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Update on the old chain on my '85 Fuji (Thank you!)

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Update on the old chain on my '85 Fuji (Thank you!)

Old 08-31-15, 01:20 PM
  #1  
ButchA
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Update on the old chain on my '85 Fuji (Thank you!)

After reading numerous threads about chains, cleaning chains, replacing chains, etc... I went to the LBS earlier today and talked to them about my old C&V '85 Fuji Del Rey and how I tried cleaning the chain, but it's old and worn, and I might as well take the plunge and replace it.

The LBS had 100 gazillion types of chains, most are for high tech index shifting, 9 or 10 speed STI shifters. They redirected me to another LBS that has more "old school" stock inventory.

Long story short, I showed the guy at the counter a picture of my old Fuji on my smartphone. He said, "Oh cool man, that's a classic! You got down tube shifters... Suntour components... 12 speed... Not a problem, gotcha covered right here."

He handed me a KMC Z33 box and a Park Tool CT-5 mini chain tool, Grand total cost: $18 bucks (with discount coupon). He explained about removing my old chain, lining up the new chain to the old one, and popping off a few links from the new one (116L down to 112L), and carefully threading it back on.

Thank you all for the terrific help! The new chain went on with ease, no problems at all. I would have liked one of the better chains but they had me stick with the Z33 for non-index shifters. Okay, whatever, it works and was cheaper in the long run.



I shifted up to the largest cog (30T on the rear) and the large 52T chainring to make sure the Suntour derailleur wasn't stretched out, then shifted back to the smaller 42T chainring (as seen when the photo was taken). 112 chain length is right on the money. It's not sagging and it's not stretched out.

You all are the best! Thanks again!
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Old 08-31-15, 01:49 PM
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I love the Park CT-5 chain tool so much I don't actually have a different "shop" chain tool. Small enough to carry on the bike, and other than ever actually ever finding one of those bike show Park Pro-Set rosewood handled chain tools, this works as a great "shop quality" tool as well.

Interesting that you were out the door for $18 for tool and chain. The CT-5 is a $15 tool normally, isn't it? Its been years since I bought mine.

I disagree with the shop. Most LBS wrenches think friction means low quality drivetrain. There are a hundred places to save money on a bike. You want super light weight pedals look for the Performance branded Forte Pro one-sided SPDs that were made of magnesium bodies with titanium spindles, that weigh 200g. Much lighter and cheaper and classic looking on a road bike than pedals costing hundreds more. You can usually buy these for $50 on eBay or Craigslist. There are always stupid good parts that are still stupid cheap. The one place I think you shouldn't save money is on the chain. Yes, its a consumable. However, having a friction drivetrain has nothing to do with needing a good chain or not. That Sugino crank on your bike is better kit than most of the crap being hustled today on new bikes. The fit/finish and quality of classic Sugino cranks are a thing to behold. New Sugino cranks aren't bad, but they just aren't as classic looking. There used to be people in the old Suntour enterprises (Suntour, Sugino, Maeda, Dia-Compe etc.) that used to literally just hand polish everything. That world of fit/finish of 80s Japan does not exist anymore. Grant is right about that.
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Old 08-31-15, 02:07 PM
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That chain tool will last you a lifetime. I also have only that one.
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one general tip for when the exact hub cone is not readily available. discovered that the curvature of the bearing surface on the shimano 600 was a pretty good "skeleton key" for many applications. it would sometimes require a small change in ball size to make everything come out correctly.
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Old 08-31-15, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by ButchA View Post
The LBS had 100 gazillion types of chains, most are for high tech index shifting, 9 or 10 speed STI shifters. They redirected me to another LBS that has more "old school" stock inventory.
Hard to believe a decent shop would not stock a chain for every bike that might come in the door; CB/3-speed, 3/32" for all types of derailleur bikes. Jeez, how much stock would that require if they are so deep into the new stuff? Maybe they just want to ignore anything perceived as "old school." Just sayin'...
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Old 08-31-15, 04:06 PM
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Thanks, everyone...

Yeah, that first LBS is very close to my house, to where I could practically walk to it! They are a little "different" if you get my drift... I mean, not to get all funny or bash the hardcore roadies or anything like that, but if you walk in there in a full kit, they'll do whatever they can to help you. If you have a C&V bike and need something, forget it...

I went to Agee's (family run store for over 100 years) and they had everything I need. I also had a $10 off coupon from when my family and I did that annual Anthem Moonlight Ride - Bike Ride in Richmond (which was partly sponsored by Agee's) back on Aug 22nd.

