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Tall bike thread (64cm and up)

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Tall bike thread (64cm and up)

Old 09-22-15, 09:10 AM
  #26  
miamijim
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Old 09-22-15, 12:18 PM
  #27  
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I've got this beast of a Shogun 300 - 68cm. Stripped it down for parts. Frame still hanging up in the shed somewhere. If anybody wants it let me know. I could sell or trade. I'm in the Atlanta area.
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Old 09-22-15, 12:36 PM
  #28  
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I think Lotus identified this as a 26" frame--around 65 cm, as I recall. My first (and so far only) yard-sale find, dating from about five years ago. It was a pretty good buy at $10. I rebuilt it and rode it for a year or so before selling it--I could never really get comfortable on it. Not sure why, since I could stand over it okay and the top-tube length was pretty comparable to my other bikes--most of which are in the 62-63 range, except for my old Gitane TdF, which is a 60.

I now have a smaller Lotus Classique that I like a lot.
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Old 09-22-15, 03:52 PM
  #29  
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Gazelle made their Champion Mondial in sizes up to 70 cms. Here's one.

And this is the semi-race version, from the '84 catalogue:

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Old 09-28-15, 01:28 AM
  #30  
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Kobe - You accidentally ended up with MY Serotta, I'm pretty sure. PM me and I'll give you my contact info to send it to me.

You could be the nicest guy in the world, but I hate you now! There are very very few tall bikes that make other tall cyclists hate you. We usually end up with second tier stuff. But, that'd be one. With a factory head tube extension even! Nice. Was it custom? They had a horrible reputation of "normalizing" the custom geometry on tall bikes. They got burned one too many times with customs, as most customers didn't truly know what they wanted in a custom, and just compared everything to stock geometry. As much effort and education as they put in to Serotta custom sizing, they realized that with most tall cyclists, they didn't have a clue about how poorly their stock geometry bikes were fitting. So when they were delivered true custom builds, people didn't like them. They were too different from the poorly fitting crap they had previously. The other side of the coin is people that were livid when their custom bikes came back fudged to "normalize" the numbers, who truly expected their custom tall bikes. I remember one thread on the Serotta forum where a guy's titanium custom Serotta was a a real financial hardship purchase, but a lifetime gift to himself. He was never going to be able to afford a second custom bike in his lifetime. He was furious and devastated when Serotta "corrected" his custom geometry spec and "normalized" it. They refused to make it right. The fudging happened after the custom fit. He never signed off on it. Serotta took the custom data and fudged it back to split the difference. He wanted the bike with the true custom geometry and ended up, as they did with their tall builds, with a splitting of the difference.

Still most of us would love a TALL Serotta as most of us will NEVER ever have a custom bike built, even though we are the group that probably all should. Tall cyclists almost never understand what size/geometry we'd even want. We've spent a lifetime on the wrong size bikes, and usually don't have a proper frame of reference (which is EXACTLY what led Serotta into that practice of "normalizing" specs on BIG customs).

If we ever go for a ride together, you'd better not bring your Serotta. I'd leave you bound and tied over that bike. I guess you'd be safe in a large group ride. Unless it was a large group of TALL cyclists. Then probably only one of us would emerge at the end. "There can only be one." You've got to tell the story on how you found it, or your custom experience with them.

I'm pretty sure that since Kobe ended up with such an awesome TALL bike he pretty much needs to be banned from this site. It would only be fair and equitable. Anything else he looks at in this thread is secondary to what's in his garage already. I mean what man looks at porn and realizes he's wasting his time becasue his girlfriend/wife is way hotter, or more creative in their marital interactions? I mean really? That's what porn and bike porn are for, to view the unobtainable or the fantasy, while exploiting girls with failures as fathers. Bike porn is looking at BETTER bikes than you'll likely ever have. KOBE probably won't see many other bikes in his lifetime that would be "better" than his Serotta. More beautiful? Sure, any BIG Rivendell would have better paint and lug art, and the Joe Bell paint job. But an actual better riding steel bike. Please.

