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Campagnolo Super Record Pedals

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Campagnolo Super Record Pedals

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Old 10-18-17, 11:51 AM
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Campagnolo Super Record Pedals

Can someone confirm that the Super Record Pedal always has a titanium spindle , as far as i know the Super Record is pretty much a Superleggari with a titanium spindle and maybe a slightly different cage .
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Old 10-18-17, 11:57 AM
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Same cage, but yes: a titanium spindle. Also smaller bearings.
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Old 10-18-17, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by jeirvine View Post
Same cage, but yes: a titanium spindle.
Exactly so.

Also smaller bearings.
Which means different cones and cups as well, so you can't simply swap Super Record and Superleggero spindles.
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Old 10-18-17, 01:13 PM
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Is the smaller bearing spec necessary because they needed to increase the spindle cross section for added strength?
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Old 10-18-17, 03:06 PM
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I was told that the Super Record were with Titanium spindles. I was given a set of Superleggero pedals for help in assembling a 1973 Schwinn Paramount and the owner didn't want the pedals so he gave them to me. I didn't realize until I mounted them on one of my classics that they were actually Super Record as they were so much lighter than the pedals I removed. I tried the ole magnet trick and viola .... titanium spindles . I love them and I don't think my legs are strong enough to snap them as is claimed about these pedals. Ride On Joe
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Old 10-18-17, 03:11 PM
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the alloys of Titanium used in stuff has improved since then.
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Old 10-18-17, 03:19 PM
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Yes, the ti spindle is what puts the super in Super Record.
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Old 10-18-17, 08:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Chombi1 View Post
Is the smaller bearing spec necessary because they needed to increase the spindle cross section for added strength?
No, unfortunately if Campagnolo had modified the profile a bit they would have been terrific pedals.
The inboard steel bearing cone is pressed on to the shaft, the added dimension drove the need to go with a smaller ball bearing size to use the same body. They could have used the same parts as the other pedals outboard...

In my opinion if they had done away with the reduced diameter between the pedal body and the wrench flats the pedal would have been a winner. An almost direct material substitution was not the way to do it. Ti does not have the same stiffness of steel for the same cross-section. This foretold the problem Campagnolo would find themselves in a decade later, poor engineering design choices.
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Old 10-19-17, 12:03 AM
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The super record pedals do NOT break any more than other similar vintage pedals. The titanium spindles of the pedals do not suffer from brittleness. Campagnolo was so sure of the durability of these pedals that they even used them in their 50th anniversary gruppo. I posit that the sole reason why you do not see them more frequently is that they were exceedingly expensive, they cost about 75 % more than a set of superleggeri pedals and more than 130 % more expensive than the steel caged version.
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Old 10-19-17, 01:59 AM
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The broken spindles in ti I would attribute to the stuffing of the pedals in a corner, so operator error. One snapped near the outboard threading, the other I did not see.
We did have a few guys who developed knee pain after they purchased them, ( why do the heavier guys have all the money?) We placed them back on pedals with steel and the problems went away.
Maybe just mashers who lived up in the hills too?

I have one pair I bought along with the attached bike a while ago, I do have to agree that they flex more, just don't make me feel secure. But I have a section of 12% grade to ascend if I take the short way home, I will blame that along with a desire to avoid long cage derailleurs.
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Old 10-19-17, 02:02 AM
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Briefly apropos Titanium...remember*the late, great Laurent Fignon's crash on the 1982 edition of Paris-Tours when he broke his Titanium BB axle.

I believe it was a Campagnolo component.

John.

*rhetorical question, I know you don't remember !
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Old 10-19-17, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by hobbs1951 View Post
Briefly apropos Titanium...remember*the late, great Laurent Fignon's crash on the 1982 edition of Paris-Tours when he broke his Titanium BB axle.

I believe it was a Campagnolo component.

John.

*rhetorical question, I know you don't remember !
Yes it was a Super Record BB. That story always get trotted, LOL, when people talk about that part.
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Old 10-19-17, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Chombi1 View Post
Is the smaller bearing spec necessary because they needed to increase the spindle cross section for added strength?
More because of the need for a pressed-on steel race increasing the diameter of the bearing track and still having to fit into the same pedal body as Superleggero.

