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Campy experts tell me what I just bought please!

Old 06-02-16, 05:55 PM
  #1  
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Campy experts tell me what I just bought please!

I think these are Record 8 speed DT shifters from circa 1992. Levers look to be Athena. I wasn't too excited initially thinking they were friction shifters but then saw the notched insert. I'd always thought that Synchro II were the only Campy indexed shifters. I think they should clean up nicely.

Campagnolo Down Tube Shifters with Brake Levers | eBay
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Old 06-02-16, 06:08 PM
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Those are not Syncro II , but 8 speed index shifters. 2 G Spring style. Take them apart, clean lube and use them. They Shift Really Nice, I have a set on my Super Mondia.

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Old 06-02-16, 06:09 PM
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Inside views.



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Old 06-02-16, 06:40 PM
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Thanks, especially for the exploded pic. I'll be referring back when it comes time to install.
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Old 06-02-16, 08:12 PM
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I have a pair with a complete rear, but the front came disassembled and with a slew of miscellaneous, probably not correct parts. If anyone has a good exploded view of the exact parts for a front, it would be much appreciated. They are cool, and have the same indexing ratio as 8-speed Ergos.
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Old 06-03-16, 04:19 AM
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Record 2 G spring Style Down tube shifter exploded view.



If you need the later 3 G spring style let me know I have that too,
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Old 06-03-16, 06:05 AM
  #7  
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Originally Posted by Michael Angelo View Post
Record 2 G spring Style Down tube shifter exploded view.



If you need the later 3 G spring style let me know I have that too,
Thanks a lot! And I'm not sure which mine are - how can one tell? Can you post the 3 G one too?
Thanks again.
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Old 06-03-16, 07:45 AM
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My favorite 8 speed shifters, with the correct derailleur and 8 speed cassette it will shift very good.
There were 2 versions, Record, which is polished and had a cable adjuster and Veloce, not polished and no cable adjuster.
The Record was also used with Chorus and Athena groups, the Veloce with lower priced groups.
Because of the cable adjuster, they are Record.
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Old 06-03-16, 06:25 PM
  #9  
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Originally Posted by jeirvine View Post
Thanks a lot! And I'm not sure which mine are - how can one tell? Can you post the 3 G one too?
Thanks again.

3 spring version 8 speed, BTW 9 and 10 speed diagram is the same only the insert is different.

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Old 02-06-18, 02:32 PM
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Hi Everyone,

I'm bringing this old post back to life because it seems perfectly relevant, and already has some good information.

So I'm building up an 8-speed group with circa early-1990's Athena and Chorus stuff. I got a set of Syncro (Syncro 2?) downtube levers with 8 speed insert, cable adjuster and black cable run (same as the ones pictured in post #3 by Michael Angelo).

Thing is, mine seem to have an extra part that doesn't appear in any of the technical drawings/parts diagrams. It is a small, rubber/plastic c-shaped piece with some hooked notches on either end (see picture). It is very thin, and sits on top of the springs and grey insert.

Does anyone know what this might be? The only drawings I could find were identical to those poster above by Michael Angelo (thanks again).

Additional background: These were sent to me from Italy, and all the bits were inserted and cable tied to maintain order. When I removed part SL-RE020, that little grey clip was sitting just beneath it.

Originally Posted by Michael Angelo
3 spring version 8 speed, BTW 9 and 10 speed diagram is the same only the insert is different.
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Old 04-02-19, 07:39 PM
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[thread dig]

Thought I'd just jump in to ask some inane questions regarding Campy Record 8 speed downtube shifters.

1. The exploded diagram above (2 spring version) shows two concaved washers (SL-RE015) positioned opposed to each other. When I install the NDS shifter this way the SL-RE013 protrudes past the shifter body with the screw tightened right up. If I install them both the same way, it still protrudes, but a little bit less. If I only install one, then to me it's perfect. So my question is: is there a function of the concave/convex washer arrangement? This was just a mock up, so I haven't had cables connected to them yet.

