Prototype Cannondale?
 

This Craigslist listing claims this is a "prototype" Cannondale. The rear dropout looks very thin to me. Could it be?

Cannondale vintage prototype

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=468161

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=468163

Unless the original welder, frame builder, design engineer, weighed in, or better pictures with comparisons to historical pictures, there seems to be no way to tell.

The seller does not offer any evidence, just an approximate age and the claim:

When a claim such as that one is made, it should be supported with at least an interesting back-story, :p even if the Back-Story is just a bunch of BS, at least make the ad more enjoyable! :rolleyes:

"66cm"

http://cdnstatic.visualizeus.com/thu...00a13579_i.jpg

I think its the real deal..... It has the correct patina, correct parts and the correct location. And I'd buy it in a heart beart for $475. No brainer right there.

Cupless BB like the early Kleins
Early SR RD
SL pedals
SR seat post
SR brakes
Gold anodized tubulars with probably Record hubs
SR headset
Cinelli bars and stem
And....alloy crank bolts <<<< only die hard aficionados spec a bike with them

Its all of 66cm depending on how its measured. C2T without a doubt its 66.

At least it comes with a sweet first gen SR rear derailleur. That's close to half the price of the bike.

Hmm...

Yeah that's a sweet bike. Looks like the cable guides are gone. Can't say I've ever seen that color before either.

I agree, these were measured by Cannondale C2T so 66cm isn't out of the question at all. All it means is that the C2C TT is pretty short.

At the price and components.... Why was there even a question about purchasing?

:) Oh hell yeah.

http://i.imgur.com/kDGLYjG.jpg

No serial number or other markings I can make out yet. Measures 59 CTC x 57.5 CTC. Just my size. :) I aired it up and took it a few feet down the road and back - great fit, even with the longer-than-I-normally-run stem (looks like 130?).

@mtnbke - THANK YOU for the inadvertant heads-up. The timing worked out perfectly. And thanks All for the little nudges which certainly helped me make the only correct and rational decision.

The wife in training even agreed that I should get it, and without too much effort on my part. We'll see how true that is...:) She's a keeper for sure.

I'm headed out camping for the weekend now, I'll start a thread within a week or two.

My CAAD 9 is from the last year Cannondales were made in CT/USA. A lovely set of bookends.

Nice. Is it a repaint? Are the top tube cable guides plastic and missing?

Did not the first year C'dales have metal cable guides? I would be very skeptical of it being a prototype or anything like that. Looks like a cool Dale at any rate!

It looks like there is one metal cable guide towards the front of the TT and there maybe another at the rear of the TT, but on the off side of the photo. Also there is no provision for DT shifters with simple cups on the DT for the shift cable housing from the bar end levers.

Brad

That's not true. A 63cm Cannondale will measure 66cm C-T, same with a Klein. I've been duped plenty of times with those. I end up reselling a lot of 63cm Cannondales. What is so frustrating is even after asking the seller to give me the serial number and even telling him where to find it, they always say there isn't one. It always right where I said it was, and always the C'dales are 63s. The Klein I'm just an idiot. I bought it in person. I didn't even measure.

What's not true?

You're welcome!

I received this email from the seller about your new bike:

"I bought this bike a a high-end auction in the late 80's or early 90's from Philip Sweedler & Son Auctioneers. It was listed as a Cannondale Prototype. I can't find any markings on the bike other than on the components but I cannot document anything. Either way it appears to be a very well made bike but proved too tall for me to ride so it ended up in storage all these years. I will check for serial numbers when I get a moment. You are welcome to check it out in person if you would like.I priced the bike low in an attempt to get rid of stuff I never use and generate some cash. "

and

"I double checked for serial numbers. There are none stamped on the chain stays or the bottom of the crank housing or anywhere else that I can find."

I was NEVER going to buy this, so don't think you poached this. I just thought it was cool.

Very curious to see more detail on the rear dropouts. I can measure my dropouts on my STs to let you know how thick they are. If this was a prototype, it was a prototype for the ST series bikes, because those are what Cannondale started with right? So if this is around a 66cm c-t that is a 25" touring "size."

