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Old 10-19-15, 12:58 AM
  #26  
texaspandj
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Originally Posted by Vintage_Cyclist View Post
Quick trip to the garage, you are correct. I remembered wrong on the decals!
Seatpost is definitely a non-fluted Sugino and is 27.0 (27.2 won't fit). Perhaps the bike shop I got it from did a switch.
You are correct on : non - fluted Sugino seat post 27.0. All the 88 masters came that way. Even stock pic of Dave Scott hoisting one shows that.
Sidenote: Before I forget the 86 classic suggested price was 525.00, however my LBS had it at 575.00. Also, short cage definite on 86 classic as it was the only shimano 600 sis rd available in 86. Thanks.
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Old 10-19-15, 03:23 AM
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Non-fluted seatpost and 27.0 on at least the '85, '86, '88, maybe all.
Learn something every day. I've used 27.2's in all of mine, go figure.

My first Ironman was an '88 Master and it came with a fluted seatpost.
Used, though, so no way of knowing how it hit the shores.
Had been upgraded to 8-sp 6400 STI w/rear hub upgrade and shifters.
Whopping $135 on eBay. Times have changed.

Thanks to folks for submitting information. Helps a lot.
Sooner or later, we'll have a pretty complete database of the OEM stuff.

I've never seen anything but narrow little tires on them, and I had an '86 all OEM.
It sure did not have 700x28's on it, had Panaracer Technova's. Another oddity.
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Old 10-19-15, 04:22 PM
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After looking at the spreadsheet on the other page, the BB on my ironman was a Sugino, not Shimano weirdly. It has a thick lockring, just like the Thick one on the Superbe Pro BB, and the cup is clearly marked Sugino.
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Old 10-19-15, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by lord_athlon View Post
After looking at the spreadsheet on the other page, the BB on my ironman was a Sugino, not Shimano weirdly. It has a thick lockring, just like the Thick one on the Superbe Pro BB, and the cup is clearly marked Sugino.
Seems everyone is wondering why didn't they just put matching shimano bottom bracket. According to a bicycle review it was simply to keep build cost down.
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Old 10-19-15, 07:29 PM
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My '87 master is, to the best of my knowledge, all original...except of course for the tape, tires, pedals, and housing. So, in case it helps filling out the spreadsheet, here are pics of the crank, derailleurs, seat post, and headset:







Attached Images
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photo 1 (3).jpg (95.2 KB, 2122 views)
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photo 1.jpg (94.5 KB, 2116 views)
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Old 10-19-15, 08:39 PM
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Mostly original '89



As far as the supposed geometry changes, would it theoretically be possible to just measure two vintages of frames in the same size and compare? Especially since we have one of the spec sheets above. What does it take to measure frame angles other than a protractor?
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Old 10-20-15, 04:48 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Vintage_Cyclist View Post
Additional info like known touch-up paint options struck me as one thing that would be helpful. I keep seeing that issue raised in the forum.
Done
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Old 10-20-15, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Brewsmith View Post
Mostly original '89



As far as the supposed geometry changes, would it theoretically be possible to just measure two vintages of frames in the same size and compare? Especially since we have one of the spec sheets above. What does it take to measure frame angles other than a protractor?

I have a 1989 Expert and a 1987 Expert in the same size frames, and i measured them rather crudely one day and they are different geometries. IIRC, The 1989 had a less relaxed head tube angle as the 1987 had. i recall it was a couple degrees steeper. When i find the sheet that i noted these items i will post them here so others can get the idea.
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Old 10-20-15, 08:57 AM
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Database update https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1927924249

I added a general groupset note for each model to indicate group (600EX, 600 Ultegra, etc.) and miscellaneous stuff like anodizing.

If anyone who has bikes original (or known provenance) to them, with original parts, they can let me know specific part numbers (i.e., 6200 series vs 6208 specifically) for that year and model, which will enable me to put the specific parts in.

Geometry charts added for 84, 86, 87 and 89 models.

If anyone has any other ideas on what would be good to include, let me know.

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Old 10-20-15, 07:06 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
1984 Comp TA.
Stem: Nitto or SR CR?
1984 catalog says Model CR "invisible bolt" design. Aluminum"
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Old 10-20-15, 07:10 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Vintage_Cyclist View Post
1984 catalog says Model CR "invisible bolt" design. Aluminum"
Picture bears it out, too. Post changed. Thanks.
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Old 10-20-15, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Brewsmith View Post
Mostly original '89



As far as the supposed geometry changes, would it theoretically be possible to just measure two vintages of frames in the same size and compare? Especially since we have one of the spec sheets above. What does it take to measure frame angles other than a protractor?
Thanks, Alex, added it to the post for '89's.
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Old 10-20-15, 07:23 PM
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Bicycle Guide review specs from the 1989 Expert

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Old 10-21-15, 08:13 AM
  #39  
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Re: series 6200 parts for 1984 through 1987.