2. The DS shifter has a fair amount of play in it with the screw wound right up. Is this normal? All the parts are there according to the diagram. *Edit: looking a bit closer at the diagram I may have the SL-RE008 installed backwards, which may explain it. *Edit edit: No I didn't.

3. What parts should be getting grease/lube? Obviously the G springs and index insert should, but what else? Everything? Does the frame boss get lubed?

Thanks.

Originally Posted by robertorolfo View Post
Does anyone know what this might be?
No, but I'm wondering if it was just a gap filler to stop the G springs from coming out?

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Old 04-02-19, 08:27 PM
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My '92 Montello had them, but I sure as hell didn't take them apart. Very cool to see them again, and people who know what they're about.

I've got 2 Synchro 2 7-sp setups, and they work just fine. Does not 8-sp need a different rear wheel, w/cassette, as well? Similar to Shimnao's freewheel/freehub deal?
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Old 04-02-19, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
Does not 8-sp need a different rear wheel, w/cassette, as well?
Not sure, but I know 8 speed shifters don't play nice with 7 speed derailleurs.
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Old 04-10-19, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
[thread dig]

Thought I'd just jump in to ask some inane questions regarding Campy Record 8 speed downtube shifters.

1. The exploded diagram above (2 spring version) shows two concaved washers (SL-RE015) positioned opposed to each other. When I install the NDS shifter this way the SL-RE013 protrudes past the shifter body with the screw tightened right up. If I install them both the same way, it still protrudes, but a little bit less. If I only install one, then to me it's perfect. So my question is: is there a function of the concave/convex washer arrangement? This was just a mock up, so I haven't had cables connected to them yet.

2. The DS shifter has a fair amount of play in it with the screw wound right up. Is this normal? All the parts are there according to the diagram. *Edit: looking a bit closer at the diagram I may have the SL-RE008 installed backwards, which may explain it. *Edit edit: No I didn't.

3. What parts should be getting grease/lube? Obviously the G springs and index insert should, but what else? Everything? Does the frame boss get lubed?

Thanks.
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Old 04-18-19, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
[thread dig]
Thought I'd just jump in to ask some inane questions regarding Campy Record 8 speed downtube shifters.
1. The exploded diagram above (2 spring version) shows two concaved washers (SL-RE015) positioned opposed to each other. When I install the NDS shifter this way the SL-RE013 protrudes past the shifter body with the screw tightened right up. If I install them both the same way, it still protrudes, but a little bit less. If I only install one, then to me it's perfect. So my question is: is there a function of the concave/convex washer arrangement? This was just a mock up, so I haven't had cables connected to them yet.
2. The DS shifter has a fair amount of play in it with the screw wound right up. Is this normal? All the parts are there according to the diagram. *Edit: looking a bit closer at the diagram I may have the SL-RE008 installed backwards, which may explain it. *Edit edit: No I didn't.
3. What parts should be getting grease/lube? Obviously the G springs and index insert should, but what else? Everything? Does the frame boss get lubed?
Thanks.
No, but I'm wondering if it was just a gap filler to stop the G springs from coming out?
Hey, sorry for the late reply, just got back from a little vacation. Let's see...

1. As a matter of fact, I was missing one of those concave washers when I installed my NDS shifter, but I went ahead anyway because it seemed to feel OK. Once fully assembled, it is working fine so far. The lever action is very light, but I haven't noticed any slipping under tension. That said, I haven't done many miles on the bike yet, so I don't know how it will do in the long run, but in my opinion you can give it a shot without the second washer. (Mine simply didn't have it, although the shifters were purchased used, so who knows...)

2. MY DS shifter doesn't have any play, and is working very, very well (great feel to the shifting and index action). That said, I left that famous grey piece of plastic in there, so who knows if that is taking up a bit of crucial slack or not. It's definitely not a functional piece, so that seems to be the only explanation.

3. I greased everything to the inside of part RE020. Don't remember if I put some grease between RE108 and RE122, but it wouldn't have been much if I did.


