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Cannondale Black Lightning Tire Rubs Front Derailleur

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Cannondale Black Lightning Tire Rubs Front Derailleur

Old 07-24-16, 04:43 PM
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batemapa
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Cannondale Black Lightning Tire Rubs Front Derailleur

Hello All,

I have a 1989 Cannondale Black Lightning, I got it off Craigslist in 2008. About a year ago I replaced the old worn tires, which were on the bike when I bought it, with 27x1 Panaracer Pasela Tires. I thought these were the correct size for the wheels. Since then if I inflate the rear tire to the recommended pressure, or within 30 PSI of it, the tire rubs on what I believe is the front derailleur mount (see photos).

My intuition says the I got the wrong tire, but I've seen these tires on a lot of Black Lightnings around this forum and elsewhere. Is there an adjustment I can make to the derailleur, or some troubleshooting I can do to determine the culprit.

Thanks you for your time and help.
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Old 07-24-16, 04:46 PM
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I thought only the STxxx touring bikes in 1989 have 27" rims? See specs for SR500, which is all black and shows 700c rims.
https://vintagecannondale.com/year/1989/1989.pdf

Loosen the QR and pull the wheel back as far as you can in the dropout.

Last edited by oddjob2; 07-24-16 at 04:53 PM.
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Old 07-24-16, 04:51 PM
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If I'm not mistaken Black Lightnings would have been equipped with 700c wheels and tires. If you are unable to move the wheel back far enough to fix the rubbing you may have to swap back to 700c wheels & tires.
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Old 07-24-16, 04:54 PM
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What oddjob said. If that doesn't do it, maybe the other examples you saw were with 700c wheels(?)

Simul-posted with others saying the same thing I see.
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Old 07-24-16, 05:13 PM
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Thank you all for your responses. I moved it around in the dropout as much I could, and it was still rubbing.

I went out and took a look at the rim, and it says: Araya 27x1 1/4 w/o JAPAN. Looking at the rim reminds me that I did ask someone that works at a bike shop what a good tire would be for the bike & wheel, and that's what they recommended. I guess it is possible that I got a different size than he recommended. I guess it is also possible the previous owner put the wrong size wheels on here. The only thing I've changed is the handlebar tape and the tires.
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Old 07-24-16, 05:46 PM
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That bike came with 700c wheels.
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Old 07-24-16, 06:47 PM
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I believe the dropouts are semi-vertical and wont lend much for adjustment.

You need a 700c wheelset as aforementioned. Problem solved. The criterium designed racers have very little space for tire clearance even with 700c wheelsets as factory design.

Last edited by OldsCOOL; 07-24-16 at 06:52 PM.
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Old 07-24-16, 08:46 PM
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Ouch. That fix is gonna cost a bit more than a set of tires.
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Old 07-25-16, 05:25 AM
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Originally Posted by batemapa View Post
Thank you all for your responses. I moved it around in the dropout as much I could, and it was still rubbing.

I went out and took a look at the rim, and it says: Araya 27x1 1/4 w/o JAPAN. Looking at the rim reminds me that I did ask someone that works at a bike shop what a good tire would be for the bike & wheel, and that's what they recommended. I guess it is possible that I got a different size than he recommended. I guess it is also possible the previous owner put the wrong size wheels on here. The only thing I've changed is the handlebar tape and the tires.
I got the same EXACT bike, 1989 Black Lightning, and as been mentioned, it came with 700cc wheels.

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Old 07-25-16, 06:09 AM
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VELOMINE.COM is your friend if you don't want to build a wheelset.

Originally Posted by J.Oxley View Post
Ouch. That fix is gonna cost a bit more than a set of tires.
By the time the OP sells his 27" rims and the new tire(s), it won't be that financially painful

Last edited by oddjob2; 07-25-16 at 08:07 AM.
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Old 07-25-16, 06:18 AM
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Agreed 100%, the Black Lightnings came with 700C wheelsets, watch the For Sale section here, and eBay also. You can pick up a good set without too much expense from them, or even a co-op. That will be a nice bike once you sort things out, very nice for crits and sports riding, somewhat stiff, but great geometry for its intended function, IMHO.

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Old 07-25-16, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by batemapa View Post
Thank you all for your responses. I moved it around in the dropout as much I could, and it was still rubbing.

I went out and took a look at the rim, and it says: Araya 27x1 1/4 w/o JAPAN. Looking at the rim reminds me that I did ask someone that works at a bike shop what a good tire would be for the bike & wheel, and that's what they recommended. I guess it is possible that I got a different size than he recommended. I guess it is also possible the previous owner put the wrong size wheels on here. The only thing I've changed is the handlebar tape and the tires.
It's not the bike shop guy's fault. He recommended tires for the wheels you have, which have a larger rim diameter than the original 700c wheels. Otoh, if he mounted the tires on the bike (sounds like he didn't) he should have seen the problem and alerted you to it rather than sell you the tires.

It isn't easy (not sure it's even possible) to find 27" tires smaller than 1". I think you are stuck and need the 700c wheels. They certainly will be a better fit and you will have vastly more tire choices, as 700c is the industry standard now, and has been for a long time.
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Old 07-25-16, 08:11 AM
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My question is how he's ridden the bike with 27" wheels for 8 years without a problem.
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Old 07-25-16, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted by The Golden Boy View Post
My question is how he's ridden the bike with 27" wheels for 8 years without a problem.
I've actually been wondering that myself. The tires that were on it when I bought it did not rub, even when filled to the correct psi, which is bizarre.

