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Maybe a '72?
1972 - Black Club/COLNAGO decal on head tube/seat tube (two seat tube Worlds bands) and COLNAGO on down tube - Fork tangs with two holes (or very rarely three holes tangs or no tangs) - Derailleur cable guide braze-ons top of bottom bracket shell - Water bottle braze-ons on downtube - Super Pantografata model introduced; chrome headlugs (1972 and 1973), pantographed components Velo-Retro: Colnago Super Timeline |
It looks like it is probably genuine.
72 or 73 Colnago Super sounds reasonable. A little variability from frame to frame wouldn't be surprising. |
It the real deal and it's old. I don't think anyone can tell you the exact year.
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Originally Posted by miamijim
(Post 17831242)
It the real deal and it's old. I don't think anyone can tell you the exact year.
Holes in the Bottom Bracket vs cutouts. Above or below bottom bracket cable routing. Water Bottle Cage Braze-ons Shifter braze-ons etc. So, assuming the list posted by Sir_Name is accurate, then one should be able to narrow it down to within a couple of years (assuming the frame wasn't modified later). |
First pic--looks like water bottle boss screws? Maybe not.
Need a better shot of the rear of the seat lug, and a look at the underside of the bottom bracket. I would say a safe bet given the photos shown 1970-1972. |
It is said that the bottom head lug club would be larger than the other lugs clubs, and yours looks to be, at least in the picture. It is said that 71 and up had all the same size.
Myth or truth, I'm not exactly sure but it could be another piece to the puzzle... |
Originally Posted by miamijim
(Post 17831242)
It the real deal and it's old. I don't think anyone can tell you the exact year.
I would love to find one in my size...... |
Hi iab, I'd be interested in the owner's reason for claiming his frame is a 1970 build. Was he the original owner or have first hand knowledge of the original owner?
I often refer to the published 'Colnago Super Timeline" which would indicate a build date circa. 1972/3. Unfortunately, I really have no concrete idea as to who put this timeline together and where the information was collected from. It is my 'gut instinct' that this timeline is pretty accurate though. |
It looks almost exactly like one at a local bike shop which is a '72.
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Originally Posted by Gary Fountain
(Post 17831696)
Hi iab, I'd be interested in the owner's reason for claiming his frame is a 1970 build. Was he the original owner or have first hand knowledge of the original owner?
I often refer to the published 'Colnago Super Timeline" which would indicate a build date circa. 1972/3. Unfortunately, I really have no concrete idea as to who put this timeline together and where the information was collected from. It is my 'gut instinct' that this timeline is pretty accurate though. RARE Early Steel Colnago Super Frameset Frame Fork 55x56 Telaio Bici Corsa | eBay |
Nice looking frame! Whether it's 1970 or '72-'73, early Colnago's don't show up everyday.
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Grab it.
What's going on with the derailleur hanger threads threads? |
Nice looking Colnago frame. Start dealin'!
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Originally Posted by iab
(Post 17831824)
Just an ebay listing that caught my fancy. Love the patina, it's genuine to me. I published his good album pics, not the junk from ebay.
RARE Early Steel Colnago Super Frameset Frame Fork 55x56 Telaio Bici Corsa | eBay |
I would bracket this bike as later '70 to early '71.
Resprayed of course. Note the chrome peeking out from the worn paint on the crown. Spraying chrome usually means the chrome has a problem. I have an earlier bike and a later bike. The earlier frames with "clovers" in the lugs had the cutouts smaller. This frame shows the larger lower head tube cutout AND bigger upper head lug piercing, note the seat lug has a cutout of a bit different shape, not just scale. Note too that the outside points of the fork crown are lacking drill hole piercing details. This would be one that could wear the "playing card" graphics... my favorite. Water bottle braze ons are suspect, as is wears it's second coat of paint... Fortunately a wee bit big for me... a 53.5-54 ctc or 55-56 ctt and I would have a problem. One day I will find one. I like the pre '74 bikes as the graphics were more to my liking and it was before Ernesto went Big, Big Time. |
Besides, iab, you need a Colnago. Right before the Eddy era.
This one benefits from not needing no name Campagnolo brakes, an item that can be near $1k by themselves. |
Originally Posted by repechage
(Post 17832088)
Resprayed of course. Note the chrome peeking out from the worn paint on the crown.
Could be, but I don't see other signs and that picture is not the best. If I were serious I'd get more info from the seller. http://static.pokazywarka.pl/bigImag...jpg?1432468928 |
That view and the overhead shot of the RH front, showing the fork crown top, if to steel, it would NOT be so bright. I strongly believe the frame has been repainted. Decal remnants are 1975 ish, again, not in concert with the metalwork.