In terms of 7 and 8 speed compatibility, I'm taking a look at what I think is a 7-speed synchro bike right now. If I get it (of course I don't need it, but that has never stopped any of us from buying a bike before), I'll be sure to report back.
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Old 04-20-19, 03:38 AM
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Originally Posted by robertorolfo View Post
Hey, sorry for the late reply, just got back from a little vacation. Let's see...
1. Good to know, I’ll put one in and see how it goes.

2. It’s as almost if the SL-RE020 is a touch too long. I’m wondering if when the cable is installed it may provide just enough tension to hold it in place. I’m a bit reluctant to take s file to it.

3. Cool, that seems to be the popular approach.
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Old 04-22-19, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
1. Good to know, I’ll put one in and see how it goes.

2. It’s as almost if the SL-RE020 is a touch too long. I’m wondering if when the cable is installed it may provide just enough tension to hold it in place. I’m a bit reluctant to take s file to it.

3. Cool, that seems to be the popular approach.
Yes, I would be hesitant to start filing things as well, but it would also bother me if the installation had play in it. Maybe just try a tiny bit and see if it helps? I don't think it would cause a serious problem, but I don't want to take that responsibility...
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Old 05-23-19, 07:58 PM
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Just a follow up in case you were wondering (I'm sure you weren't.)

After much mucking around, I've finally found where the play in my DS lever is coming from.

The 'gap' between the SL-RE008 and SL-RE018 is approx 7mm, where the width of the lever (SL-RE002) at the point that sits within that gap is closer to 5.8mm.

The solution is to install a ~1.2mm washer to the shifter boss under the SL-RE008 which closes up the gap. Although I have a feeling the base plate on my shifter bosses may be a bit shallow, so I'll have to try it on the frame these levers are intended for and see if it makes any difference.

Anyway, nice to solve a mystery. How did I survive so long without a decent caliper?

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Old 05-23-19, 08:30 PM
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Function of the 2 concave washers is firm a type of ‘spring’ to keep the system from loosening up.

Anyone who knows me knows I’m not a fan of Campy dt indexing levers. That plastic insert, if I remember correctly was a either a type of ‘speed loader’ for the springs or a spring substitute to run without springs. Idk. Synchro levers are a hassle.
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Old 05-24-19, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
Just a follow up in case you were wondering (I'm sure you weren't.)
After much mucking around, I've finally found where the play in my DS lever is coming from.
The 'gap' between the SL-RE008 and SL-RE018 is approx 7mm, where the width of the lever (SL-RE002) at the point that sits within that gap is closer to 5.8mm.
The solution is to install a ~1.2mm washer to the shifter boss under the SL-RE008 which closes up the gap. Although I have a feeling the base plate on my shifter bosses may be a bit shallow, so I'll have to try it on the frame these levers are intended for and see if it makes any difference.
Anyway, nice to solve a mystery. How did I survive so long without a decent caliper?
I'm glad you followed up, and that is indeed some interesting information. How did you determine the gap between RE008 and RE018? By holding both against the boss and measuring?

Originally Posted by miamijim View Post
Function of the 2 concave washers is firm a type of ‘spring’ to keep the system from loosening up.
Anyone who knows me knows I’m not a fan of Campy dt indexing levers. That plastic insert, if I remember correctly was a either a type of ‘speed loader’ for the springs or a spring substitute to run without springs. Idk. Synchro levers are a hassle.
I'm only running one set right now, but I love them. They weren't too difficult to set up (I'm no expert), and the feel is great. I strongly prefer it to a 600 SIS set that I'm also using regularly.
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Old 05-24-19, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by robertorolfo View Post
How did you determine the gap between RE008 and RE018? By holding both against the boss and measuring?
Pretty much. Just installed it without the lever. The calipers hold it apart enough for measuring purposes.
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Old 07-11-19, 05:58 PM
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Welcome back. So I've had my 8 speed Campy indexed DT shifters on for a while now and I love them - they look great and the 'click' changing gears is just so satisfying...

...but, I can't get them to hold low gear, which is 25T on my cassette.