Zinn the tech editor at Velonews, and a cat that specializes in building BIG/TALL bikes and his thoughts on Serotta leaving his own game, and some comments on the innovative Colorado True Temper tubing specs:

http://velonews.competitor.com/2013/...uilding_299896

I love that piece because its a rare glimpse into the often catty and disingenuous narrative that dominates the cycling industry. When the mass market doesn't have a competitive product they try to poison the well with a false narrative to reduce the performance variance that leaves their product offerings as inferior. It happens a lot. It happened all the time with the disingenuous mocking of Cannondale as "Crack-n-fail" even though most of us haven't seen five Cannondale road frame failures with our own eyes. People forget the full assortment of Park Head tube straightening tools, frame realignment tools, and other such steel tubing repair equipment that shops had to keep on hand during the lightweight steel frame race era. Lightweight steel frames can crumple the downtube just riding through a pothole, or as recently seen in this C&V forum just from hitting a dirt road rut wrong. Aluminum frames were incomparably stronger, lighter, and stiffer, but the false narrative was, like Zinn suggests as with Serotta, just the envious false narrative. When a competing shop has Cannondale and you've been Schwinn/Paramount for years, you've got to say something to the customers. The paradigm changed, and the performance variance between some paradigm changing innovations in cycling leaves many good intentioned LBS out in the cold through no fault of their own. Of course they become caustic and disgruntled about it.

With Serotta the Colorado tubing bikes were great bikes. They were TIG welded and were stiffer and stronger than lugged steel bikes. If you only sold lugged steel bikes, you weren't going to like that. The absence of lugs made them lighter as well. The Colorado tubing from True Temper was innovative throughout its iterations. You'd always find plenty of shops playing up the 7-11 True Temper/Serotta bikes that had so many failures. Essentially almost every cyclist on the team had one break out from under them in the peloton or training. Lots of finger pointing between True Temper and Serotta, and lots of LBS played it up to customer for decades afterwards trying to steer customers away from the Serotta competition. That ugly false narrative and self serving dialog I always felt wasn't healthy for the cycling industry. I've always made it a practice to never support a stockist that preached a disingenuous narrative. When a shop tries to poison the well or misrepresent what needs repaired/replaced on a bike, I'm done with them forever.

My favorite was an LBS in Colorado. Wheatridge Cyclery. The owner announced a big clearance event on Craigslist. I inquired about BIG/TALL bikes they might have. I didn't know what they might sell. Never been there. The owner waxed on about how they fit "all" the Nuggets and Broncos players with height, and they wouldn't have any issues fitting me to a 63cm. They were "experts" in fitting tall people. I should have stopped corresponding with them right there. You can't fit a 6'8" or 6'6" man to a 63cm bike in good faith, especially a professional athlete that would have the means for a properly fitting custom bike. A 63cm stock bike, which he revealed was the largest frame sets they sold when pressed, is usually equivalent to five to six sizes too small for someone 6'7"-6'9". Yet he reiterated they fit "all" the Nuggets to such bikes (or the XL compact geometry equivalent with 57cm c-t actual seat tubes).

At one point, for a bunch of clearance price point bikes no less, he kept following up explaining how a XL he had was perfect for me, and he guaranteed that he could fit me to it. Guaranteed. Having never asked me a single question about PBH, arm length, femur length, etc. I actually had just sold off an OCR1 in XL because I'd fallen for the Giant catalog propaganda that said the XL bike fit like up to an equivalent 66cm. Two years later with the identical frame geometry the Giant catalog propaganda would change that to 63cm/64cm (I can't remember). At one point in the email exchange I finally revealed to him my frustration with how disingenuous he was becoming. I explained that his reputation was worth more than moving a couple of deeply discounted bikes at end of season. I flat out explained I actually had owned that exact size/geometry. I explained I knew something about bike fit, and even owned a Look Ergostem, and couldn't make such a "too small" bike properly fit. I continually explained that if they had anything big in their Specialized XXL (XXXL?) road bikes I'd come take a look. He wasn't trying to dump overstock in XXL Roubaix bikes. He wanted to get rid of what he had, he didn't give a damn about anything else. In the end when I called him out on it, he would NOT concede that he couldn't make an XL with the identical geometry that I'd already own, "fit." He was an "expert fitter" after all, that sold ALL the Nuggets and Broncos their bikes. So 6'8" offensive linemen and 6'11" and 7'2" centers were apparently ALL riding around on bikes with an actual 57cm c-t seat tube. Right. I posted a scathing negative review on Google and he managed to have it removed. I emailed him and explained he'd sell more bikes in the long run not trying to be a snake oil salesman, if he focused on properly fitting folks to bikes. He maintained that he could "easily" fit me to an XL frame with the identical geometry to what I'd already owned and found too small. Apparently he's a magical fitter. He should contact Specialized and explain they needn't actually bother making the XXL frames. He has "magic beans" and expertise that can properly fit anyone on just an XL, regardless of not asking any questions about their physiology, because he's got "fitting experience." Be careful people. Thar be monsters.