Tbh the last year or so since I've had the new tires I havent been in a place to be able to ride it more than a few times, and everytime I just resorted to letting air out of the tires until they didn't rub and saying I'd deal with it "later" (absurd and lazy I know). I'm finally at a place where I can ride often/commute, so I'd like to get it setup properly.

Thanks everyone for the replies, it has been very helpful. Looks like 700c it is, I'll keep an eye out on the recommended sites for a deal.
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Old 07-25-16, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by batemapa View Post
I've actually been wondering that myself. The tires that were on it when I bought it did not rub, even when filled to the correct psi, which is bizarre.
I know Paselas run a little big, but not exorbitantly so...
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Old 07-25-16, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by due ruote View Post
It's not the bike shop guy's fault. He recommended tires for the wheels you have, which have a larger rim diameter than the original 700c wheels. Otoh, if he mounted the tires on the bike (sounds like he didn't) he should have seen the problem and alerted you to it rather than sell you the tires.

It isn't easy (not sure it's even possible) to find 27" tires smaller than 1". I think you are stuck and need the 700c wheels. They certainly will be a better fit and you will have vastly more tire choices, as 700c is the industry standard now, and has been for a long time.
Avocet used to have a 27x7/8 tire, but I'm sure they are all gone by now. If any are still around, they would be 30+ years old and I wouldn't want to trust them.

Find a used bike with 700 wheels and plenty of clearance. Then swap wheels and resell the bike for a cost neutral solution.
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Old 07-25-16, 09:17 AM
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You could always just run a single chainring and eliminate the front derailleur. I think the 700c wheels are the correct solution, but depending on the terrain you ride, a 1 x 6 or 1 x 7 drivetrain can actually be quite nice.
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Old 07-25-16, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by oddjob2 View Post
VELOMINE.COM is your friend if you don't want to build a wheelset.



By the time the OP sells his 27" rims and the new tire(s), it won't be that financially painful
keeping in mind the overall rear wheel axle width, I would not want to have to place a 130 mm wide locknut assembly in a 126 mm Cannondale very often.
Too much work.

Pretty sure the bike is 126 mm wide

The very cheap way out would be to go with a front derailleur that has the pivots in plane with the bike, the diagonal pivot approach places much mass near the tire.
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Old 07-25-16, 02:37 PM
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repechage, There really isn't much effort involved to install a 130 mm OLD hub into a 126 mm spaced frame. My '89 Cannondale has had them for years.

batemapa, I agree with the poster above who suggested Velomine.

Brad
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Old 07-25-16, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by repechage View Post
keeping in mind the overall rear wheel axle width, I would not want to have to place a 130 mm wide locknut assembly in a 126 mm Cannondale very often.
Too much work.

Pretty sure the bike is 126 mm wide.
Cannondale did 128 mm for at least one production year back then, during the transition between the 126-mm and 130-mm standards.
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Old 07-25-16, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by bradtx View Post
repechage, There really isn't much effort involved to install a 130 mm OLD hub into a 126 mm spaced frame. My '89 Cannondale has had them for years.

batemapa, I agree with the poster above who suggested Velomine.

Brad
And Brad knows I will chime in to agree. Since the build 3 seasons ago my '88 Criterium Series has had the 130mm spaced Vuelta Corsa Lite zipping it along. Is it a difficulty spreading the few mm's to install the rear wheel? Only the first time. You get used to it, it really isnt a big deal.
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Old 07-25-16, 05:02 PM
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It looks to me like the whole derailleur needs to be rotated a few degrees on the seat tube. It might make the difference between it rubbing and not, but hard to tell for sure with the macro lens there.

Observation: That's rather aggressive tread if the bike is intended to be ridden on the road.
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Old 07-25-16, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by USAZorro View Post
It looks to me like the whole derailleur needs to be rotated a few degrees on the seat tube. It might make the difference between it rubbing and not, but hard to tell for sure with the macro lens there.

Observation: That's rather aggressive tread if the bike is intended to be ridden on the road.
From what I can see it can't be rotated, it bolts to a bracket and can only move vertically.

Regarding the tread, I live in north Florida and it rains almsot every afternoon from about May to September. Also may use some very light trails. Also they were recommended, and I'm a rookie.
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Old 07-25-16, 05:42 PM
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700x28 has always been sufficient for me for a road bike that occasionally gets ridden on trails. That will get you about 1/4" of clearance or a bit more. 27" wheels are totally the wrong size on that bike. Someone just put them on there to flip it. Hack... Buy a set of 700c wheels from velomine or somebody and be happy.

If you want to bunny hop logs and boulders, you should get a mountain bike anway.
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Old 07-25-16, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Salamandrine View Post
700x28 has always been sufficient for me for a road bike that occasionally gets ridden on trails. That will get you about 1/4" of clearance or a bit more. 27" wheels are totally the wrong size on that bike. Someone just put them on there to flip it. Hack... Buy a set of 700c wheels from velomine or somebody and be happy.

If you want to bunny hop logs and boulders, you should get a mountain bike anway.
Yeah I feel silly about it, my only excuse is my own ignorance. That's why I turned to you guys, thanks for the input. Definitely going to get some 700s.
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