It will happily stay in 8 when it's on the work stand, but the minute I put any load on it actually riding it will jump down to 7. And that's actually the DT shifter slipping down a notch, too. It feels like the cable tension is too much for it, yet if I loosen the cable any further the shifting suffers across the entire cassette. The limit screw is adjusted so the derailleur is just clearing the spokes, so I don't think it's that.

My frustration is the Ergopower levers that these replaced worked in every gear, every time, so I can't see why these would be any different - it's essentially the same mechanism in a different place.

So here's my action plan:

1. Check if g-springs need replacing or opening up. I'll do this by measuring the current g-springs compared with some NOS g-springs I have spare (which are for the left Ergopower lever, so I can't just put them in.) I don't think this is the issue as my DT shifters looked hardly used when I bought them.

2. Remove grease off notched insert SL-RE019. When I replaced the g-springs in my Ergopower lever, I greased the notched insert, so I did the same when I installed the DT shifters. Could the grease be stopping the g-spring from engaging with the last notch properly?

3. If none of the above works - swap notched insert and washer and run as friction shifters.

These shifters also came in a 3 spring version, so I'm wondering if it was a known problem.

Anything else I need to consider?
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Old 07-17-19, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
Welcome back. So I've had my 8 speed Campy indexed DT shifters on for a while now and I love them - they look great and the 'click' changing gears is just so satisfying...


...but, I can't get them to hold low gear, which is 25T on my cassette.


It will happily stay in 8 when it's on the work stand, but the minute I put any load on it actually riding it will jump down to 7. And that's actually the DT shifter slipping down a notch, too. It feels like the cable tension is too much for it, yet if I loosen the cable any further the shifting suffers across the entire cassette. The limit screw is adjusted so the derailleur is just clearing the spokes, so I don't think it's that.
...
These shifters also came in a 3 spring version, so I'm wondering if it was a known problem.

I only know the 3-spring versions of these shifters, and mine are 9-speed, but since you asked me on another thread, I'll give it a try.

Ref: The last gasps of Syncro ~ tears for gears

First, can I assume that you have a Campagnolo branded cassette (not Miche or some such) and that sprockets and chain are clean and not worn? Derailler hanger is straight? (Yes, I know the Ergos worked, but still....)

I'm attaching great diagnostic value to your observation that when the chain jumps off the biggest sprocket, the shifter lever visibly moves a click (as if manipulated by an unseen hand): This sounds to me like there is not enough tension in the D-ring screw that mounts the shifter onto the frame. Harking back to the old NR friction shifters where you had to adjust (and frequently re-adjust) those screws to get them just right, one might assume the D-rings on these are there for the same reason. Not so. You need to reef on them to lock the parts together. My finger pressure is not enough; I slip a small Allen wrench or screwdriver into the D and torque them gently but firmly. Don't break the D-rings. When you manipulate the levers before installing cable, you can hear the click become more solid and substantial when you've got them tight. Remember the tension in the derailer's return spring (and therefore the cable) is at the max when it's all the way inward to engage the biggest sprocket, and pedaling creates more tension from the flexing of the frame. That's when it will want to "auto-shift".

My 3-spring version works perfectly -- I never even have to use the little cable tension adjuster screw -- but it won't hold if not tight. (Same was true with the C-Record "Doppler" retrofriction shifters, so I knew what to expect.) Your 2-spring version might not achieve this, as per the Tears for Gears blogger. But try this fix before doing anything else. Sounds like your cable tension per se is right, because the shifting everywhere else is good.

Good luck.
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Old 07-17-19, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by conspiratemus1 View Post
I only know the 3-spring versions of these shifters, and mine are 9-speed, but since you asked me on another thread, I'll give it a try.

Ref: The last gasps of Syncro ~ tears for gears

First, can I assume that you have a Campagnolo branded cassette (not Miche or some such) and that sprockets and chain are clean and not worn? Derailler hanger is straight? (Yes, I know the Ergos worked, but still....)