I looked at both chains, old and new side by side when I was measuring them up. Man, that old chain was NASTY! I mean, no amount of cleaning, shy of soaking it on kerosene, would have cleaned it thoroughly. Right now, it's hanging on a hook by my workbench until I figure out what to do with it. Interesting is that it looked to be just a hair stretched out compared to the new KMC Z33.
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Old 08-31-15, 05:08 PM
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remember that any 12-speed is really just a 10-speed (or less), and any 10-speed is really just an 8-speed.

why?

you don't use the big chainring/big rear cog combination nor the small/small combination. sheldon brown takes it one step further when he discusses chainline and efficiency, but i'll leave it there.

i built up a bike recently where the chain actually rubbed on the big chainring when in the small/ small combination.

i always tell buyers of this little tip about externlly geared bikes.

more importantly, the big/big combo really hurts the eyes. it's like seeing a baby get slapped.
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Old 08-31-15, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by ButchA View Post

Yeah, that first LBS is very close to my house, to where I could practically walk to it! They are a little "different" if you get my drift... I mean, not to get all funny or bash the hardcore roadies or anything like that, but if you walk in there in a full kit, they'll do whatever they can to help you. If you have a C&V bike and need something, forget it...

I went to Agee's (family run store for over 100 years) and they had everything I need. I also had a $10 off coupon from when my family and I did that annual Anthem Moonlight Ride - Bike Ride in Richmond (which was partly sponsored by Agee's) back on Aug 22nd.

I looked at both chains, old and new side by side when I was measuring them up. Man, that old chain was NASTY! I mean, no amount of cleaning, shy of soaking it on kerosene, would have cleaned it thoroughly. Right now, it's hanging on a hook by my workbench until I figure out what to do with it. Interesting is that it looked to be just a hair stretched out compared to the new KMC Z33.
I'm in the same town and did not check your location. Agee's was always the "other guy" when I was working in a shop here but they would have a chain like that. Good for them and for you. You must have gone to that "Brand C" bike shop first. Incidentally, if there was any appreciable wear on your chain, then using a new chain with the existing freewheel might result in some skipping on the most worn cog(s). If so, this will give you the opportunity to check the Agee's store for its stock of 6-speed freewheels or cogs. If your Fuji has a Two Wheel Travel shop sticker on it I probably know the person who assembled it.
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Old 08-31-15, 06:35 PM
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Thanks... I have no idea who assembled the old Fuji, as I bought it used from Craigslist.

Anyway, I learned something new from Sheldon Brown's website (or a link within it). I learned to calculate/double check the chain length of my old Fuji:

1985 Fuji Del Rey (25" frame) Chainstay length: 16 3/4" (16.750 for math purposes)
Sugino crank & chainrings: 42T & 52T
Suntour "Mighty-6" 6 speed freewheel: 14,16,19,22,26,30

Math:
Take the chainstay length times 2 (16.750 x 2 = 33.5)
Take the largest chainring divided by 4 (52 / 4 = 13)
Take the largest cog in the freewheel also divided by 4 (30 / 4 = 7.5)
Add 1

33.5 + 13 + 7.5 + 1 = 55

Double that... 55 x 2 = 110.

Add one more link = 112

Bingo... 112 chain length.

Last edited by ButchA; 08-31-15 at 06:52 PM. Reason: fixed math...
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Old 08-31-15, 07:02 PM
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Originally Posted by ButchA View Post
Yeah, that first LBS is very close to my house, to where I could practically walk to it! They are a little "different" if you get my drift... I mean, not to get all funny or bash the hardcore roadies or anything like that, but if you walk in there in a full kit, they'll do whatever they can to help you. If you have a C&V bike and need something, forget it...
On the bright side, though, the guy you talked to was at least thoughtful enough to refer you to another shop who might be able to help. It shows at least a little class to refer you to a competitor, trying to address your need instead of upselling you, selling you the wrong item, or simply turning you away.

Glad you've got the chain sorted out so you can get the ol' bike back on the road!
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Old 09-01-15, 06:33 AM
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Originally Posted by SkyDog75 View Post
On the bright side, though, the guy you talked to was at least thoughtful enough to refer you to another shop who might be able to help. It shows at least a little class to refer you to a competitor, trying to address your need instead of upselling you, selling you the wrong item, or simply turning you away.

Glad you've got the chain sorted out so you can get the ol' bike back on the road!
Very true... That other LBS is all Cervelo and Specialized and other high end, top name brands. They seriously know their stuff - I'll give them credit, but they can sometimes forget about the "regular rider".

Anyway, my old Fuji was always up and running and out on the road. The problem with the chain came when I was doing routine cleanup and wiping down and so on. I just happened to look at that one link on my old chain (where it's detached in the photo). I don't know if you can see it good enough, but the pin in that link was actually loose! Seriously, you could push it around with your fingernail! When I used the Park Tool CT-5 on the old chain, that link easily came apart with no resistance at all!
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