Could be a fun project. One way would be to reveal the chrome no matter the surface below, remove the incorrect graphics and get a period replacement set. Bike would look experienced, components could be user level and all would be right with the world. I must admit that these early 70's Supers are a blast to ride. I would select a different bike for a century, but how often can one find the time for that? |
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Can I ask how much the seller is asking for the frame? I'll put in an offer of $100 as-is on such an old junker :thumb:
I'm not sure if it is a respray. If it is, it would be a very old respray. However, with the original graphics in such bad shape, I'd probably plan on going ahead and stripping and repainting anyway. I can't tell from the photos, but there appears to be either an orange-peal look or a metallic look to the paint which also is probably not Colnago. It is possible that Colnago used chrome fork crowns on all of their bikes, but polished some, and painted others. My 68/69 has some rust spots showing through the chromed fork crown. I noticed a little white peaking through the paint at the top of the downtube, near the head tube lug. Mine has a few layers of paint. Burgundy --> White --> Blue But, someone suggested that perhaps it was a respray (factory respray?) (I bought it in Italy in 1982, when it would have been 13 or 14 years old). Anyway, the burgundy is probably a primer, but I've always been puzzled about the white layer. http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=453296 |
The "burgundy" is probably Iron Oxide Primer. That shows up on two of my Original paint Colnagos that are vastly different colors, one Blue. The near white is a base coat, the metallic blue is not opaque enough to hide that red, pretty common to shoot a neutral primer to provide a base that will not effect the color coat. Every once in a while a painter will keep the iron oxide color as it does alter the color coat.
I associate the "Club and Wreath" seat tube herald with '72-74 bike paint jobs, there are minor variations without an outline, all Black for example. The prior Herald was a multicolor graphic with an oval cartouche. |
Originally Posted by repechage
(Post 17833461)
The "burgundy" is probably Iron Oxide Primer. That shows up on two of my Original paint Colnagos that are vastly different colors, one Blue. The near white is a base coat, the metallic blue is not opaque enough to hide that red, pretty common to shoot a neutral primer to provide a base that will not effect the color coat. Every once in a while a painter will keep the iron oxide color as it does alter the color coat.
I associate the "Club and Wreath" seat tube herald with '72-74 bike paint jobs, there are minor variations without an outline, all Black for example. The prior Herald was a multicolor graphic with an oval cartouche. There are a few things that indicate that my frame is an older frame, including the holes in the bottom bracket, and a paucity of brazeons. It has two brazeons, the above bottom bracket cable guide, and the rear derailleur cable stop. I have the clovers on the 3 lugs, but not on the fork crown. I am pretty sure that I have a factory paint job, but I don't know the history prior to 1982. Here are some photos from last year. Colnago - Picture post thread - Page 72 Yes, I know it is rough... it has been well used for many years. |
Originally Posted by CliffordK
(Post 17833566)
Thanks for the notes.
There are a few things that indicate that my frame is an older frame, including the holes in the bottom bracket, and a paucity of brazeons. It has two brazeons, the above bottom bracket cable guide, and the rear derailleur cable stop. I have the clovers on the 3 lugs, but not on the fork crown. I am pretty sure that I have a factory paint job, but I don't know the history prior to 1982. Here are some photos from last year. Colnago - Picture post thread - Page 72 Yes, I know it is rough... it has been well used for many years. Greg Softley has a very nice restored example with the original graphics. The transfers on your bike are I am pretty sure from '72-73, resprays fairly early in a bike's service are uncommon, but not unheard of. I had a bike factory resprayed just 2 years after initial delivery way way back, lots of travel for racing and I wanted a new color. Your bike's images from the other thread do show an interesting comparison between the early "clovers" and the cutouts shown in the bike referenced in this thread by iab. The cutouts on that bike, especially the lower head lug are very much like was used in '72 on till the investment cast lug introduction. In '72 onwards, Almost ALL (nothing is absolute) of the frames I have seen had only the lower head lug cutout. I view it as plain lugs were just faster and easier, for Ernesto as it has been obvious over time, profit is very important. Enough was done to keep the artisan reference, and nest the profit. |
Originally Posted by Gary Fountain
(Post 17831696)
I often refer to the published 'Colnago Super Timeline" which would indicate a build date circa. 1972/3. Unfortunately, I really have no concrete idea as to who put this timeline together and where the information was collected from. It is my 'gut instinct' that this timeline is pretty accurate though.
<http://www.velo-retro.com/colnagotline.html> |
Hi Confente, Yes, you're exactly right - read the fine print - haha. This must be one of life's golden rules.
I would be interested, however, in finding out how the Colnago Super timeline was pieced together. |
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