Its shops like that that turn people off from cycling. They buy a two grand bike, their neck, arms, wrists, and back hurts because the bike they had in stock is the wrong size, but what the shop needs to sell and what the customer needs to ride don't always align. The new cyclist never thinks to question that a professional "good bike" bike shop sold them a improperly fitting bike, and so they assume cycling just isn't for them and it hurts to ride. So the bike hangs in the garage unridden until its sold off on Craigslist. Meanwhile that shop lost a customer lifetime relationship selling accessories, tubes, bottles, jerseys repairs, etc. All to chase a short sighted inventory dump.

/ tall cyclist LBS rant

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Old 09-28-15, 01:34 AM
  #31  
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68cm Miyata One Ten that is a perfect example of what most of use are going to find that will fit better than all the clown car sized bikes being sold as the "biggest size available" in LBS these days. Not a Serotta, not an Olmo, not a Pinarello. Just a solid Japanese steel bike that forced the Italians to compete against their superior systematic quality control, finish, and production methods.

This probably one of the nicest bikes we'll see. Its looks like its straight out of the time capsule.

1985 Miyata One Ten 110 Super Tall 68cm Frame Fully Refurbished Beautiful | eBay

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Old 09-28-15, 10:08 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by mtnbke View Post
This probably one of the nicest bikes we'll see. Its looks like its straight out of the time capsule.
The Round Lake Beach IL guy does some good work, that's for sure. Endless supply of 80s Japanese road bikes too, its nuts.
His ads are typically a little over the top, but the work and offerings are solid.
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Old 09-28-15, 11:56 AM
  #33  
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Back in about 1979, Panasonic made their DX-2000 model available in a 28" (71cm) size. I sold a few of them then.

Anyone need a frame? I have a frameset hanging in my barn. It's a Nishiki Olympic or something. It's heavy chromoly, about 68cm. If so, email me at the address below. I can't ask for money in this thread, so you can reimburse me in tires.
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Old 09-28-15, 12:53 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
Back in about 1979, Panasonic made their DX-2000 model available in a 28" (71cm) size. I sold a few of them then.
Yes, the Panasonics in 27" Sports and 28" DX frames (depending on the model) and the Fujis in 27" were the hot ticket for much of our clientele in the late '70s and early '80s. Most of those guys would have been much wiser and safer riding more suitably-sized frames.

At one time I had a 64cm PX10 and a 25.5" Trek 710 that I built up with economy components.
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Old 09-28-15, 01:34 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
I can't ask for money in this thread, so you can reimburse me in tires.
I thought this notion was de-bunked in a discussion somewhat recently.
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Old 09-28-15, 01:35 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by seedsbelize View Post
I thought this notion was de-bunked in a discussion somewhat recently.
Oh, I missed that. For whatever it's worth, I'm a paid member of bikeforums and am eligible to post in the for-sale sections.
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Old 09-28-15, 02:14 PM
  #37  
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I have what I believe to be the largest Raleigh SBDU Team Pro made, at least according to the registry. It's a 1979 and the BB is stamped 65, and it measures about 64.5 cm CTT. Not quite big enough to qualify for this thread, but a notable larger high-end frame. I need to take new pics. This pic is a few years old, just after I got it.

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Old 09-28-15, 09:45 PM
  #38  
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1982 Apollo Prestige. Frame made by Kuwahara. 27 inch frame and 27 inch wheels (just to increase the stand over height).


