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Rattle Can 101

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Rattle Can 101

Old 10-23-16, 08:11 PM
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Rattle Can 101

I would prefer to keep my C&V Bicycles as original as possible. But sometimes this just doesn't work. And "Professional" paint jobs are beyond my pay scale.

So what is your process for a great rattle can job? One that will pass a 1 Meter visual test. Types of Paint? Drying Times? Colour matching? Clear coats you have had good luck with. Installing Decals, do you clear coat them or not?
It would be great if you could post pics and and an explanation on how you achieved your not so "professional" paint jobs. Thanks
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Old 10-23-16, 08:12 PM
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Just wanted to add that if you do the prep work properly, rattle can jobs can look pretty darn good. Im sure there will soon be some excellet pics posted by others.
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Old 10-23-16, 08:22 PM
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I agree prep work is 90% of a good rattle can job. It's the other 10% that's so very frustrating.
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Old 10-23-16, 08:37 PM
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Here's my foray into painting a bike. First time painting since my teen years. lol
It's an '89 Specialized Hardrock which I salvaged. I was just experimenting so nothing too hardcore. Just a sanding to remove the surface rust. Then about 2 coats of primer. Then two to three coats of the main colors. Then two coats of clear. Now waiting to gathe more parts to finish this bike.
If I was really into the bike then I'd sand it after primer and sand it again before clear.




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Old 10-23-16, 08:43 PM
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That looks really nice. But I was looking for specifics. EG types of Paint drying Times etc.
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Old 10-23-16, 09:12 PM
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Krylon Fusion. Some of the Duplicolor auto spray paints work decent. Frankly, aside from a little touch up or maybe a detail stripe or something, I would not waste my time with rattle can.

There are some "epoxy" appliance paints that actually dry, given about a month, to a fairly durable finish. I painted an antique telescope tube with the appliance white and it is as hard as nails (well, not really since a nail is about 4.5 on Mohs Scale). Unfortunately the appliance paints are limited in color choices severely.



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Old 10-23-16, 09:20 PM
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https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...n-success.html

This is a good read.
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Old 10-23-16, 09:52 PM
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Yes, good info.

If it has paint, sand it and let it be the primer.
I've stripped frames to steel with a wire wheel then etch primed and painted.
Smooth application in a dust free environment.
Lots of luck.

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Old 10-23-16, 10:48 PM
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the tricks to getting a good ratle spray-can paint finish are #1 Preperation and #2 taking your time = make haste slowly.

I strip my frame to bare metal. I use Circa 1851 gel paint stripper and then I use a wire brush or wire wheel to get any other paint residue off.

Next I give the entire frame a good scrubbing with a solution of TSP. That is followed by thorough rinsing with very hot water.

At this point the frame is touched as little as possible and DEFINITELY NOT WITH BARE HANDS.

I prime the frame with a good spray on paint primer. I've use Tremclad and I've used Krylon. I find the Krylon to be quite durable.

I have to spray paint outside so I wait for a day when there's no wind or I erect a wind screen.

I make surethe spray is started BEFORE the paint can is aimed at the bike frame and then I move the can towards to frame and use long sweeping motions to apply the pain. I don't try to get one coat coverage as that often leads to runs. many light coats are better.

You need to read the instructions on the can of the spray paint you are using to know the best distance to spray from and the drying and the curing times. Krylon paint has a very fast dry to the touch time often only ten minutes or so and multiple coats can be applied close together. Other paints have longer times and coats MUST be applied withing one hour of each other or after three days.

Using Krylon paints I was able to paint this MIELE TINFINITY FRAME IN ONE DAY EVEN THOUGH I USED THREE DIFFERENT COLOURS> When the white was dry to the touch I LOOSELY WRAPPED THE SECTIONS I wanted to stay white in newspaper and left the ends of the wrap loose so that overspray from the next colour would go under it and give the blended effect.

If doing a multi-colour paint scheme start with the lightest colour and work towards the darker colours with subsequent coats.

After the paint has cure about one week I'll apply the decals and then spray on a coat or two of protective clear coat and let that cure for another week. then I'll put the components back on and go enjoy the looking like new bicycle.

