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Inquiry for Ciocc experts

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Inquiry for Ciocc experts

Old 03-31-15, 10:07 AM
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Inquiry for Ciocc experts

Just found a Ciocc frameset with chrome forks but no pantographing/embossing on fork crowns. I think it is a Competition SL frame, since the driveside stay is chromed. Definitely a Ciocc frame as seatstays are embossed. Question is whether the fork is likely original. Pics later. Thanks.
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Old 03-31-15, 10:35 AM
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Post some pix. Ciocc info is a bit sketchy. I've looked at about a bazillion internet pix trying to ID mine. I've never come across any evidence of a non panto fork crown. But that said my frame has a different lug treatment and I have never found a pix of an identical one. It is definitely a late 70s SL Ciocc frame & fork with the earlier non tail C on both. All the builders probably had deviations from what we think should be a standard years later. Some more than others. My Ciocc is the liveliest ride I have. Enjoy yours!
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Old 03-31-15, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by peugeot mongrel View Post
Post some pix. Ciocc info is a bit sketchy. I've looked at about a bazillion internet pix trying to ID mine. I've never come across any evidence of a non panto fork crown. But that said my frame has a different lug treatment and I have never found a pix of an identical one. It is definitely a late 70s SL Ciocc frame & fork with the earlier non tail C on both. All the builders probably had deviations from what we think should be a standard years later. Some more than others. My Ciocc is the liveliest ride I have. Enjoy yours!
I will post some pics after work. It's a real "diamond in the rough."

Your mention of "liveliest ride" makes me think the fork IS original, as it seems a bit twitchy in handling.
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Old 03-31-15, 03:59 PM
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Mine has the 4 cards logo and CIOCC on the fork crowns.
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Old 04-02-15, 05:56 PM
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Sorry for the blur. Here's what it looks like:

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Old 04-02-15, 06:22 PM
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The one I had both matching serial numbers. Also had panto on the crown also.
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Old 04-02-15, 06:45 PM
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someone tried to install a lower headset race with a hammer judging by the marks on the crown (ask me how i know )
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Old 04-02-15, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by DMC707 View Post
someone tried to install a lower headset race with a hammer judging by the marks on the crown (ask me how i know )
Well, that explains that!
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Old 04-02-15, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
Sorry for the blur. Here's what it looks like:

Check to see if it has the Columbus rifting in it. It probably does.

Mine has the earlier stamp.
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Old 04-02-15, 09:21 PM
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^ That's the same as the stamp on mine.
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Old 04-02-15, 09:33 PM
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I have a vintage San Cristobal with the "4-suits-in-the-Club" panto plus a later one (early '90s) with a semi-aero crown and that has the word "Ciocc" panto'd in the crown on an angle. Never seen a genuine Ciocc forkcrown that looked like yours...but it's not conclusive.
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Old 04-02-15, 10:34 PM
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I'm thinking it's not a Ciocc fork. Anyone have a spare? lol
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Old 04-03-15, 06:07 AM
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2 on Vermont CL right now. Both have a panto on crown. One painted, the other chrome. I haven't seen a lot of these frames but, I do seem to remember them having logos on the crowns.
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Old 04-03-15, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
I will post some pics after work. It's a real "diamond in the rough."

Your mention of "liveliest ride" makes me think the fork IS original, as it seems a bit twitchy in handling.
To the contrary, an incorrect rake and length (probably less of an issue later with the almost universal use of short reach brakes) can alter the handling of a bike.
Some measures from Ciocc owners could confirm or deny that.
You could always send it back to have it painted in Italy... And maybe even get a fork made for it by the Man.
That has been referenced on the forum.
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Old 04-03-15, 09:23 AM
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I think I've seen Tange forks that look like that.......so yes, most likely a replacement fork....

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Old 04-03-15, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
I'm thinking it's not a Ciocc fork. Anyone have a spare? lol
what size is your frame, or better: how long a steerer do you need?
If that was a Tange fork it almost certainly will be stamped "Tange" on the steerer and probably would have Tange forkends. I think it's some "other Italian".
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Old 04-03-15, 04:34 PM
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how bad do you want a nice complete CIOCC? the send it back to the Man in Italy as suggested by repechage is not as expensive as it sounds. i sent a frame back and he turned this into this ... he replaced 2 seat stays and the rear dropouts... so i'm pretty sure he can make you a new fork...
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Old 04-04-15, 05:59 AM
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Originally Posted by unworthy1 View Post
what size is your frame, or better: how long a steerer do you need?
If that was a Tange fork it almost certainly will be stamped "Tange" on the steerer and probably would have Tange forkends. I think it's some "other Italian".
Frame is 57cm. I have not measured the steerer tube, nor checked it for stamping. That, and the drop-outs may provide some clues as to manufacture. Thanks for the reminder!