Nice to ride, but the dismounts were difficult for me.
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Old 09-28-15, 11:42 PM
  #39  
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I'm not eligible, but I recalled this

Cycle Surgery makes its biggest road bike for UK's tallest policeman | Bicycle Business | BikeBiz
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Old 09-29-15, 01:24 AM
  #40  
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got a Peugeot that just about makes it into the conversation at 64cm :-)
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Old 09-29-15, 04:23 AM
  #41  
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Thread is for 64cm and up.
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Old 09-29-15, 04:25 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Hummer View Post
1982 Apollo Prestige. Frame made by Kuwahara. 27 inch frame and 27 inch wheels (just to increase the stand over height).


Nice to ride, but the dismounts were difficult for me.
I don't know anything about Kuwahara. But the ET/Kuwahara poster in the Men's bathroom at the local TGIF always makes me smile. Strangely, they then have a vintage Mongoose bmx bike in the bar. Never heard of a TALL Kuwahara before. How does it ride?
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Old 09-29-15, 04:49 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
Back in about 1979, Panasonic made their DX-2000 model available in a 28" (71cm) size. I sold a few of them then.

Anyone need a frame? I have a frameset hanging in my barn. It's a Nishiki Olympic or something. It's heavy chromoly, about 68cm. If so, email me at the address below. I can't ask for money in this thread, so you can reimburse me in tires.
Panasonic made a 71cm. Anyone have one? Most people discount the Panasonic bikes, but in reality they made some very nice bikes like the Team Europe, Team Europe II, Team America, Team Japan, AR-6000, Titainium, and PICS. For most of those think Centurion Equippe if it wasn't made by Cinelli, but was still as good. Absolute bargains in the C&V world that can be found dripping with Campy or equivalent components and with low miles. Panasonic didn't jump off the page as a high-end bike, but these models were. You can find many old catalogs here:

History of Panasonic Bicycles | Panasonic Bicycles Virtual Museum

Panasonic bikes are the same company that makes Panaracer tires. The Pasela TG is a great lightweight clincher with flat protection. Many people use them on tandems. Still available in LOTS of sizes including 630 (27").
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Old 09-29-15, 07:03 AM
  #44  
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I posted this in the CL thread but you guys might be interested as well. Seems to be a really big Cannondale ST. Big Cannondale 12 speed road bike Don't know anything else about the bike or the seller.
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Old 09-29-15, 09:47 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by mtnbke View Post
I don't know anything about Kuwahara. . . . . Never heard of a TALL Kuwahara before. How does it ride?
Kuwahara made road bicycle frames before and after BMX bicyles. Most of their frames have some other brand name on them.

Generally well built, quality frames. They ride very nice.
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Old 09-29-15, 10:14 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by mtnbke View Post
Thread is for 64cm and up.
So if 64cm and up is a TALL frame, 60-63cm is what, Chopped Liver?
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Old 09-29-15, 11:02 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by oddjob2 View Post
So if 64cm and up is a TALL frame, 60-63cm is what, Chopped Liver?
Didn't you read the screeds? :-D
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Old 09-29-15, 11:35 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by oddjob2 View Post
So if 64cm and up is a TALL frame, 60-63cm is what, Chopped Liver?
I can find a quality bike in 60-63cm's all day long. That seems to be the top limit of most top of the line bike lines. They are tall but not freakishly tall like most riders 6'3" and up prefer. I think quality bikes in 64cm and up are just very rare.

Thanks @mtnbke for the praise on the Serotta. I guess I will need to watch my back. It was on eBay a few years ago and I got it for the opening bid, I am glad you did not see it. It's a little odd with the baseball bat tubing (nice article by Zinn btw, I never saw that) and long neck on the headtube, but it all works to be a great ride. I don't know if it was custom or not, this one http://cnj.craigslist.org/bik/5153174900.html is for sale by me. It is a lot more than I paid for mine but looks to be the same size. Let me know and I can facilitate for you.

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Old 09-29-15, 11:58 AM
  #49  
oddjob2
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Here's the big Panasonic Sport

Panasonic Sport DX
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Old 09-29-15, 03:22 PM
  #50  
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Well, the good news.... as I age I'm shrinking, so if I live long enough I'll be able to find more plentiful frames below the 64cm Mendoza line.
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