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WTB: 58cm frameset

Old 07-16-19, 02:58 PM
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mnmkpedals 
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WTB: 58cm frameset

Just discovered my SBDU made Raleigh USA Reynolds 753 frameset is bent. Was kind of my grail bike. Sigh....

Looking for a good condition frame of comparable higher quality for build. Got a Campy 10s Chorus group waiting for a modernized build.

Need 58cm
Ideally British Bottom Bracket
Ideally with headset (I hate sourcing/sizing headsets)
80s-ish w/ 130 dropouts

Open to all ideas; just looking for a cool "keeper" and rider.

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Old 07-16-19, 03:42 PM
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58cm center to top? What’s your preferred top-tube length? And wth that component group, I gather you’re looking for something 80s or younger?
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Old 07-16-19, 04:05 PM
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In case there is a little wiggle room on your fit.

Tommasini Frame and Fork 59 ish cm
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Old 07-16-19, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mnmkpedals View Post
Just discovered my SBDU made Raleigh USA Reynolds 753 frameset is bent. Was kind of my grail bike. Sigh....

Looking for a good condition frame of comparable higher quality for build. Got a Campy 10s Chorus group waiting for a modernized build.

Need 58cm
Ideally British Bottom Bracket
Ideally with headset (I hate sourcing/sizing headsets)

Open to all ideas; just looking for a cool "keeper" and rider.
How bad? I am sure you know it can probably be straightened and you're in a good place for that. This frame is easily one that should be fixed. How about some pics and what led to just discovering it?

Sounds like job for @gugie.
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Old 07-16-19, 04:16 PM
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How about an Italian frame? I have a Viner that I specifically bought to do a retro build. It is a 58cm. I think its a good frame but its not like taking a Colnago or Masi and doing a retro build. I know you said English BB but I may be able to provide an Italian BB for you. It needs to be painted. May be more than you wanted to do, but I thought I would throw it out there.
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Old 07-16-19, 04:44 PM
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Old 07-16-19, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
How bad? I am sure you know it can probably be straightened and you're in a good place for that. This frame is easily one that should be fixed. How about some pics and what led to just discovering it?

Sounds like job for @gugie.
Thanks for the nudge of confidence in trying to fix it, which would be my preference. Several other folks have given me the same advice to at least try that (the shop where it was isn't super steel-experienced) so I'm gonna go get another opinion locally tomorrow. Crossing fingers.
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Old 07-16-19, 05:30 PM
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I've got a 23-1/2", '78 Raleigh Professional that I need to sell. It is currently built up but that can be fixed. It sounds like you are close to me if you want to take a look.
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Old 07-16-19, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
How bad? I am sure you know it can probably be straightened and you're in a good place for that. This frame is easily one that should be fixed. How about some pics and what led to just discovering it?

Sounds like job for @gugie.
Okay, best I can do with pics here.... Hard to see. But hope the tilt in handlebars is apparent? I was told the headtub and seat tube we out of alignment to cause it, and in the shop, I think I could see it. At home, to be honest, hard to tell, though the lean in the bars is clear to me.

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Old 07-16-19, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mnmkpedals View Post
Okay, best I can do with pics here.... Hard to see. But hope the tilt in handlebars is apparent? I was told the headtub and seat tube we out of alignment to cause it, and in the shop, I think I could see it. At home, to be honest, hard to tell, though the lean in the bars is clear to me.

You have a good pic in that it looks centered and the rear dropouts and triangle line up good from here.

To my eye, the bars are cocked in the stem, look at the spacing of the bars where they enter the stem on each side. Might be a mismatch that finally manifested itself.

I would meetup with @Dfrost and @RiddleOfSteel at their bike co-op for proper C+V evaluation.

Even if this is a frame issue, it should not be life threatening, a good frame builder should be able to make short work of this.

I would encourage you not to consult anyone that does not have steel framebuilding experience.
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Old 07-16-19, 06:13 PM
  #11  
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cabling hassle aside, you could maybe remove bars & stem and drop them back in backwards (ie. stem reaching over top tube, facing rearwards) and look again -- if the tilt remains in the same direction as it is now, then that would indicate a tilted headtube. but if the tilt moves the other way, then it would indicate the bars/stem junction is the problem and maybe your frame is just fine?
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Old 07-16-19, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mnmkpedals View Post
Thanks for the nudge of confidence in trying to fix it, which would be my preference. Several other folks have given me the same advice to at least try that (the shop where it was isn't super steel-experienced) so I'm gonna go get another opinion locally tomorrow. Crossing fingers.
Also, this presents a perfect oppertunity to procure a backup stablemate, a 78 Raleigh Pro would make an excellent pairing.
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Old 07-16-19, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by gugie View Post
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Old 07-16-19, 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by mnmkpedals View Post
Okay, best I can do with pics here.... Hard to see. But hope the tilt in handlebars is apparent? I was told the headtub and seat tube we out of alignment to cause it, and in the shop, I think I could see it. At home, to be honest, hard to tell, though the lean in the bars is clear to me.