Some numbers from Sutherland's 4th edition (15-1) on tubing diameters:

Cannondale
Top Tube 34.9mm
Downtube 44.4mm ('84 ST 38.1mm)
Seat Tube 31.7mm
Head Tube 34.9mm
Steering "column" 25.4mm
Chain Stay 25.4mm
Seat Stay 19x25.4

and right there under the Cannondale numbers is the information for the Kleins. Lo and behold it gives specific information for the tubing diameters for BIG Kleins 68cm-70. Return the favor and help me find one!

Interestingly the Old Klein and Touring tubing sizes were different from Cannondale. However, the new Quantum (new racing) tubing diameter numbers are the same for Klein and Cannondale for Downtube, Seat Tube, Steering "column," and Chain Stay[s]. So the Klein v. Cannondale litigation becomes a little more funny, in that Klein sued Cannondale for violating their patent on oversize tubing, when that wasn't even Klein's innovation and was already "prior art", and that in the end Klein changed tubing dimensions to replicate Cannondale's tubing diameters. Too funny. It doesn't make me respect Klein any less, but the Klein cult was so rabid repeating falsehoods and misinformation for YEARS after Cannondale won. Heck someone in C&V posted the other day in a different C'Dale thread that C'Dale had to pay $5 per frame for violating the patent, and that's how he bought a $100 Cannondale on clearance.

From a bunch of sleeping bags, backpacks, tents, clothing, cycling kit, and touring suppliers (panniers and racks) it appears you may have a "missing link." A prototype that actually bridged that tiny little company from their outdoor gear to a paradigm changing frame to the point they became one of the biggest Cycling brands in the world. I'll leave at that. Otherwise I'll end up ranting about the Joe Montgomery fraud and the "house loan" and the Dorel sadness.

Your posts make me like Cannondale less.

Ignore them?

Its difficult when I have to scroll for 10 seconds to get to a real post.

EDIT: Never mind, found the ignore list.

Interesting story, thanks. Any idea on a claimed year for your buddy's bike?

Doesn't look like a repaint to me. I have nothing to compare to, but am thinking the paint may be imron - as I believe is consistent with at least the first year of production. The color is a beautiful deep red with a nice, light silver flake to it. Can't wait to get it cleaned, polished, and waxed. The TT cable guides are metal (Al), the front-most guide is intact and in place, the remaining two are free from the frame, but (very, very) fortunately are strung on the cable housing and resting at the rear caliper/adjuster.

Yup - well, there is a small circular boss on top of the DT where DT shift levers would have been mounted, but I see no evidence of a clamp having ever been installed.

The bar-end shifters are Suntour 3090 w/o plastic lever 'grip', front der. is first gen. Suntour Cyclone.

Thanks - I figured you weren't eyeing this for purchase.

The seller told me the same history, unfortunate that it dead-ends at the auction he purchsed from, it came for sale sans-backstory ad only listed as 'Prototype Cannondale'. The mystery makes it interesting to me, as does the fact that there are no serial numbers or other markings found as of yet (I'm curious to pull the fork and check the steerer tube). Chuckk's story above makes these details just a bit more interesting. And thank you for the info on tubing diameters. I won't be able to get to the bike for a few days, but will post my measurements with yours when I can. Any more related info you may have would be greatly appreciated.

This bike actually measures 65 CTT, and is 59 CTC. The fit is great. Seatpost has been raised a bit from the images above. The stem (130? - haven't had a chance to measure yet) may work, or may need to get replaced with a slightly shorter version of the same. Time will tell. I have a 25" ~sport touring bike that fits will. This fits very well and feels a bit more compact, more nimble.

Rear droupouts measure around 8.33 - 8.74mm thick from a set of quick and dirty measurements.

Seatpost is 27.4

Thanks. It does have the metal cable guides and may have imron paint so a first year at least, from what I can tell. More research is needed.

The BB cable guides (over the top routing) are VERY interesting and a nice detail. They appear to be formed Al tubes (fully enclosed) and are very well executed.

Yes - interesting question.