This MIELE was painted back in 2001 and is still looking good after lots of use.

Miele Road Racing Bicycle = 27 Gears Drivetrain Side by Miele Man, on Flickr

Cheers
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Old 10-23-16, 11:09 PM
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With the right formula and atomizer out of a can, pretty good results. Fun to do and easy. Big fan of the Rustoleum 2X. Really pleased in its durability. Done for one of the girls, here's a before and after link with painting process. My own graphics without seeking correctness. All for fun and one to get the kids acclimated to vintage lightweights. Already been down once and hardly a scratch!

In brief: Removed all old decals, focus on surface corrosion areas. If it has a good substrate, I leave it on and only sand to a 220 grit for the paint to adhere. Sand out and level the chipped areas. No primer needed. Only 2 coats with this stuff! Sand with 320 after first coat. Let it sit for a few months. Then decals, detail work - top clearcoat.

before
https://www.bikeforums.net/17687865-post1921.html

after
https://www.bikeforums.net/17687886-post1922.html

refinishing
https://www.bikeforums.net/17689978-post1925.html

[IMG]IMG_0430sma by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]1978 motobecane ocana tribute b by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]1978 motobecane ocana tribute a by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]
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Old 10-24-16, 11:02 AM
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The big difference between rattle can and professional is durability. Rattle can be just as beautiful, but will never be as durable.

Unless a frame is really special in details, IMHO you are better off with powder coat, and cost wise it will not be a lot more than a GOOD rattle can job. (respirator mask, stripper, stripng supplies, acid etc primer, sandable primer, color coat, clear coat, cleaners, tack rags, sand paper, etc really add up)

First and foremost, you need to have a respirator mask.

My experience is limited to 2 frames, one rattle can and one using automotive paints in a preval sprayer.

Strip the frame to bare metal, any little bits of paint left will show in the final paint job so do a really good job

Fine sand

clean frame

First prime with acid-etch primer to provide a solid base

Second prime with sandable primer, sand smooth

Multiple thin color coats (2-3), following recoat times/instructions can avoid a lot of sanding

Multiple thin clear coats, following recoat times/instructions.

if rattlecan, set the frame aside for a while to cure.
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Old 10-24-16, 11:17 AM
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I've done 3 frames and each was successively better. All were stripped to bare steel and painted up. I won't repeat the advice mentioned earlier in this thread as it's all pretty good. What I will add is that sunlight and heat help with the strength of most can-based spray-paints.

The last frame I did, before I started I left the frame and paint in the sun for about hour so they were around 90-100 degrees f. This seemed to really allow the paint to smooth out when applied. After my final clear coat I left the frame in the sun during daylight hours and stored in outside in a shed at night for about 2 weeks. Clear coat came out nice and hard but tended to chip under hard impacts. Oddly enough the bare paint underneath is much more durable. Overall I was happy with the experience but it was very labor intensive and surpisingly expensive to do right with 1-2 coats primer, 2-3 paint and 2 top coat.
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Old 10-24-16, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Wileyone View Post
I would prefer to keep my C&V Bicycles as original as possible. But sometimes this just doesn't work. And "Professional" paint jobs are beyond my pay scale.

So what is your process for a great rattle can job? One that will pass a 1 Meter visual test. Types of Paint? Drying Times? Colour matching? Clear coats you have had good luck with. Installing Decals, do you clear coat them or not?
It would be great if you could post pics and and an explanation on how you achieved your not so "professional" paint jobs. Thanks
Patience is the key ingredient, much more important than the brand of paint. I always strip my frames to bare metal, that gives you a chance to check the workmanship and do a little filing and tidying up if needed. Next comes complete washing and degreasing. I use a citric degreaser around the bearings and BB shell and dish detergent for the rest. The last step before undercoating is a complete wash with TSP, after this step your bare skin shouldn't touch the frame again till the painting is complete. (Should mention here that I've started spraying some kind of rust preventor inside whichever tubes are accessible).
I use Rustoleum 2x undercoat, grey for darker frames , white for light frames. I only paint outdoors now on calm days and generally wire the frame through the BB shell to some kind of hanger. Keep the spraycan moving and apply at least two fairly heavy coats with at least 24 hours drying time between. If you get any bad runs you can often smooth them out while the paint is dry to the touch but still soft. I've given up sanding between coats and instead use blue disposable shop towels, they're lint free and rough enough to smooth the surface nicely.
Depending on the heat and humidity I might wait for a week before starting the colour coat. Mask your panels if necessary, a nice advantage of panels is it gives you someplace to hang onto the frame. Again I use Rustoleum paint, either painters touch or their Outdoor Metallic which has proven to be very durable, both work ok with the 2x primers. I'll probably do three coats of colour with 24 hours between coats and a good rub down before each new coat. Now you just have to let the paint harden up some, I might bake the fork in the oven but the frame just has to sit in the sun on hot days, usually for a week at least before applying decals. If you use water to position the decals you'll need to wait a few days to make sure any water under the decals has evaporated. Again I use Rustoleum clear coat, I've found the gloss is too glossy, I prefer satin with a coat of wax over to give that final shine. Seems like a long involved process but it does give very good results.


