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Compass Cayuse Pass a good go-fast tire?

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Compass Cayuse Pass a good go-fast tire?

Old 07-17-16, 05:03 AM
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Compass Cayuse Pass a good go-fast tire?

I've see people mention Compass tires and I'm wondering just how good these are. Particularly the Cayuse Pass for use as a go fast tire. It only comes in 700c x 26, but weighs less than my staple 700c x 23 Conti GP4000IIs.

My go-to tires are the abovementioned GP4000IIs and Vittoria Open Corsa SC when I need gum sides. Of these two, I still prefer the Continentals but the Vittorias are quite nice.

I acted on past BF recommendations and tried the Panaracer Pasela PT folding bead tire. Not a good go fast tire and really no more comfortable IMO.

So interested in how the Compass Cayuse Pass would compare. Ideally, I'd get a little more comfort without a sacrifice in speed. Any feedback?

I'll add this line as my pre-emptive pass on the inevitable tubular/tubeless recommendations.

https://www.compasscycle.com/shop/co...6-cayuse-pass/
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Old 07-17-16, 05:35 AM
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Are you looking for a smoother ride on chip-seal (tar & gravel) roads? Or handling expansion bumps, or what?

What size tires do you have now? What do you weigh, and what air pressure in front and back?

Do you have room under the brakes, the fork, and the frame for larger sizes?
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Old 07-17-16, 06:44 AM
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If you want fast+comfy (and don't need gum) go with Michelin Pros.
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Old 07-17-16, 06:50 AM
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Originally Posted by thinktubes View Post
If you want fast+comfy (and don't need gum) go with Michelin Pros.
Or their newest Power series. The Power Competition 23's will be on my go-fast bike after this season.
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Old 07-17-16, 06:52 AM
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I would most definitely either stick with the Conti's (also available in 25's and 28's if you need more cushion) or go with something like a Veloflex Master. The tread compound of the Continental 4000s2 is hands down much tougher than the pasela based Compass tire, and it is tested to be one of the least rolling resistance tires in the world period. If you want a smooth rolling skin-wall the Master does IMO a little better in both puncture resistance and rolling ease than the Compass tire.

Many people here love the Compass tires, so I suspect my opinion will be different than others. Where I'm drawing my comparison is with the Compass 32c sized tires, so not a direct comparison here but enough known about build and performance based on siblings to offer $.02. My experience with the larger compass tires is at least one flat every 40 miles on the same road conditions that my Conti's have never had a flat on (and those have been ridden over 3k miles, and are just getting to the point of the rear needing replacement). Also the rolling resistance didn't seem "transformative" as compared to regular paellas. For the (way too significant) money, (much) better tires are available.
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Old 07-17-16, 08:05 AM
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I have 2100 miles on a pair of Cayuse Pass tires. I've only had maybe two or three flats, and I've ridden em on pavement and gravel. They're great tires, but I have a hard time justifying the price. $75 is a good chunk of change for a bike tire(in my opinion). Veloflex Masters and Vittoria SCs are almost as good, but only come in 25c and dont last as long. You can also buy 5 of them for the price of 2 Compass tires.

4000sII is a good tire as well, but doesn't look as good on a vintage build.
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Old 07-17-16, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Chrome Molly View Post
The tread compound of the Continental 4000s2 is hands down much tougher than the pasela based Compass tire, and it is tested to be one of the least rolling resistance tires in the world period.

How are they "Pasela based" when they have a totally different casing and tread? I believe the Paselas have a 66 TPI casing and the Compass tires are either 90 or 120. They're made by the same company but they seem totally different to me.
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Old 07-17-16, 04:20 PM
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At least the 26 is admittedly (by compass) a recased pasela. I safely assume the other apples aren't falling much farther from the tree either.

https://janheine.wordpress.com/2011/08/09/compass-tires-in-26-x-1-75/

Were they more reliable on my local pavement they would get a thumbs up (with the very heavy price caveat). For me the continentals and veloflex tires are more reliable. The veloflex reliability is slightly better than the compass tires and the price is about half for a better rolling tire. Easy decision for racy skinwalls IMO.
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Old 07-17-16, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Chrome Molly View Post
I would most definitely either stick with the Conti's (also available in 25's and 28's if you need more cushion) or go with something like a Veloflex Master. The tread compound of the Continental 4000s2 is hands down much tougher than the pasela based Compass tire, and it is tested to be one of the least rolling resistance tires in the world period. If you want a smooth rolling skin-wall the Master does IMO a little better in both puncture resistance and rolling ease than the Compass tire.
Maybe not the most popular response but one that makes sense to me. Thank you!

