Raleigh Hate
#51
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
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If anyone is feeling inspired by the previous story, and they're small...
Vintage 1984/85 Raleigh Team U.S.A road bike - $200 (Willow grove)
image 1 of 15
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condition: excellent
make / manufacturer: Raleigh
model name / number: Team USA
serial number: 4KN0091
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20in./51cm. frame. Super clean and all original except Brooks sadle and Trek iso tech 2 tires. Awesome patriotic red,white,and blue American flag paint scheme. Some minor scuffs,scrapes,or scratches but overall very good condition ready to ride. $200.00 OBO. Doug
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Vintage 1984/85 Raleigh Team U.S.A road bike - $200 (Willow grove)
image 1 of 15
© craigslist - Map data © OpenStreetMap
(google map)
condition: excellent
make / manufacturer: Raleigh
model name / number: Team USA
serial number: 4KN0091
more ads by this user
20in./51cm. frame. Super clean and all original except Brooks sadle and Trek iso tech 2 tires. Awesome patriotic red,white,and blue American flag paint scheme. Some minor scuffs,scrapes,or scratches but overall very good condition ready to ride. $200.00 OBO. Doug
show contact info
#54
Steel80's
I've had a couple of Gran Prix's, a Record, and an early Technium. I didn't have a problem with Raleigh's workmanship (maybe I didn't look close enough!), I just don't much care for their fit and handling.
#56
Senior Member
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I guess you are right, Randy.
This'll be out in the trash if you want it.
This'll be out in the trash if you want it.
#57
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Bikes: 1978 Motobecane Grand Jubile | 1983 Univega Gran Turismo | 1973 Raleigh Competition
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#58
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
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I've seen some Peugeots and Gitanes as bad as any Raleigh, but when you're bench marking against Peugeot, you're missing the point. The comments about Motobecane are very in line with my experiences btw...they were producing notably nicer bikes than many others.
#59
Abuse Magnet
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The bottom bracket on my wife's '72 Raleigh Twenty has its threads tapped backwards...the adjustable cup is on the drive side, which was really messing up the crank clearance. I have it sorted out for now, but it remains to be seen what difficulties will surface down the line.
#60
aka Tom Reingold
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Workmanship was worse than most of the big brands in the 70s. But the designs were proven. My first truly nice bike was a 1975 Raleigh Gran Sport, purchased in 1976. I shouldn't have sold it. I replaced it with a 1979 PX-10, which I loved, but it's a different kind of bike. Now I'm back into the 70s Raleighs, and I have quite a few:
1962 Rudge Sports (made in Nottingham with a Rudge fork)
1971 Super Course
1971 Professional Track
1973 Twenty
1974 International
The Sports is a Sports, and you either like them or you don't.
I don't like the Twenty, and I'll eventually finish renovating and moving it on.
The Super Course was quite a surprise. It rides better than you would expect. I've taken it on spirited day rides, commuted on it, hauled with it, and toured on it. It's ugly, but it's a champ.
The International is everything I had hoped it to be and more. It's a work in progress.
The Professional Track feels very at home on the velodrome surface. I built it after using a modern Leader frame, and the Raleigh feels like the designers really knew what they were doing.
Maybe Aaron's International was a lemon. Or maybe his style and taste are different enough that it's the wrong bike for him and the right one for me. I adore mine.
Peter Weigle is a highly sought-after frame builder. Most people can't afford his frames which also have a several-year waiting period. But he also modifies old Raleigh frames, probably for a lot less than one of his from-the-ground-up frames. Why does he modify Raleighs? I can only guess it's because they're worth investing in. Maybe he fixes up the flaws or he only uses the lucky good specimens.
This is why, despite the flaws, Raleigh bikes made in Nottingham and Worksop (and the Netherlands and Canada) were some darned good bikes.
I worked in bike shops from 1978 through 1984. As a mechanic, I strongly preferred selling and assembling and repairing Japanese-made bikes for the reliability and workmanship. But I preferred to ride Raleighs and French-made bikes, because I just liked the way they rode better. It's a matter of taste to a large degree, and lots of people feel the same way.
1962 Rudge Sports (made in Nottingham with a Rudge fork)
1971 Super Course
1971 Professional Track
1973 Twenty
1974 International
The Sports is a Sports, and you either like them or you don't.
I don't like the Twenty, and I'll eventually finish renovating and moving it on.
The Super Course was quite a surprise. It rides better than you would expect. I've taken it on spirited day rides, commuted on it, hauled with it, and toured on it. It's ugly, but it's a champ.
The International is everything I had hoped it to be and more. It's a work in progress.
The Professional Track feels very at home on the velodrome surface. I built it after using a modern Leader frame, and the Raleigh feels like the designers really knew what they were doing.
Maybe Aaron's International was a lemon. Or maybe his style and taste are different enough that it's the wrong bike for him and the right one for me. I adore mine.
Peter Weigle is a highly sought-after frame builder. Most people can't afford his frames which also have a several-year waiting period. But he also modifies old Raleigh frames, probably for a lot less than one of his from-the-ground-up frames. Why does he modify Raleighs? I can only guess it's because they're worth investing in. Maybe he fixes up the flaws or he only uses the lucky good specimens.
This is why, despite the flaws, Raleigh bikes made in Nottingham and Worksop (and the Netherlands and Canada) were some darned good bikes.
