.

However, I think that it should say "Grand Record" on the top tube, which I'm not seeing. As well as pin stripes on the top tube????

I presume the accents on the main tubes have faded, but perhaps it would look better (or worse) in person.

It is possible the accents on the lugs have been touched up.

It is possible the top tube paint was also touched up, but I doubt it.

The place where it is missing the paint on the top tube is exactly corresponding to the place where I have the maximum amount of pants rub on my old Colnago, although that looks like flaking paint, not rubbed paint.

The Nervex Pro head tube lugs have a ring around the top and bottom, near the headset cups, which I believe are visible in the photos, although it would be better to visualize in person (which would verify it is, in fact, most likely a "Record", and not some lesser model.

Oh, re-reading the specs, it lists "531 double butted main tubes" on the Grand Record, and "531 double butted throughout" on the Le Champion. IE, the stays and the fork may be 1020. I have a Grand Record frame and thought it weighed slightly heavier than I had expected.
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Old 10-17-18, 09:04 PM
  #10  
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Didn't know about the rings on the head tube lugs. Having trouble finding an example of the rings in photos. What exactly am I looking for?
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Old 10-17-18, 10:06 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by jfliii View Post
Didn't know about the rings on the head tube lugs. Having trouble finding an example of the rings in photos. What exactly am I looking for?
The Nervex Pro lugs may have a couple of variations, all with a fiery look to them.

However, there is a lesser model that also looks similar.



Note the stepped ring or band next to the headset cup. That is a distinct feature that separates the Nervex Pro from other Nervex lugsets.

And, that band should be distinctive on your frame.

Nervex Professional lugs
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Old 10-17-18, 10:41 PM
  #12  
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------

The Peyrard chainset is likely a substitution necessitated by the bike boom parts shortages.

This head emblem was only employed for the 1973 model year.

Bicycle may be a 1973 model produced in 1972 as 1972 was the final year for this generation of the Normandy Luxe Competition hub.

​​​​​​​Subject of brake brand vs specification was mentioned. While calipers and levers are Weinmann front and rear brake hangers are Fratelli Pietra (Universal). Likely another bike boom substitution.

Lugset is not NERVEX Professional.

Verktyg has written that it is a NERVEX pattern proprietary to MB and not found in NERVEX literature.

Have not before seen a GR in this livery, hath anyone else?

------

Last edited by juvela; 10-17-18 at 10:50 PM.
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Old 10-17-18, 11:02 PM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by juvela View Post
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Have not before seen a GR in this livery, hath anyone else?

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I've never seen it either.
I think @verktyg mentioned once that Ben Lawee had Motobecane do some models for the US market in livery not used elsewhere. Perhaps this is one of those cases. It somehow reminds me of those root beer brown ItalVegas.
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Old 10-18-18, 12:53 AM
  #14  
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Ok, I found this bike. Not a lot of info on it.

CarltonProfessionalGuide



A little more root beer colored, but it could be the lighting as the fork looks more chocolate. I can't tell for sure if it is original, but the detail work looks original, but could be good decals.

I have a chocolate Mirage in my basement. Obviously far less detailed work on that bike, but very brown.

Both my Mirage and Grand Jubilee have chrome tips on the fork (unlike the photos above).

Hmmm... Comparing my Grand Jubilee to the Grand Record, they are very similar. I think the Grand Jubilee is a couple of years newer looking at the catalogs.

Neither have that ring on the head tube lugs that I mentioned earlier (although the Grand Record seems to be flared out slighty, but that could be from headset installation.

Catalog specs definately say Nervex Pro... but... ????

One of the differences I noted is my Grand Jubilee has flat seatstay caps (curved around the top tube). The Grand Record has slightly concave/creased seatstay caps, and a slightly smaller diameter cap. Also curved around the top tube.

The fork on the Record is supposed to have Campy dropouts. Mine doesn't have it.

Hmmm... the specs for the 73 list chrome fork tips. The 72 doesn't mention it, but they appear chrome in the catalog pics.
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Old 10-18-18, 01:17 AM
  #15  
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-----

Am able to recall seeing MB's in this shade of brown, although do not recall seeing it on a GR model; prolly just me poor memory!