For now, I think I'll file my original question under "don't mess with a good thing" and continue my love affair with the GP4000IIs
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Old 07-18-16, 12:48 PM
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I've been using Compass or the very similar Grand Bois tires for about a decade in 26, 28, and 32mm sizes, on a variety of bikes, mostly on a pavement with brief gravel exposures. Obviously I'm very pleased with them. No more flats than any other tire in my 25 years' experience, and no sidewall cuts or dry-out, unlike the brown wall Conti Grand Prix of old. I consistently get 4500-5000 miles out of a tire (mounted in front new, then moved to the rear when that one is ready to be replaced). I really like their nice ride, steering effect, and low real-world rolling resistance, based on multiple Bicycle Quarterly tests. (Please don't turn this into a Jan Heine love/hate fest. I'm neither.) My previous faves were Panaracer-built Rolly-Poly's, I've had or tried Pasela TG, Gravel King and T-Serv, which are quite similar to each other, and the GB/Compass are distinctly nicer all around. I'm strongly biased toward tan sidewalls on my bikes (wife's are better with black), and only use folding bead tires.

All that said, I have experienced a few quality issues, and might try the similar weight but cheaper Soma Vitesse tires some day that are also Panaracer-built.

To the OP, I've sent you a PM about a pair of Cayuse Pass tires FS.

Last edited by Dfrost; 07-18-16 at 12:56 PM.
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Old 07-19-16, 05:58 AM
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I've been riding a pair of Michelin Dynamic Classics. I got them on sale for $10 a tire. They are very nice go fast tires. I have over 500 miles on them, no flats, no sign of wear. I have varied the psi and find I like them on the soft side. Actually just go by feel, haven't actually used a gauge on them. Highly recommend thsee tires. And at $10-15 they are a bargain.
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Old 07-19-16, 06:39 AM
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I accurately track mileage of tires for every flat and I have found that Compass tires are no worse than others in the flat department. Average miles between flats for Compass tires: 1160 miles. Getting flats is really random but in general the first flat comes at around 2352 (mean avg.) miles for Compass and Jack Brown tires with flats coming more frequently in second half of the tire's life.
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Old 07-19-16, 07:17 AM
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My friend Tad suggested I play here, and this is my first post. But I have to step up on Compass EL tires. Call me princess and the pea, but I like cozy, supple, fine-casing tires that run fast well below rated pressure.
I ride 90-130 mi/week, three bikes and try to ride each every week. I ride the largest fast/cozy tires that will fit fork or rear triangles. Two of the bikes have spent some time (several thousand miles) on fine-casing tubies. I also have several thousand miles on Challenge and Vittoria open tubulars. I've never tried the 26mm Compass, but can tell you the ELs are the only reason to buy these tires.
I have Compass EL's on two bikes - big tires, 32 and 38mm. On my third bike I ride Vittoria Open Pave 27 (really 26)mm.
They are fast and cozy. Direct comparison to high mileage Challenge open tubulars - the Challenge bead stretches out and gives up before the tread wears out. The vulcanized Compass tires won't do this, and the tread lasts about twice the Vittorias.
My best riding buddy rides a bit over half of my miles, and mostly on city/tough tires like Marathons.
I average under one flat per year, and he averages about two. It may be that I pay more attention to where I put my tires.
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Old 07-19-16, 08:49 AM
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what's the verdict on Schwalbe Marathon Supreme? ....

I'm looking at converting a 1980's Bridgestone mountain bike and will be adding drop bars, bar end shifters, fenders and dynamo hub/lights .... I'm looking at the 26x2" Schwalbe Marathon Supreme (would love Compass Rat Trap Pass, but they are too expensive and I have not found them in the UK (I would have to import them from the USA, then pay import duties ontop of the price)
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Old 07-19-16, 09:38 AM
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What is a "cozy" tire?
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Old 07-19-16, 09:57 AM
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sounds like a deflated soccer ball going over tar strips and doesn't transmit them to your bung hole

sound will tell you an awful lot about a tire. A quieter tire is a more-efficient-rolling tire, very simply because sound is kinetic energy being taken from the tire.

Last edited by bulldog1935; 07-19-16 at 10:02 AM.
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Old 07-19-16, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by dim View Post
what's the verdict on Schwalbe Marathon Supreme? ....

