Help to identify a german bike possibly from 1938_
 

Hey, i would appreciate your help on identifying my bike.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B1...m9MOVp0VjdLV2M
I got it few years back and have been looking around but have not seen any kind even similar to this.
It's missing the front metal logo plate. On its frame are metal decorations.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B1...2tGSWlEVHU2cEk
First indication that i got that it mig was on back wheel hub that it might be from Germany and 1938.
First image is just an example. Second picture is what it looks like in real life and not that side of hub aswell.
http://http://farm8.staticflickr.com...4a53eeedf5.jpg
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B1...XVKbUhTUlFCVnM

From what i heard from the previous owner that the bike has been taken from Germany to Sweden and from there it ended up being in Estonia on some attic where i got it from.

I am planning to restore it soon and would greatly appreciate on any info you might have.

Interesting Bike. Saddle looks 60's to me, but probably added. Also the reflector pedals can't be any earlier than late 60's, or very early 70's, but again probably added later. Don

just to clarify. Pedals are modern bmx pedals cause nothing else screwed on and these seemed to suit by appearance.
Seat is later adission. but more and less comfortable. Front lantern modern.

Everything else seems to be original.

The most important info is that the front fork looks bend and should be checked.

Frame shape definitely looks German to me, "ein Schwanenhalsramen" . I'd say Adler, but those frames usually don't have the trusses that close together. Don't recognize the hub either, could be a Fichtel & Sachs, don't know other German manufacturers, but they've never had any consistency in the way their hubs look from the outside. It could also be a bike from the 50's or even 60's, as not much happened in bicycle design in those years inbetween.

You don't speak any German? You could feed German into google images and look for simular frames, or search in Germany with Duck Duck Go.

Frame for ladies = Damenramen
This ladies frame = Schwanenhalsramen
Bike(s) = Fahrrad/Fahrräder
26" = 26 Zoll
Hub(s) = Nabe(n)
Coaster brake = Rücktrittbremse

The most exceptional thing on the bike seem to be the lugs, but I don't know the German word for that. Also there is someone here who has a Vaterland bicycle, which is an old German manufacterer, maybe he's into German vintage.

Danke. I will look in to it. The fork yes, I noticed it too. There are some welds on the bottom of frame as well.
We'll let's hope this post catches German vintage bike enthusiasts eye.

So. No more clues ?

I think that's a Fichtel & Sachs coaster brake hub. This guy seems to know about the hubs; he might know more about the bike. Try emailing him: torpedo coasterbrake, fichtel and sachs parts

It's interesting that the head "lugs" don't encircle the head tube at all; they look to me more like an aesthetic way to cover up the tube joints than to function as joint reinforcement as lugs typically do.

Also, the lack of any stem forward extension seems odd on a mid-century bike; stem to handlebar clamps without extensions were used in the late nineteenth and early twentieth century, but were mostly phased out by the 1920s.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d7...psx8xuzgdu.jpg

A few more observations...

The wheel diameter, including tires, seems too small for the fenders (mudguards). Could be this bike originally had 28" wheels. If so, the hubs will provide no reliable information.

The gallows style seat post is consistent with a date from the 1930s or earlier.

The Ashtabula style crank, something we don't usually see on European bikes, is interesting. It does not suggest a high end bike.

Raleigh had plenty of stems with no forward extension on their rod brake models - my '39 Raleigh made Royal Elgin doesn't have any forward extension and DL-1s, also rod brake equipped, were made into the 1970's without any either.

So, still no definite opinion. I think I will change anyway all the wheel hubs and cranks. I think it would be just interesting to find out where the frame comes from.

Maybe it's a post war East-German product? They took old frame shapes and made their own working class paradise version?

Maybe you should reconsider if it's worth restoring at all? I really do like vintage bike restauration, but I believe it's more rewarding when it's a bike that started it's life as a nice and durable bike, and lots of those were made in Germany. I'm not saying this has never been a nice bike, but I would want to find out before I decided on restauring it, and otherwise find a better bike to restore.

Just a minor spelling correction

Ich stehe korrigiert.

well guys, thanks for the help and motivation. I will be still insisting pursuing my goal to renovate and|or restore the bike.
Will see when this sachs parts guy will get back to me.

I'm incredibly naive about vintage bikes, but I'm struck by how similar this bike is to the Bianchi in post 10: http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...-new-pics.html

Yes, I see a lot differences, but the main lines of the frame look very similar. Just a common style back in the day? A German copy of an Italian bike? Or Italian to begin with?

I think not. :D defenetly different shapes and style

http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...1&d=1469818029http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d7...psx8xuzgdu.jpg

Are these really fundamentally different shapes and styles? What am I missing?

Well from this example not so much different. But link you provided opened some green mens bike with really rigid forms.

For identification they are. A German manufacturer of those days would probably have one type of Schwanenhalsrahmen they thought was the best shape for elegance and rigidity, and would aim for recognizability. All those frames of different manufacturers where a bit different, different curves, the number of trusses and the location of them.

Note that the one on the left has a straight tube going from the bottom bracket to the head tube, while the other has a curving tube there. If you draw a straight line where that curving tube lies, you will see that the bike on the right has a significantly lower step-through area on the frame. A person wearing a skirt or long coat can ride either bike, but the skirt or coat can be longer on the one on the right. The similarity between the bikes is stylistic; the one on the left is an imitation of the one on the right.

Oh and as it turns out. The bike most probablly is swedish. The Sachs parts guy got back to me.

Nothing else useful. Will try to find someone knowing something about Swedish bikes.