I worked in bike shops from 1978 through 1984. As a mechanic, I strongly preferred selling and assembling and repairing Japanese-made bikes for the reliability and workmanship. But I preferred to ride Raleighs and French-made bikes, because I just liked the way they rode better. It's a matter of taste to a large degree, and lots of people feel the same way.
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Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
#61
Senior Member
Motobecanes were always a couple steps ahead of the contemporary euro brands WRT fit and finish.
Now WRT to Raleigh, I never worked at a Raleigh shop so I have limited experience, but they weren't really out of line for the standards of the time. Of course, this is partly why the Japanese companies took over the market by the 80s.
In the 70s though, japanese bikes could be unreliable tanks. For example, a Raleigh 3 speed was far and away superior to the insanely heavy Japanese equivalents of the time, and even more superior to the Huffys and other department store junk that average people rode.
#62
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The comments about Motobecane are very in line with my experiences btw...they were producing notably nicer bikes than many others.
Please keep in mind that I have intentionally compared close to a hundred vintage road bicycles for ride quality, user friendliness and build workmanship. After doing this, in pretty serious depth, I stand by my criticism of the Raleigh brand.
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#63
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I am right there with you on that. I really want a Grand Record. One popped up in the local co-op (same place I got my GJ) a while ago. Everyone stopped what they were doing at some point to admire it.
#65
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And the connection with Raleigh and Reynolds has to account for some credence.
531 was the tubing of choice for many racing bikes for many years.
531 was the tubing of choice for many racing bikes for many years.
#66
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#67
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OT but what tubing did Raleigh use in it's gas pipe frames?
#68
~>~
Oddly enough due to laws prohibiting cycling road racing the UK, where gents/ladies on their ancestral estates didn't want their rural roads cluttered w/ plebian cyclists from the cities, the domestic racing scene revolved around Time Trials of various flavors vs. continental open road racing. The machines evolved reflected the requirements of the era.
Versatile enough to fit mudguards for the British weather, able to carry a light weekend load in a seatbag for club rides, light, lively and designed to fit "sprint" wheels for TTs a great British bike was an all-rounder capable of high speeds on the less than glass smooth roads of the era from 1900-late '70's.
Sounds good? Order a custom hand built Mercian today: Quality & Heritage in your color of choice.
-Bandera
#69
Banned.
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I was with my buddy on my Moser at a bike stop and he was on his Mercian. I guy came over and started talking to me about my bike, but when saw my buddy's Merc, I was suddenly a leper.
#70
~>~
Fortunately nothing has changed at Mercian as far as I can tell, that's a Good Thing.
Now, back to old Raleigh bashing/worship/indifference.
-Bandera
#71
Banned.
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it's still not worship - we know what they are - Giovanni Pelizzoli didn't smoke a rope and hand-make them.
But coming out of a giant Midlands mill, they're a pretty good effort, and I said before, they're here to stay.
It's an old friend, and nostalgia for everybody.
Sheldon didn't RetroRaleigh for no reason, even if he liked Varsity.
The marque will be revered forever, long after the better bikes that paid them homage are forgotten
But coming out of a giant Midlands mill, they're a pretty good effort, and I said before, they're here to stay.
It's an old friend, and nostalgia for everybody.
Sheldon didn't RetroRaleigh for no reason, even if he liked Varsity.
The marque will be revered forever, long after the better bikes that paid them homage are forgotten
Last edited by bulldog1935; 08-16-16 at 05:58 PM.
#72
Disco Infiltrator
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Perhaps 1970's Raleighs avoid being despised outright, by virtue of containing no Lucas Electrics
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#73
Senior Member
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I picked up a 1973 (guess) Raleigh Carlton Competition frame. Sweet old-school 531 ride but I never fully trusted it. (The stop for the DT shifter clamp wasn't fully brazed.) I had several other details I wanted changed also so I took it to my framebuilder asking that it be stripped, then appraised. His appraisal? Almost all the lugwork needed braze flowed in; that some were little more than tacked. "The paint was holding the bike together." There was cracking in several tubes, almost certainly due to the lack of support from the lugs. He spent 4 hours brazing the lugs for their first time.
There was one plus. No heat distortion. That 40 yo frame was spot on true.
Ben
There was one plus. No heat distortion. That 40 yo frame was spot on true.
Ben
#74
On the road
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I'm usually not a negative person, and I hate to rain on others' parade, but why are old Raleighs so revered?
I worked in a Raleigh store in 1974, and the quality of the bikes was abysmal! Remember, that was a dark era for England with the brown-outs and multiple strikes. Almost every Raleigh we assembled had some sort of issue. The common ones were having to shim the seat post to get it tight or having to add a spacer behind the freewheel because of frame misalignment. So today, even though I love looking at old Raleighs, my past experience with them colors my opinion of them. Has anyone else noticed many flaws with mid 70s Raleighs?
I worked in a Raleigh store in 1974, and the quality of the bikes was abysmal! Remember, that was a dark era for England with the brown-outs and multiple strikes. Almost every Raleigh we assembled had some sort of issue. The common ones were having to shim the seat post to get it tight or having to add a spacer behind the freewheel because of frame misalignment. So today, even though I love looking at old Raleighs, my past experience with them colors my opinion of them. Has anyone else noticed many flaws with mid 70s Raleighs?
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Classic American and British Roadsters, Utility Bikes, and Sporting Bikes (1935-1979):
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Classic American and British Roadsters, Utility Bikes, and Sporting Bikes (1935-1979):
https://bikeshedva.blogspot.com/