I'm looking at converting a 1980's Bridgestone mountain bike and will be adding drop bars, bar end shifters, fenders and dynamo hub/lights .... I'm looking at the 26x2" Schwalbe Marathon Supreme (would love Compass Rat Trap Pass, but they are too expensive and I have not found them in the UK (I would have to import them from the USA, then pay import duties ontop of the price)

You might consider the Schwalbe Kojak 26 x2.00. It has the same TPI, It's a LOT (100g) lighter than the Marathon and WAY ($35.00) less money. Not sure why, as it seems superior. I have them on a couple bikes in the 700c version and they are fantastic.
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Old 07-19-16, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by bulldog1935 View Post
sound will tell you an awful lot about a tire. A quieter tire is a more-efficient-rolling tire, very simply because sound is kinetic energy being taken from the tire.
I would advise caution with that line of thought. It doesn't take very much energy to produce a lot of sound (think of how a cricket's chirp can travel), but there are some really thick and heavy tires that rob energy noiselessly.
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Old 07-19-16, 10:16 AM
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thick, stiff tires rob energy by not following the road surface and losing momentum every time they re-contact the road surface.
That event also makes sound
Heavy tires are not inherently inefficient. My buddy's Marathon's roll extremely well.
Where you pay for heavy tires is trying to accelerate them
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Old 07-19-16, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by bulldog1935 View Post
thick, stiff tires rob energy by not following the road surface and losing momentum every time they re-contact the road surface.
That event also makes sound
Heavy tires are not inherently inefficient. My buddy's Marathon's roll extremely well.
Where you pay for heavy tires is trying to accelerate them
All I'm saying is that it's not absolute, and sound isn't the only way that wasted energy is dissipated -- much is also lost as heat.
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Old 07-19-16, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Chrome Molly View Post
At least the 26 is admittedly (by compass) a recased pasela. I safely assume the other apples aren't falling much farther from the tree either.

https://janheine.wordpress.com/2011/...-in-26-x-1-75/

Were they more reliable on my local pavement they would get a thumbs up (with the very heavy price caveat). For me the continentals and veloflex tires are more reliable. The veloflex reliability is slightly better than the compass tires and the price is about half for a better rolling tire. Easy decision for racy skinwalls IMO.

Interesting. It appears that's only for the 26" and that only the tread pattern is the same. The casing is totally different as is the tread material. I dunno.

I can tell you that the tread on the 700c / 650b tires is different and the casing is different as well, so they are clearly not Pasela based.
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Old 07-19-16, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by lostarchitect View Post
Interesting. It appears that's only for the 26" and that only the tread pattern is the same. The casing is totally different as is the tread material. I dunno.
Yep. Different casing, different tread rubber and thickness, aramid bead instead of steel. But otherwise exactly the same.

All joking aside, the impression I get is that Compass felt pressured into having a 26" option to round out their offerings, but their heart wasn't 100% in it at the time, so they had Panaracer reuse their Pasela mold for the tread.

Since the Elk Pass and Rat Trap Pass are getting popular, it would be really cool if they redid the 1.5" and 1.75" sizes with their "optimized tread", but I won't hold my breath.
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Old 07-19-16, 10:47 AM
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I read a ton of the reviews about Compass tires.

"Makes chip seal roads disappear"...

"Like floating on air"....

"Blah blah blah best thing in the world"...

"Hyperbole x a million sheer awesomeness"....

I thought it's gotta be malarkey. Too much praise, too much hype, bordering on loony worship. But I was curious and needed some tan walls in 35mm so I decided to try them. The prices are ridiculous. It's a bike tire for crying out loud.

They mounted easily and seated themselves perfectly at exactly max PSI. No manual manipulation needed. OK, off to a good start.

Took the bike for 20 mile ride. The hype is true. I repeatedly found myself looking down and the road surface and asking myself, "I saw that, why didn't I feel that." It actually became a little entertaining as I began looking for rough patches to continually test the tire.

They are terrific in all performance aspects, but the thing I like best is how they eliminate vibration. There is a park in my town that has a HUGE concrete area as part of a Veteran's Memorial. I frequently ride through this park on a number of different bikes and tires. The concrete has a decorative pattern stamped into the surface. The ridges are just the right depth and and distance from one another to cause that kind of BUZZ that will vibrate the fillings out of your teeth. I hate to sound like a shill, but the Compass tires floated over the surface. Literally. It's actually extremely eerie because you can see the rough surface passing beneath you. It's like two of your senses are receiving conflicting data and the brain goes, "Huh?"

That's my experience. I feel stupid spending that kind of money on a bike tire. But they do ride freakishly nice.

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Old 07-19-16, 11:02 AM
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because they're vulcanized, they get better as they stretch
Challenge Strada Biancas are even better as eliminating vibration and run quieter. But as I said above, the bead will quit and let go before the tread wears out

Scott, we're cool
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Old 07-19-16, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by bulldog1935 View Post
because they're vulcanized, they get better as they stretch
Can you expand on that please? I'd enjoy having a better understanding. Thanks.
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