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English Falcon frame and fork new addition to the cave

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English Falcon frame and fork new addition to the cave

Old 08-25-17, 11:15 PM
  #1  
1simplexnut
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English Falcon frame and fork new addition to the cave

I dont normally go for English bikes . More drawn to french and Italian steeds .
Anyway i saw this Falcon and thought it was unusual enough to be rescued .

Model is a super route . It has a couple of quirky things going on .
One is a decent sized pin/peg on the underside of the down tube to locate the shifters .
I also thought the rear drop outs were unusual looking too .

Has the remains of a 531 fork decal on the seat tube ?
No other tube material decals .
I presume it is straight guage 531 based on the little info that is on the glorious internet .

Has wrap around seat stays that remind me of a Carlton I had way back in the dim dark past .

Anyway thought I would share it with the C&V community :-)

Not sure of the build yet ?
Progress to follow .
Any opinions,suggestions happily accepted
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Old 08-26-17, 06:12 AM
  #2  
Charles Wahl
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Seat post hole dimension and removing the BB and weighing it will tell you more about tubeset. In that size, anything under 2300 g is almost certainly double-butted. If the tubing is seamed (like an old falcon I have, older than yours, but with the same wrap-around seat stay detail) then a bright flashlight down the seat tube should reveal that.

Rear dropouts look like these (Mavic):
VeloBase.com - View Single Frame Part
That would be a bit of French anyway.

You need a fork to continue . . .
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Old 08-26-17, 06:38 AM
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Those are Milremo dropouts. Mavic used them somewhat later.
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Old 08-26-17, 07:07 AM
  #4  
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Interesting that a 531 fork blade decal is applied to the seat tube. I suspect it's not original. That said, it's still likely that the frame itself is still Reynolds 531, and the forged Milremo dropouts suggest a higher end model that may be fully 531.
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Old 08-26-17, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Charles Wahl View Post
Rear dropouts look like these (Mavic):
VeloBase.com - View Single Frame Part
That would be a bit of French anyway.
Originally Posted by 63rickert View Post
Those are Milremo dropouts. Mavic used them somewhat later.
The dropouts are Milremo, which was the house brand of Ron Kitching and Andre Bertin. As such, they were fairly common on British and French frames.

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Old 08-26-17, 07:16 AM
  #6  
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To quote Charlie Harding, who owned and operated C. Harding's For Bikes near UCLA throughout the 1960s and 1970s, "A Falcon is a good English bike."

That is one tall frame! Please post the seatpost diameter -- if it is 27.2mm, then you have a butted Reynolds 531 frame. If it is 26.4mm, you have a plain gauge 531 frame -- not a bad thing at all, particularly for loaded touring or visiting the grocery store or carrying a rack-load of textbooks to university (been there ... done that).
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Old 08-26-17, 07:28 AM
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Love those wrap around seat stays, and that Falcon decal is rad. Pretty bike.
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Old 08-26-17, 07:33 AM
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I applaud your decision to save this frame!
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Old 08-26-17, 08:43 AM
  #9  
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Due to the lack of braze-ons, I'd guess its a 70's model. Looks like a repaint? Decals / head badge likely newer.

If you check out the link below, you'll find photos of my Falcon.
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Old 08-26-17, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Charles Wahl View Post
Seat post hole dimension and removing the BB and weighing it will tell you more about tubeset. In that size, anything under 2300 g is almost certainly double-butted. If the tubing is seamed (like an old falcon I have, older than yours, but with the same wrap-around seat stay detail) then a bright flashlight down the seat tube should reveal that.

Rear dropouts look like these (Mavic):
VeloBase.com - View Single Frame Part
That would be a bit of French anyway.

You need a fork to continue . . .
hiya There is a fork that came with it . Presume it is original ?
Will weight it and report back .
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Old 08-26-17, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by vtchuck View Post
Due to the lack of braze-ons, I'd guess its a 70's model. Looks like a repaint? Decals / head badge likely newer.

If you check out the link below, you'll find photos of my Falcon.
Nice Falcon !


Hi pretty sure it is original . Looks better in the pictures than it does in person.
Quite a few snail trails under the paint .
If it is a repaint it was very early in its life as it certainly has some (ahem) patina now
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Old 08-26-17, 07:11 PM
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Fork looks legitimate.
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Old 08-26-17, 09:43 PM
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Nice Falcon!
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Old 08-27-17, 01:19 AM
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Originally Posted by John E View Post
To quote Charlie Harding, who owned and operated C. Harding's For Bikes near UCLA throughout the 1960s and 1970s, "A Falcon is a good English bike."