I'm attaching great diagnostic value to your observation that when the chain jumps off the biggest sprocket, the shifter lever visibly moves a click (as if manipulated by an unseen hand): This sounds to me like there is not enough tension in the D-ring screw that mounts the shifter onto the frame. Harking back to the old NR friction shifters where you had to adjust (and frequently re-adjust) those screws to get them just right, one might assume the D-rings on these are there for the same reason. Not so. You need to reef on them to lock the parts together. My finger pressure is not enough; I slip a small Allen wrench or screwdriver into the D and torque them gently but firmly. Don't break the D-rings. When you manipulate the levers before installing cable, you can hear the click become more solid and substantial when you've got them tight. Remember the tension in the derailer's return spring (and therefore the cable) is at the max when it's all the way inward to engage the biggest sprocket, and pedaling creates more tension from the flexing of the frame. That's when it will want to "auto-shift".

My 3-spring version works perfectly -- I never even have to use the little cable tension adjuster screw -- but it won't hold if not tight. (Same was true with the C-Record "Doppler" retrofriction shifters, so I knew what to expect.) Your 2-spring version might not achieve this, as per the Tears for Gears blogger. But try this fix before doing anything else. Sounds like your cable tension per se is right, because the shifting everywhere else is good.

Good luck.
Thanks Conspiratemus1,

I'm not sure if the cassette is Campy or not - there's no 'C' stamps on it, so probably not, but it's in excellent condition - not really worn at all. I do have a Campy cassette on a spare wheelset (12-23)...probably wouldn't hurt to throw that on just to see if it changes anything.

Pretty sure my derailleur hanger is straight - at least visually it appears to be.

I was conscious of keeping the D-ring tight, but to be honest I was only giving it a reef by hand, so I'll try your allen key trick and see what happens. The right shifter does seem to loosen quite easily - I was planning to Loc-tite it in once I got the shifting working.

Since then a few things have happened:

I noticed the g-springs had created a little niche on the inside of the shifter body, so I cut a couple of small pieces of aluminum can which I slid behind them. My theory was it would give the g-springs a bit more 'bite' on the notches. It did work a bit, but once again on the road it jumped out of low gear.

I ordered a 1mm spacer that fits behind the cassette, effectively shifting the cassette over a bit, with the theory being low gear won't require quite as much tension on the cable. Whether 1mm makes any difference remains to be seen. It's coming from Italy, so I'll have to wait until it arrives. (Interestingly it's a Campagnolo part and the diagram shows an 8 speed cassette, so perhaps it was an endorsed 'solution'?)

I converted the shifters to friction . And all it took was removing washer SL-RE018! Now I can get every gear, every time - just no clicks.

Fun, huh?
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Old 07-17-19, 06:47 PM
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conspiratemus1
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Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
Thanks Conspiratemus1,

...
I was conscious of keeping the D-ring tight, but to be honest I was only giving it a reef by hand, so I'll try your allen key trick and see what happens. The right shifter does seem to loosen quite easily - I was planning to Loc-tite it in once I got the shifting working.

...
I ordered a 1mm spacer that fits behind the cassette, effectively shifting the cassette over a bit, with the theory being low gear won't require quite as much tension on the cable. Whether 1mm makes any difference remains to be seen. It's coming from Italy, so I'll have to wait until it arrives. (Interestingly it's a Campagnolo part and the diagram shows an 8 speed cassette, so perhaps it was an endorsed 'solution'?)

I converted the shifters to friction . And all it took was removing washer SL-RE018! Now I can get every gear, every time - just no clicks.

Fun, huh?
Definitely the mounting screw should in no way loosen easily. Make sure the screw does not bottom into the boss before it tightens down the shifter parts. It should be tight enough that it won't loosen even without Loctite.
Fascinated by the "spacer-behind-the-cassette" solution. New to me in this application. Please let me know how it works. Can you post a catalogue reference or other link? You'll need to re-dish the wheel a bit? Campag hubs already give quite off-centre wheels.
And I gather that converting the shifter to friction will not give you the Doppler action in the C-Record that prevents autoshifting, correct? i.e., there's no friction clutch in the mechanism that senses the direction that you're pulling or pushing the lever. The resistance to autoshifting resides in the notches.
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