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Retro Wheels That Are still Speedy?

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Retro Wheels That Are still Speedy?

Old 07-15-16, 11:18 AM
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Retro Wheels That Are still Speedy?

So I've been compiling NOS Ultegra 6400 components for my beloved Masi, and I'm not sure how to approach the wheels. I've built my own before, but I'm also considering throwing on some C24's with the Dura Ace stickers removed.

What would you do with this frame built up with 6400 Ultegra Tricolor?

She was a wall-hanger at my office with this configuration, but I'm turning her back into a rider.


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Old 07-15-16, 11:57 AM
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Looks good.
Would look good in my living room..... but it's the wrong size.
How about sewup wheels?
Are those Open Pro rims? ...what's wrong with just riding them?
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Old 07-15-16, 12:12 PM
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That Bike deserves Campag.

Why would you remove the Dura Ace stickers?
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Old 07-15-16, 12:17 PM
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The Dura Ace C24 rims I'm considering are speedy, light, strong, and aren't too visually offensive (IMO) to the vintage eye when the flashy "Dura Ace" stickers are removed.

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Old 07-15-16, 01:20 PM
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Looks good just the way it is. I'm not a fan of modern wheels on vintage bikes.
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Old 07-15-16, 01:36 PM
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You think 32 spokes is too many?
I say ride it the way it is.
Those Dura Ace rims won't look right. They ARE visually offensive to my eye.
I hate black spokes on 30 year old bikes.
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Old 07-15-16, 01:51 PM
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I think without the stickers, they might fit in alright. Zipp 808's, not so much.
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Old 07-15-16, 01:56 PM
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H + Son TB 14 rims?

Velo Orange Raid rims?

Also lose those Gatorskins and get some decent tires!
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Old 07-15-16, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by trailangel View Post
You think 32 spokes is too many?
I say ride it the way it is.
Those Dura Ace rims won't look right. They ARE visually offensive to my eye.
I hate black spokes on 30 year old bikes.
Ditto that.

One exception (for me) would be black spokes and rims on a old black bike; a sin I have committed and do not repent.
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Old 07-15-16, 02:53 PM
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Thanks for the responses. What if I re-laced my old 7850 C24's with stainless CXRays? The black anodization on those is already starting to wear off.
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Old 07-15-16, 03:16 PM
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Mavic GL 330's (or 280's if you can find ) - radial laced front and radial/3X in back with Conti Sprinter 250 tires for everyday riding , or Vitt Corsa CX tires for speedy days

Those wouldn't just have a retro appearance, they Are retro, but still fast


What manner of brake caliper are you running? It looks awesome !
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Old 07-15-16, 03:26 PM
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Speedy Vintage?

Sewups?
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Old 07-15-16, 03:34 PM
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I like the current wheels, too. I would stick with those wheels if you still have them. C-record hubs are hard to beat, even if they do not match the rest of the tri-color group you are gathering.

Are you sticking with 126mm (6400 7-speed) drivetrain, or are you thinking a 130mm drivetrain (6401 or ST-6400/6400EX 8-speed)?

+1 that those Dura-Ace wheels would look out of place on your Masi. Another option is 7400/7402/7402 hubs. Really smooth hubs and would fit in with the 6400 group. I'm also partial to box-section rims, and a think a nice polished alloy set of rims like Mavic Module 3 would compliment the lovely chrome fork crown nicely.

When I built my KG86, I wanted to stick with vintage-looking wheels but wanted to try a modern drivetrain, so I built up a pair of Wolber tubular rims with a c-record front hub and a modern Campy 130mm rear.



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Old 07-15-16, 04:51 PM
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I almost forgot ----- recently I scored a pair of NOS Mavic CXP-30 tubular rims (30mm aero profile)

these are not truly vintage , but they are early to mid 90's and would look good with your machine -

If you could find a set NOS , lace 'em up to some Ultegra hubs - maybe even source some bladed spokes for the front if you can find them -- and get ready to drop the hamer !
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Old 07-15-16, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by calamarichris View Post
The Dura Ace C24 rims I'm considering are speedy, light, strong, and aren't too visually offensive (IMO) to the vintage eye when the flashy "Dura Ace" stickers are removed.

One of the best all-around wheels I've ever ridden, Chris.
I'd have no qualms about de-labeling, perhaps even with some gumwall Veloflex or Vittoria.
If anyone doesn't like it, all they have to do is ride 'em. Great wheels.
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Old 07-15-16, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by calamarichris View Post
Thanks for the responses. What if I re-laced my old 7850 C24's with stainless CXRays? The black anodization on those is already starting to wear off.
Can you say bad-ass, boys and girls?
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Old 07-15-16, 08:17 PM
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Knock some sense into me but I'd get silly retro. You have Japanese flavor going on with a mid shade dark anodized tone. Then there's the Masi story.

Depending on your weight but the rim choice: USA vintage Sun Mistral 32 rear, 24 hole front tubular. Crazy yes, but you said fast and retro. Figure out the rest for hubs but spokes DT Swiss db or WS in silver.