dawespaint_1.jpg

IMG_2688_2_1.jpg

IMG_2682_2_1.jpg

IMG_3102_1.jpg
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Old 10-24-16, 11:55 AM
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Nice work here. I will just add that I used Dupli Color from the local auto store to paint over very tired and pitting chrome on my Merckx fork and chain stays. I used krylon primer. The result was pretty nice IMO. I did a lot of sanding to prep it. I have an old steel fork that is my test bed for color matching and spray practice. I didn't do the whole frame but used the spray for spots of touch up as well. I masked off the decals with blue masking tape (3M I think) which worked fine for most of them but pulled off the edges of the Reynolds and the "Century" sticker on the top tube.
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Old 10-24-16, 11:59 AM
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I've used the Spraymax 2K urethane over a Duplicolor basecoat with really good results. Drying time is dependent upon your ambient temp.

The 2K urethane stuff will make a turd shine like a new penny.
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Old 10-24-16, 01:16 PM
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I've done one rattle-can job, and it's a process I wouldn't care to repeat. (But I have been told that I am prone to a lack of patience.) Not what was asked for in the OP, but I have actually had really good result with the Rustoleum oil-based brush-on paint. I invested in a good 1 inch paint brush, stripped and cleaned the frame as has already been described above, and left it to cure. Sorry, no pics at the moment, but it was a much pleasanter experience than the spray can. YMMV.
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Old 10-24-16, 01:16 PM
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I try pretty hard to avoid repainting bike frames, but for automotive hardware/wheels and the like I have good luck with VHT automotive engine paints. Goes on smooth, recoats quickly, and is quite durable after a week or two of cure time. The only problem I've run into is in hot weather it dries quickly enough that pieces which take some time to paint end up with overspray orange peel on the areas you started with. I haven't yet tried using it at ~60 degrees (or played with hot-can, cold-workpiece, etc.) to see if that slows the dry time enough to avoid that problem, but if you plan ahead and paint quickly it's not much of a problem to begin with. It also sands and polishes decently after curing, so it's not that hard to do a good job either way.
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Old 10-24-16, 01:53 PM
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The most frustrating and challenge with rattle cans are finding ones with a decent spray head. Also with the hope of a formula that stays consistent as its released. No sputtering, etc.

Spraying tubes is far different than flat surfaces. Consider issues with flash and formulas setup time lapse.

Another is having a rattle can that can spray near inverted. You want that. Also, use a spray handle attachment which allows a natural use of the arm / hand control.

Back to the Rustoleum 2X products. I retract my statement as the clear is problematic spraying on compound angles and tubes. Likes to run.
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Old 10-24-16, 02:18 PM
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There is no good rattle can paint job. It can be very pretty at first but the paint will be soft and will likely craze in a year or two. If you want to do it right, get a cataylized paint, like Imron, use a Preval sprayer and you will get a very pretty, long lasting paint job.

Or just powdercoat it for $100.
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Old 10-24-16, 02:48 PM
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^ Lots of variables in rattle budget jobbies and I have difference in opinion. And not all powdercoats are good plus debatable in doing a classic frame.

