Narhay

I've purchased older NOS and used 5 speed freewheels for my 120mm spaced bikes as the new freewheels tend to be wider than the old ones. That being said, I am looking to see if there are any new alternatives.

This one looks interesting and it doesn't have the bulky lockring at the smallest cog. Anyone tried something like this or other freewheels?

Freewheel 5 Speed MTB Road Racing Bicycle Bike 14 28 Teeth Brown | eBay

Ricky4003bass

You'll have difficultly with the 28 cog on a 5 speed. 26 is generally the maximum - especially on older smaller cages (such as a Campy Gran Sport). There is a risk of the chain touching the 28 gear AND the jockey wheel at the same time.

clubman 

You get what you pay for. In this case a soft steel Made in China POS (and it's brown!), guaranteed to strip the first time you remove it. Stay with the tried and true Suntour 5 speed freewheels.

@Ricky4003bass I don't see where Narhay said he was running a short cage. Lots of long cage mechs out there to shift to 32 plus teeth.

Ricky4003bass

120mm dropout spacing is fairly old school, especially 5 speed, so the chances are, with a vintage machine, it would be a short or compact mech - besides, I was merely sharing my own personal experience. It is more the distance from the top jockey wheel to the axle that is the issue, rather than the length of the cage.

Also - check out Hilary Stone for info and/or appropriate freewheels: Hilary Stone - 5 speed Freewheels

That said - you can't beat a Suntour 13-26 5-speed!!!!! :-)

Slash5

It does look interesting. Looks to be straight teeth so will shift like we're still in the 70's. Free shipping so not a big risk to give it a try. Would be nice if they had a 26 as well, they are really hard to find. Co-ops etc. are full of the 28's.

bikemig 

+ 1. I was thinking the same thing when I saw the link; suntour is my freewheel of choice as well on a 5 speed. If buying new, I'd get the IRD freewheel.

John E

Yup -- that's why I hoard 26T cogs. As Ricky mentions, for many years 26T was the default maximum cog size for short cage derailleurs. That said, Chas. and other Forum regulars are pretty adept at making these older derailleurs handle 28T, or even a few more.

John E

... or a 14-26 5- or ultra-6-speed, assuming you can find one.

eschlwc

buy a sunrace or ird.

all my 5-speeds are 14-28. a short cage campy nr rd works just fine with it.

davester

That's not true. There were plenty of 28 tooth freewheels around in the 1960s and 1970s (generally referred to as "alpine gears"), used with various short cage derailleurs. Some derailleurs did have interference problems, especially if chain length was not carefully selected but I'd say that is a minority of derailleurs.

Ricky4003bass

A load of parameters to take into consideration - even the angle of the gear hanger, and even the length of the hanger is critical. With a 26 you're virtually guaranteed to be OK!

clubman 

There's no guarantees in life! You maybe shouldn't insist that the freewheel size should determine the max. gearing at the rear of the bike assuming original derailleurs can't handle them. Wait until your knees give out. The Suntour Perfect freewheel was designed to accept splined large cogs whether 5 or 6 speed. There are a number of friction Suntour slant-parallelogram gears that will easily handle 32 tooth (34, even 38), five speed freewheels. No they might not have been original spec but we're not all riding museum restos here. Even the humble Peugeots handled 28 tooth rears with their Delrin Simplex gears.

Trust me, we know Hilary and his treasure trove of parts and knowledge but many of us here choose to play fast and loose with the rules of vintage bike collecting. I see you have a nice collection of old school Brit bikes. You should post an introduction with pics.

Lascauxcaveman 

I too will respectfully disagree with that. Every single RD I've ever used has worked with a 28T cog, at least. Lots of them are fine with 30T and even 32T, sometimes you have to adjust chain length or mess with your axle position in the dropout. Current or past combos I've run with 52/42, 53/40 type of cranksets up front:

Campy Nuovo Gran Sport + 30T
Campy Nuovo Record + 30T
Campy C-Record + 32T
600 Arabesque + 34T

All short cage RDs

verktyg 

WHAT!!!!
@Ricky4003bass Don't believe everything you think!


Please read this post from a week ago:

https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...l#post18643621


@eschlwc @davester @Lascauxcaveman ++++

@Narhay Another problem with those cheap Chinese made FWs is that they're a copies of early 70's Shimano freewheels.

There was a problem trying to use a freewheel remover because there wasn't enough clearance to fit over the axle lock nut and you had to remove the axle from the non drive side to get the FW off. If you put one on a Phil Wood hub, you had to send the hub back to the factory to remove it!

The 1st generation IRD freewheels had some problems. For the past 3-4 years they have been excellent. Sunrace FWs are a little lower quality and Shimano still makes FWs in China and Malaya or Singapore.

Pay a few more bucks and get years of use.

verktyg

Chas.