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Old 07-15-16, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by DMC707 View Post
Mavic GL 330's (or 280's if you can find ) - radial laced front and radial/3X in back with Conti Sprinter 250 tires for everyday riding , or Vitt Corsa CX tires for speedy days

Those wouldn't just have a retro appearance, they Are retro, but still fast


What manner of brake caliper are you running? It looks awesome !
Unless you are a true featherweight,....radially laced GEL280'S might not be such a good idea those rims deflect quite a bit at the eyelets and at the sidewalls with just spoke tension loading them. Most riders are much better off with with 32H GL330'S with cross three lacing, if they expect any sort of true world reluabilty from their wheelsets.....
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Old 07-15-16, 09:01 PM
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Your title does say "Retro wheels" so assuming you are going for semi period correctness, 32h 3x tubular wheels are correct for the mid 80s. Fast clinchers didn't exist yet really, and 28h or less was for time trials only for the most part. 36h was still being used.

Since you have the aero brakes, aero type rims are appropriate, but they were not very deep in profile at the time. Try like one inch. Assos were the coolest. You might find some but I bet they are not cheap. I'd simply build up a new set using a modern rim with similar profile, and no stupid stickers.

BTW, "wheelsets" wasn't yet a concept. I think that started with zipp wheels in the 90s.
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Old 07-15-16, 09:12 PM
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Originally Posted by calamarichris View Post
The Dura Ace C24 rims I'm considering are speedy, light, strong, and aren't too visually offensive (IMO) to the vintage eye when the flashy "Dura Ace" stickers are removed.

They actually make you faster? I'm serious. I know nothing about modern wheels. I'm stuck in the seventies.
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Old 07-16-16, 12:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Grand Bois View Post
They actually make you faster? I'm serious. I know nothing about modern wheels. I'm stuck in the seventies.
I'm sure this thread will turn into a gym shower contest, but yes, modern wheels will permit you to ride faster if your goal is to ride a century in 5 hours or less without having fast friends along.
I'd ridden two sub-five centuries and the '11 Solvang Century was to be my third in a row. Something terrible happened in Greece or Europe back then, and the strong dollar suddenly affected Wiggle.co.uk's price on these Dura Ace C50's suddenly dropped to my price range right before Solvang, so...
Long story short: I finished in 5:00:41 because the last light before the finish line in Solvang suddenly turned red as I approached, and there was a smiling CHP waiting for me to run it.
But the time became secondary to the experience. Foxen Canyon Road is a beautiful climb with a mild headwind. Despite fighting crosswinds and headwinds all day long, I was feeling strong on that final climb, and the train behind me got longer and longer. I assumed we'd take turns and share the work, but every time I pulled to the side and slowed, the 30-50-riders balked and looked back at each other.
I was shocked and disgusted that no one wanted to share the work, but I pushed them out of my focus and worked toward my sub-5 goal. My HR crept up, 165...168..172... but I just focused on my fluid pedaling, breathing fully, drinking every mile or so, and relaxing the burn away. I decided the group drafting me didn't matter, that only my own focus would get me to the finish line in sub-5, so I quit looking at the shadows behind me and just lived in my private little cave with my pain.
Foxen Canyon got gradually steeper and steeper, and I downshifted when I had to, to keep my HR below 175. At one point, the swirling headwind and steepening grade became too much, and I had only two more gears left, so I pulled off to let the guy behind me come forward...
...nobody. There was nobody around me, as far back as I could see. At least a quarter mile, and maybe a half a mile. I'd ridden them all off my wheel.
So I didn't break 5 hours on that windy century, but it was one of the best five hours and forty-one seconds of my life. I've ridden longer centuries faster than that day, but that was my first time with the fast wheels. Anyone who tells you fast wheels don't matter is either hoping to trick you into riding slow wheels, or trying to prove how macho they are by being above such petty things as aerodynamics.

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Old 07-16-16, 01:13 AM
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They make you faster just because of better aerodynamics?
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Old 07-16-16, 04:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Grand Bois View Post
They make you faster just because of better aerodynamics?
Yup, when your speed is in the 20+ mph range. If Chris did five-hour centuries that included climbing, he probably spent a good bit of time over 20 mph on descents and flats.

That said, I'd go with Open Pro CDs laced to nice hubs. Or the de-badged, relaced C24s.
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Old 07-16-16, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by lostarchitect View Post
H + Son TB 14 rims?

Velo Orange Raid rims?

Also lose those Gatorskins and get some decent tires!
Or in light of the frame's age and identity, grey Mavic GP4 tubular rims with Campy 8-speed Ergopower. My crash-damaged Mondonico with Campy 3x10 was a lovely ride! Such wheels can be 1500g per set with skewers, use 250 g tire/tube combo (the tubular), and are very plausibly in-period for an owner who upgrades occasionally. BITD Campy would have been the common assumption for a Masi, not Shimano. Even Dura-Ace.

A lot has been done on the site about retro frames with modern gruppo, and sure, I've done it, too. But most have stayed with 32 hole wheels with conventional spoking and plausibly vintage rims: Fiamme, Mavic, Wolber, Super Champion, Ambrosio, Nisi, Martano (most likely original to the frame, on Campy Record hubs), et cetera.

You'd have to cold-set the frame since 8-speed hubs are 130 mm, but that is better than force-fitting the rear wheel, at least IMHO.

Or bite the bullet and go back to 7-speed Campy friction shifting with Super Record. Be true to your frame!

I always think it is obnoxious for someone to pee on my concept when I ask a question around here, so I apologize. But I AM a fellow Masi owner (1980 frame) and I treat it more reverently than my other faves, Woodrup and Mondonico.

If you just need aero wheels, there is a lot of cheap stuff on Ebay.
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Old 07-16-16, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by calamarichris View Post
Thanks for the responses. What if I re-laced my old 7850 C24's with stainless CXRays? The black anodization on those is already starting to wear off.
Certainly one of the less-evil solutions!
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