I recall a thread where someone sent his Ciocc back to Italy for repainting and rechroming, and it was stunning. Not sure I have the funds for that, but I have inquired Ciocc about cost of a new new fork. Waiting for a response.
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Old 04-04-15, 06:02 AM
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Originally Posted by R3tired View Post
how bad do you want a nice complete CIOCC? the send it back to the Man in Italy as suggested by repechage is not as expensive as it sounds. i sent a frame back and he turned this into this ... he replaced 2 seat stays and the rear dropouts... so i'm pretty sure he can make you a new fork...
Ah.... that was your thread. Gorgeous work. PM me if you'd care to share the costs.
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Old 04-04-15, 06:32 AM
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Ciocc forks come and go on eBay on a regular basis.
I just bought one and sold another in Feb. I needed a longer steer tube. The one I just sold --->


And it's replacement --->

I am not an expert but I think it should have a panto fork.
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
Why do you mock the cycling gods?

Your only hope is reciting 10 hail campagnolos to our lady of the duraace.


I'm happy to say that I own more Steel then Carbon. My Stable! ---> https://flic.kr/s/aHsmVZBep7
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Old 04-04-15, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Frogbutter View Post
Ciocc forks come and go on eBay on a regular basis.
I just bought one and sold another in Feb. I needed a longer steer tube. The one I just sold --->


And it's replacement --->

I am not an expert but I think it should have a panto fork.
That's encouraging. I did a quick search last week, but no forks popped up. I agree a panto'd fork is required. The drop-outs are Campy, so it's probably an Italian fork and not Tange. Will check the steerer for stamping and length shortly. I will also post a pic of the frame.
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Old 04-04-15, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
That's encouraging. I did a quick search last week, but no forks popped up. I agree a panto'd fork is required. The drop-outs are Campy, so it's probably an Italian fork and not Tange. Will check the steerer for stamping and length shortly. I will also post a pic of the frame.
Do an advanced search of completed listings for "Ciocc Fork" you will see there has been a number of them just this year already. The two dated Feb 16th and Feb 12th are the two I was party to.
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
Why do you mock the cycling gods?

Your only hope is reciting 10 hail campagnolos to our lady of the duraace.


I'm happy to say that I own more Steel then Carbon. My Stable! ---> https://flic.kr/s/aHsmVZBep7

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Old 04-04-15, 10:02 AM
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Nothing stamped on the fork, save a single number: 6. Steerer length is ~195mm.

Check out this "patina." It's rigged for "evaluation" at this point. Came with the single-speed crank.

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Old 04-04-15, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Frogbutter View Post
Do an advanced search of completed listings for "Ciocc Fork" you will see there has been a number of them just this year already. The two dated Feb 16th and Feb 12th are the two I was party to.
Done. Thanks. That gives me some idea of what to expect.

The frame is a little big, so I'll probably just use the existing fork until I figure out whether to keep it or not.
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Old 04-04-15, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
Ah.... that was your thread. Gorgeous work. PM me if you'd care to share the costs.
i can give you the costs here. my frame was in pretty bad shape. i knew it needed new rear dropouts, and once they prepped it for chrome there was a couple of holes in the rear stays, so i needed new stays. shipping from Canada to Italy by air is very expensive, so i sent it by boat for $150CAD. took 3 months. they sent it back by air for 110 euro and it took 5 days. it took about 4 months once they got the frame. breakdown of costs (in euro):
- Front derailleur brazed on 40,00€
- New seat stays and rear dropouts 80,00€
- Painting 180,00€
- decals 30,00€
- Chrome fork 70,00€
- Chrome front lugs 40,00€
- Chrome full rear triangle 70,00€
- Ship it back to Canada (by air in 5 days) 110,00€
i paid by PayPal and there was a 30 euro charge to cover their PayPal fee. it was worth it for how simple it made payment.

if you are interested, here is the email i used to contact them. they can sometimes be slow to reply, but they do reply. info@pelizzoliworld.com
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