That is one tall frame! Please post the seatpost diameter -- if it is 27.2mm, then you have a butted Reynolds 531 frame. If it is 26.4mm, you have a plain gauge 531 frame -- not a bad thing at all, particularly for loaded touring or visiting the grocery store or carrying a rack-load of textbooks to university (been there ... done that).
Hiya yes is a decent size at 60cm c to c .
Have a 27mm post which just goes in . pretty tight though ?
26.4 post is too loose and wont clamp on post .
Does this mean it is butted ?
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Old 08-27-17, 01:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Charles Wahl View Post
Seat post hole dimension and removing the BB and weighing it will tell you more about tubeset. In that size, anything under 2300 g is almost certainly double-butted. If the tubing is seamed (like an old falcon I have, older than yours, but with the same wrap-around seat stay detail) then a bright flashlight down the seat tube should reveal that.

Rear dropouts look like these (Mavic):
VeloBase.com - View Single Frame Part
That would be a bit of French anyway.

You need a fork to continue . . .
Hi struggling to get the BB out . weighed frame and fork with BB and head set cups 2.9kg
Doesnt seem too bad .
Had a look down seat tube but is pretty grotty and not much to be seen .
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Old 08-27-17, 07:07 AM
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2.9kg with fork and BB and head cups is a reasonably light frameset. With long steerer the fork would have to be 700 grammes or better. If that 27.0 goes all the way in it is not too tight. So yes, double butted. That is original paint in good condition. To give you some idea about dating my local builder Ron Boi travelled to Ron Kitching in I believe '72 or '73 and bought a bin of Milremo ends, rears only. He still has some of them. Priced at get them out of here. End of the line. Could check date easily enough. They are very good very tough fork ends. The Shimano fork ends noted in the old brochure above would be a very big downgrade, they broke all the time.

The other part of dating is Falcon went downhill steadily and quickly through the 70s. By mid 70s they were not much. Yours is a nice frame. I owned a '67 and a '70. '67 was a brilliant handbuilt, '70 was OK. This example is probably '69-'71.
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Old 08-28-17, 07:54 AM
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I agree that it is a Reynolds 531 butted main triangle, based on the post size. However, I'm not convinced that it is late 1960s. Unless the head sticker is hiding some rivet holes, I'm inclined to think that it is a post boom model. I recall all the Falcon having riveted head badges through the early 1970s boom. Certainly, the decals are the post boom style and even the colour is the post boom Falcon team blue, though it may be a repaint with newer decals.
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Old 08-28-17, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
I agree that it is a Reynolds 531 butted main triangle, based on the post size. However, I'm not convinced that it is late 1960s. Unless the head sticker is hiding some rivet holes, I'm inclined to think that it is a post boom model. I recall all the Falcon having riveted head badges through the early 1970s boom. Certainly, the decals are the post boom style and even the colour is the post boom Falcon team blue, though it may be a repaint with newer decals.
FWIW, mine is a 73, with a riveted head badge, DB 531 and a 27.0 seat post. Decals of that era were not metallic, but rather red lettering on a white background.
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Old 10-01-17, 09:10 PM
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Falcon flies again !

Falcon flies again !
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Old 10-04-17, 05:35 PM
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-----

WOW 1simplexnut!

You certainly seem to have the magic touch in finding fascinating cycles. Have been following with great interest the Carlton thread. And then there is the most wonderful Anquetil. No shortage of great vintage pieces at your works.

I also suspect a possible respray. Note the yellow(ish) colour on the steerer. Yellow was a common Falcon colour. Have an early seventies example hanging in me racks. Possible colour may be the result of grease staining white paint however.

Like others, I find the combination of this model Andy Bertin ends and the complete absence of braze-ons puzzling.

FWIW the crown is an Agrati pattern from the "ROMA" lugset. It is item nr. 005.8028. Falcon has employed some Agrati bits on other models.

Great job with the build; she is looking quite fine.

-----
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Old 10-05-17, 10:37 AM
  #21  
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I agree with T-Mar that it's a late 70's Falcon with original paint and decals. Not many bikes get repainted within 8 years of purchase and when they do it was not easy to replace every single decal unless you lived next door to the factory.
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