Recall it for models such a Nobly, Mirage, Super Mirage.

Regarding the observed specification variances -

catalogues, brochures and specification sheets typically have a fine print disclaimer at the bottom or on the back page stating something to the effect that "Specifications are subject to change without notice."

boom conditions were such that all the parts manufacturers were backordered and cycle manufacturers often had to make specification changes to keep production lines running and product moving out the door.

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Old 10-18-18, 06:32 AM
  #16  
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The nice thing about the Nervar crankset is that it uses a standard 22.0 mm crank puller and not a T.A. or Stronglight one. Oh, and this model takes standard 50.4 mm bcd chainrings. I have one just like it waiting to go on a bike in the spring ....
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Old 10-18-18, 03:21 PM
  #17  
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I bought a black and red Grand Record new in '73. It was the first year of the black/red color scheme. TA cyclotourist type crank and Weinmann brakes. The prior year Grand Record was either yellow/black or silver/ black, and was equipped with a Stronglight 49 crank and Universal brakes. This brown/black I have never seen before. The brown/black was a popular Astra color scheme that were Canada bound.
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Old 10-18-18, 04:50 PM
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Originally Posted by jfliii View Post
Thanks to all of y'all for your help. Wanted to double check myself before I made a possibly dumb decision. Sounds like it's about what I was thinking. High, but not crazy high. I felt like I had read about the nervar /stronglight but wanted to double check.

It's 54cm, so likely a tad small for my 5'10 frame w/ 32 inseam, but not crazy. I'm taking a look tomorrow and will post updates.
It will work, but for that price you need a 56.
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Old 10-19-18, 11:35 AM
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------

The way the manufacturer sized models for the North American market at this time the 21" nominal size was 54cm c-t-t. Nothing in the 55,56,57cm c-t-t size was offered until one reached the very top models. The next size up was 23" nominal which measured 58cm c-t-t.

Only know because ran into this back when these were current as my size is ~56-57cm c-t-t.

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Old 10-19-18, 12:24 PM
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I looked at the bike, for that price I would move on. Get a bike that fits. And in nicer condition. $300+ for that particular bike, and it doesn't fit wouldn't work for me. (Not that I would spend that much on a bike to begin with unless a screaming deal)
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Old 10-19-18, 04:05 PM
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Thinking about this. It really depends on your goals.

If you're wanting a basic steel commuter bike, there are some really good bikes from the mid 80's which would be worth looking at.

If, on the other hand, you're specific of wanting:
  • Steel,
  • Mid 70's
  • Non Japanese
  • Project Bike
  • Not full of Japanese components
  • Not a Trek

Then this would hit most of those.

It is a bit on the smallish side. But, it depends on how much bar drop you like.

If you are looking for quality road bikes in the sub $300 range, they'll all have issues of one sort or another. From repaints to mixed parts. And most will be at least 10 to 20 years newer than that one, for better or worse.
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Old 10-20-18, 04:09 AM
  #22  
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Way too small frame size for a rider my height.

Given poor cosmetic condition and need for overhaul, asking price is DOUBLE fmv. More like $175.
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Old 10-20-18, 09:21 AM
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So did you all pass on it? I've been staring at that listing for a while but it's 2.5 or 3 hours away from me. There was a grand record in poorer condition for $100 in bremerton some time ago, and there was a grand jubilee for $500. All of them 21" it looked like.
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Old 10-21-18, 06:52 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by rgvg View Post
So did you all pass on it? I've been staring at that listing for a while but it's 2.5 or 3 hours away from me. There was a grand record in poorer condition for $100 in bremerton some time ago, and there was a grand jubilee for $500. All of them 21" it looked like.
I ended up going for it. We met at a price that I thought was fair. The bikes in good condition excluding the paint and was what I was looking for in a project. I'm pretty sure it's a '73 rather than a '72. Give it a couple months and it'll look good next to my '73 Gitane TDF
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Old 10-22-18, 05:54 PM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by jfliii View Post


I ended up going for it. We met at a price that I thought was fair. The bikes in good condition excluding the paint and was what I was looking for in a project. I'm pretty sure it's a '73 rather than a '72. Give it a couple months and it'll look good next to my '73 Gitane TDF
The '73 has a reynolds fork.
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