1987

I also vote for Suntour. Yeah, sure Regina looks classy and correct on vintage road bikes. But once you have tried to remove a stuck Regina FW, especially the models with shallow prongs. Not to mention how to remove the thread on cogs, oh my. Well then you know how inferior the Regina design is. Suntour are also easy to service and fix, even if they look bad when found.

Yes, Shimanos are also a good choice. Although a bit faux pa on a very nice vintage bike. I have a modern Shimano "Megarange" FW on a commuter. Good design, but not as slim as the old ones. Looks like they use the same body for both 5 and 6 speeds.

Other than Suntour, Maillard, Sachs and Atom also made good ones.

bikemig 

+ 1. I just installed a suntour 5 speed freewheel (13-26) on a 1960 olmo gran sport I'm rebuilding. I'm trying to keep the build pretty much period correct but I like the suntour freewheel better as well.

1987

Yes I reason in the same way. For a period correct bike build that you are going to use, then I consider FW, bar tape, brake pads, tires, wires and housing as consumable parts. And many times rims as well. They just have to fit the look and feel, but the brands or models doesn't matter as much. But it's another story for a museum piece.

@Narhay, have you seen these?
https://www.compasscycle.com/shop/co...-cassette-hub/
Hubs ? SunXCD - Bicycle Components

Ricky4003bass

@eschlwc @davester @Lascauxcaveman


With all respect - every setup is different. My original comment(s) were intended as a word of caution, not a set of commands in stone.

Given the limited basic facts of the original post, 5 speed and 120mm spacing, that screams old-school, (The original post didn't mention long cage either, so given the lack of info, I assume original short cage, rather than a replacement long cage - who knows?) and my comments are based entirely on plenty experience, as well as referencing Hillary Stone. I am very much a make-do and mend kind of person, but sometimes, things just don't work out.

I am currently working a Viking 5 speed, 120mm spacing, Benelux dropouts, Campy G/S rear mech, that is basically fine with a 24 sprocket, just OK on a 26, and with a 28 the chain IS touching the upper jockey and the 28 sprocket, either side of the chain. please refer to the pictures below, with all 3 freewheels fitted, the 28 being pictured from both sides. This is also why I mentioned gear hanger length, as well as the actual position of the gear hanger eye in relation to the axle. a longer gear hanger will probably make a 28 work in this setup, or indeed a different mech with the cage pivoting at a different point, but these two are probably way out of original old school spec, and the friend for whom I am setting up the bike wants to try and keep it as period as possible. The current bolt-on plate gear hanger still has the mech lower than would be with a brazed on eye. Longer bolt-on plates are as hard to find as 26t freewheels. A longer chain in an attempt to correct the upper jockey position puts way too much slack in 5th gear, exasperated by the fact that there is on forward angle adjuster screw on a Gran sport rear mech.

Anyhow I have 40 years of cycle maintenance, and have encountered this problem on several occasions before as a fellow cyclist/enthusiast/mechanic, I find your comment "Don't believe everything you think!" insulting.

Regards from London,

Guy

Ricky4003bass

@clubman He didn't say long cage either, so given the old school facts, especially 120mm, than a short cage is probably a safer assumption.

eschlwc

i think this is the reason what you wrote was criticized. it reads so matter of fact. and the opposite is 'usually' true (that he won't have difficulty with a 28t). that's my experience with most short cage derailleurs and forged drops with derailleur hangers.

fixed. and most short cages probably work better with a 26 than with a 28.

agreed. this is certainly a problem with all my campy nr rd's and a 28t cog if the chain length is even slightly too long.

plonz 

Have you looked at IRD? Good cog range options. I'm sure they'll give you stack height if you contact them.

Classica Freewheels 5/6/7-Speed ? Interloc Racing Design / IRD

jimmuller 

"Fairly old school"??? Make that "is old school". but you forget who you are talking to! This is C&V, we're all old school around here!

In any case, there are plenty of us running 28's, and even bigger if the RD can handle it. I stopped running a 26 about 35 years ago.

Ricky4003bass

Presicely the point I was trying to get across "if the RD can handle it", backed up by my pictures, and I still got shot down in flames.........

Dammit - I'm going back to hub gears!

Ricky4003bass

Besides - PROPER old school (with FM or FC hub gears) is 110mm!!

jimmuller 

No offense intended by any of us, I'm sure. You "got shot down in flames" for making an absolute this-is-the-way-it-is declaration that most, if not all, of us know isn't necessarily true. The classic RD's most of us love such as the VGT-Luxe, the Vx-S (or -GT), Cyclone GT, Crane GT, Simplex Prestige (and all the others with exactly the same geometry), many Hurets, etc. handle a 28T FW quite easily. From my experience I'd say that back during the 120mm bike-boom far more popularly-priced, non-race-intended bikes came with a 28T than came with a 26T. Some people claim even a Campy NR can handle 28T though my experience is that it can only under the right conditions. Those RD's probably account for 95% of the bikes owned by C&V participants.

In case no one has said it yet, welcome to C&V!