Have you considered that the stem and/or bars may be tweaked? If you have some other stems and bars, I would try that to see if you could replicate it. I would think that a HT and a ST out of alignment would be indication of something pretty catastrophic, because you'd have to see the bend in both of them...or cracks at joints, etc. To say nothing of how the headset behaves--does it spin smoothly, bind, or is it loose depending on angle?

A different stem and bar, for comparison, is a cheap and easy thing to do to check (which is something I think you'd want), and I wouldn't put either of those being bent beyond the realm of possibilities. Start with simple things and go from there is my advice.
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Old 07-16-19, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
Also, this presents a perfect oppertunity to procure a backup stablemate, a 78 Raleigh Pro would make an excellent pairing.


Maybe something like this?
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Old 07-16-19, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Kactus View Post


Maybe something like this?
Exactly
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Old 07-16-19, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by RiddleOfSteel View Post
Have you considered that the stem and/or bars may be tweaked? If you have some other stems and bars, I would try that to see if you could replicate it. I would think that a HT and a ST out of alignment would be indication of something pretty catastrophic, because you'd have to see the bend in both of them...or cracks at joints, etc. To say nothing of how the headset behaves--does it spin smoothly, bind, or is it loose depending on angle?

A different stem and bar, for comparison, is a cheap and easy thing to do to check (which is something I think you'd want), and I wouldn't put either of those being bent beyond the realm of possibilities. Start with simple things and go from there is my advice.
So, I had a brief bit of time, took it by Aaron's for a second opinion. Pretty much did what you suggested pulling off stem and bars and then got to scrutinizing it and cleaned some, and alas.... yup, revealed a crack at headtube lug. Not sure if clear in pic, but yeah, bummer. Stem was also bent. I know these can be repaired, but don't have that ambition in me with this right now, so yeah, definitely gonna slowly seek out the right replacement frame now!



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Old 07-17-19, 12:41 AM
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Originally Posted by mnmkpedals View Post
So, I had a brief bit of time, took it by Aaron's for a second opinion. Pretty much did what you suggested pulling off stem and bars and then got to scrutinizing it and cleaned some, and alas.... yup, revealed a crack at headtube lug. Not sure if clear in pic, but yeah, bummer. Stem was also bent. I know these can be repaired, but don't have that ambition in me with this right now, so yeah, definitely gonna slowly seek out the right replacement frame now!




Ah man, so sorry to hear that! Man, that must have been some impact.
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Old 07-17-19, 05:34 AM
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FYI, 753's heat treating makes cold setting a very poor option.

I believe it could be repaired though, but the heating turns 753 into 531, IIRC. Even for an SBDU, it's easier to dig up another frame than start over.

Wouldn't be the first one damaged either; I have a photo of a 753 SBDU that was front-endered somewhere in the computer. Since it was already destroyed, I put it in the Park HTS-1 straightening tool it to see how long it would take before the heat-treated 753 cracked. Took just a few turns.

EDIT: Found it.






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Old 07-17-19, 07:47 AM
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Sorry to hear, I just lost a like new Tange 1 Ironman frame with a lug crack, factory marble paint so respray out of the question. No help to you now but Years ago I bought a custom 753 that was unrideable, Marchetti frame and fork alignment table and $100 to a frame builder it is one of my favorite rides with 1,000s of miles now.
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Old 07-17-19, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by mnmkpedals View Post
I know these can be repaired, but don't have that ambition in me with this right now, so yeah, definitely gonna slowly seek out the right replacement frame now!
Mine is available; either frame or whole bike if you would be interested.
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Old 07-17-19, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by mnmkpedals View Post
So, I had a brief bit of time, took it by Aaron's for a second opinion. Pretty much did what you suggested pulling off stem and bars and then got to scrutinizing it and cleaned some, and alas.... yup, revealed a crack at headtube lug. Not sure if clear in pic, but yeah, bummer. Stem was also bent. I know these can be repaired, but don't have that ambition in me with this right now, so yeah, definitely gonna slowly seek out the right replacement frame now!


So can't see very good but still don't think this is life threatening, is there more damage we can't see? The crack is going to be limited by another layer. even if it continues it won't happen overnight. No way I would give up on this short or long term.

More/better pics?

You really need to get it to gugie.
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Old 07-17-19, 07:14 PM
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I've got this mid-90's Coppi that's about 58 cm c-c seat tube:

I think it meets all your criteria except that the BB threading is Italian, but I'd sell it with the square taper BB that's in it now (also with or without the wheels in the photo).

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Old 07-19-19, 07:14 AM
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Gut, I really have never liked fade paint and have had 2 resprayed for only that reason, but have to admit that is a sharp paint job I would keep, bet it is a sweet ride as well.
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Old 07-21-19, 08:50 AM
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Buy my Allez it is a 58 and I am certain it could be cold set, but it would sort of be a shame to do so ...

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