The rattle can job I posted above was only $12 in material. The extra saved paid for a pair of used tubular rims hooped around Campy hubs PLUS a new pair of Conti Giro's. Kids have been riding the bike, some marginal mishaps and the paint has been incredibly durable. That particular one sat over winter before any assembly began. There's been absolutely no softening nor shrinkage (crazing). Do you even know whats in Rustoleum products?

BTW: I do have an arsenal of pro HVLP spray equipment, access to booth large volume compressor and elaborate filtering. Most don't have that luxury. Also consider the many here and depending on where they reside, can't even acquire some formulas or like Imron. I don't spray as a profession but have done lots thru the years. Automotive to fine cabinetry.

Consider the investment one would have to make just to occasionally paint something or a bike or two. Not worth it.

This topic is specifically about spraying out of a can.
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Old 10-24-16, 03:02 PM
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I've painted a couple I was pretty proud of. Probably most important is to be patient. Apply the paint in very thin coats. Good luck! Also, some advice from a non-expert on the subject, is to stick to one brand of primer and paints and sealers, like acrylic. I think I just stuck to Krylon. I believe you have a better chance of them "playing nicely with each other."
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Old 10-24-16, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by San Rensho View Post
There is no good rattle can paint job. It can be very pretty at first but the paint will be soft and will likely craze in a year or two. If you want to do it right, get a cataylized paint, like Imron, use a Preval sprayer and you will get a very pretty, long lasting paint job.

Or just powdercoat it for $100.
Not true. I've done many rattle-can paint jobs on bicycles including three-colour schemes and the paint has lasted many years with lots of use of the bike. The MIELE I posted an image of upthread was done in 2001 and still looks good and none of my paint jobs has crazed.

Cheers
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Old 10-24-16, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by crank_addict View Post
^ Lots of variables in rattle budget jobbies and I have difference in opinion. And not all powdercoats are good plus debatable in doing a classic frame.

The rattle can job I posted above was only $12 in material. The extra saved paid for a pair of used tubular rims hooped around Campy hubs PLUS a new pair of Conti Giro's. Kids have been riding the bike, some marginal mishaps and the paint has been incredibly durable. That particular one sat over winter before any assembly began. There's been absolutely no softening nor shrinkage (crazing). Do you even know whats in Rustoleum products?

BTW: I do have an arsenal of pro HVLP spray equipment, access to booth large volume compressor and elaborate filtering. Most don't have that luxury. Also consider the many here and depending on where they reside, can't even acquire some formulas or like Imron. I don't spray as a profession but have done lots thru the years. Automotive to fine cabinetry.

Consider the investment one would have to make just to occasionally paint something or a bike or two. Not worth it.

This topic is specifically about spraying out of a can.
I agree with this. There's some great proof that rattle can jobs can look good in this very thread and on the net. I havent specifically painted a frame, but I've done an electric guitar with very good results, and many other items. If you do the prop work (sanding, etc) you can achieve a nice finish. I dont need to currently paint a frame, but I plan to in the future.

Personally I don't care for powder-coating at all. It's only upsides are it's relatively cheap and long lasting. But it looks awful too me. I'd definitely rattle-can before powder coating a frame.
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Old 10-24-16, 05:19 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by tyler_fred View Post
I've used the Spraymax 2K urethane over a Duplicolor basecoat with really good results. Drying time is dependent upon your ambient temp.

The 2K urethane stuff will make a turd shine like a new penny.
Yeah, that's probably the most pro you can get with a home finish. Just be sure to wear a respirator religiously with the 2K urethane clear stuff. Duplicolor is acrylic lacquer, IIRC. I suspect many C&V era metallic bike frames used similar material.

Anyhow, as other have been saying, it's not the tool so much as the technique and the material. A spray can is just a can, it can hold anything. You can get good results with them if you are patient, though I wouldn't count on it looking good "off the gun", which seems to be what finishing newbies expect.
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Old 10-24-16, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Miele Man View Post
the tricks to getting a good ratle spray-can paint finish are #1 Preperation and #2 taking your time = make haste slowly.

This MIELE was painted back in 2001 and is still looking good after lots of use.

Miele Road Racing Bicycle = 27 Gears Drivetrain Side by Miele Man, on Flickr

Cheers

Wow, that looks great.
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