On the other Ironman thread, lord_athlon confirms his original 87 Master is all 6208. (although I'd like a recount; I suspect the crank, FD, pedals and headset are 6207, based on Shimano's products from that year).

Since 6208 was issued in 1986, I assume in 1984 and 1985 the Shimano components on the Comp TA and Ironman would have been all 6207.

In 1986 Shimano introduced 6208, but the 600EX group sold was a mix of 6207 and 6208:
  • Front Derailleur - 6207
  • Non-SIS Rear Derailleur - 6207 (silver body)
  • SIS rear Derailleur -6208 (black body)
  • Non-SIS Shifters - 6207
  • SIS Shifters - 6208
  • Crank - 6207
  • BB - 6207
  • Freewheel - 6208
  • Caliper Brakes - 6208
  • Non-aero Brake Levers - 6208
  • Aero Brake Levers - 6209
  • Pedals - 6208
  • Hubs - Rear 6208, Front 6207
  • Headset - 6207 star shaped

1986 had SIS and aero brake levers, which would eliminate the italicized parts in the list. As already noted, brake levers would have been either Dia Compe or Shimano, both aero. This is assuming the 1986 Ironman did not come with leftover components from Shimano's 1985 lineup.

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Old 10-21-15, 08:37 AM
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Robbie...this is a great thread...and great idea on it being simply informational...We could probably use an entire encyclopedia of threads like this...
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Old 10-21-15, 01:25 PM
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Keep the corrections coming. Looking for documentation of a 1988 Master in yellow/white "straight fade."
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Old 10-21-15, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
Looking for documentation of a 1988 Master in yellow/white "straight fade."
Duh!, it was right there on the '88 post.
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Old 10-21-15, 07:13 PM
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Could you identify which Ironman years use proprietary odd ball Shimano shifter braze-ons? Clear details about this still allude me.
http://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-me...confusion.html
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Old 10-21-15, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by uncle uncle View Post
Could you identify which Ironman years use proprietary odd ball Shimano shifter braze-ons? Clear details about this still allude me.
http://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-me...confusion.html
That would be only the 1985 Ironman. The 1984 Centurion Comp TA also used that proprietary shifter braze-on.

Shimano called it the Brazed-on A Type, the standard shifter mount in use today they called the Italian Type, and the aero shifter mount that screwed into the top of the downtube was called the Brazed-on B Type.

Shimano 6207 shifter sheet for 1984
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Old 10-22-15, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
Done
For the 88 purple haze I found that Pure Ice name brand nail polish 542cp "No Means No" is a perfect match for the dominant purple. The fading purple is either Sally Hansen brand hard as nails nail polish 370 "No Hard Feelings" . Or L.A. colors name brand color craze nail polish cnp507 "Wisteria".
I think adding freewheel cog numbers would be very helpful to those trying to return to stock.
Sidenote : Nobody needs to be concerned how I know what fingernail polish to use. Hah.
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Old 10-24-15, 06:35 AM
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OK, folks. Please do me a 5-minute favor.
Look over the "main" information posts (Predecessor, etc)
Find the typo's and anything incorrect, or what you think needs changing.
Copy and paste the thread into a PM, and either add correction at the bottom, or in underline.
I'll look at each PM, correct the post, and we'll see how close we can get.
The gist is the OEM information, and touch-up gouge.

I'd like to see any OEM numbers on gearing, as well. I know the GPX was 52/42. I know the "round" Shimano was 53/39. I've seen different versions of the BioPace, both in 600 and 105. It would be nice to somewhat clear that up. Also, rear cluster info would be welcome.
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Old 10-24-15, 10:58 AM
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Hey R.T. just sent you a pm,however I get what you wanted now. Sorry. But will send you new pm per request soon.
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Old 10-24-15, 11:26 AM
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You've got me thinking about another Dave Scott now. There are two for sale locally that look to be in great condition. One is desirable (by me) Miami Vice paint in 54 and the other is Red/white in 56 Has anyone found a definitat ive geo chart for these? I assume 54 = 54cm top tube and 56 =56. My preference in modern bikes is around a 545 top tube and 110mm stem so I'm really trying to see if I can make the 54 work for me because that's probably the smaller end of my fit


Edit: just saw the link to the spreadsheet. Awesome work Robbie

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Old 10-24-15, 01:24 PM
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My 87 was 13-14-15-17-19-21
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Old 10-24-15, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by lord_athlon View Post
My 87 was 13-14-15-17-19-21
The Bicycling review of the 87 says 13-15-17-19-21-24, but I'd be inclined to go with a verified original bike; the test bikes could be specced differently from what hit the stores.
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