I would have liked to see Campagnolo use a titanium pedal cage like Zeus 2000, as this would resist wear better, particularly with the metal cleats that were common at the time.
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Old 12-06-18, 05:18 PM
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Resurrecting this thread - so the "regular" Record pedals use 5/32 balls - 12 per bearing for a total of 48. (or so i read somewhere, please confirm?)

But what size balls and how many for the titanium spindles? - I repacked mine (track version) with the used balls. There were 15 per bearing, total 60. Is this correct? What size should I buy, if I want to replace?

Thanks in advance!
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Old 12-06-18, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Chombi1 View Post
Is the smaller bearing spec necessary because they needed to increase the spindle cross section for added strength?
Curious indeed.
The shafts had a steel cone race pressed on, so, by not decreasing the shaft diameter, the "inboard" bearing diameter got reduced.
I have yet to service mine to determine if there is any difference at the other end.
Now, the curious part from my perspective from way back and why I did not buy them some 44 years ago...
The part of the shaft that is exposed between the wrench flats and the body, should not have been kept of the same reduced profile as machined with the steel shafts.
Titanium is more flexible for a given rod cross section than steel... would have been much better just to keep the diameter constant...
Campagnolo went for Styling instead of function. Unforced error. The Super Record pedals had a rep for being knee troublemakers.

I had high hopes that the Super Record headset would be more durable than the all steel unit as I thought the smaller bearing parts would be easier to heat treat...
Nope, they went for a very thin crown race, easy to split, and not as service durable...
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Old 12-06-18, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
More because of the need for a pressed-on steel race increasing the diameter of the bearing track and still having to fit into the same pedal body as Superleggero.

I would have liked to see Campagnolo use a titanium pedal cage like Zeus 2000, as this would resist wear better, particularly with the metal cleats that were common at the time.
One could hope! Campagnolo thought they had solved problems when they beefed up the cage from the original design.
That is why we went to nylon cleats. There was a French company that made them, steel reinforced, I recall A.E.R.O. molded in place.
Nice and deep too compared to any of the TA offerings... then there was Berelli, cool as they had the aft side of the cleat deeper to assist guiding your foot into place, but stainless and aluminum construction.
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Old 12-06-18, 08:19 PM
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Love all the historical facts, but ..
ball size and amount?

thanks!
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Old 12-06-18, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by flx100 View Post
Resurrecting this thread - so the "regular" Record pedals use 5/32 balls - 12 per bearing for a total of 48. (or so i read somewhere, please confirm?)

But what size balls and how many for the titanium spindles? - I repacked mine (track version) with the used balls. There were 15 per bearing, total 60. Is this correct? What size should I buy, if I want to replace?
Super Record pedals use 1/8" balls; 16 per race for a total of 64 balls.

Record and Superleggero pedals use 5/32" balls, 12 per race, for a total of 48, just as you thought.
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Old 12-06-18, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
More because of the need for a pressed-on steel race increasing the diameter of the bearing track and still having to fit into the same pedal body as Superleggero.

I would have liked to see Campagnolo use a titanium pedal cage like Zeus 2000, as this would resist wear better, particularly with the metal cleats that were common at the time.
Yeah. I rode aluminum cleats on road pedals with chromed rattraps. Later (and to this day) Shimano 600 semi-platforms and modern versions of aluminum traditional cleats. I love the low slippage between the cleats and pedals as well as teh fact that chromed steel cages go forever with aluminum cleats. I never used plastic cleats with aluminum cages. For a decade I used those plastic things on chromed pedals and hated them. On my fix gears, I was limited to hill grades by my toestraps; either their strength and stretch or my willingness to suffer injury from tightening them that much. Many times hills got too steep, those plastic cleats slipped and I had to walk the rest of the way. With just decent straps and aluminum cleats, my legs are the limiting factor. (Back when we had bigger logos, my picture was of me climbing a 2 mile hill maxing at 14.5% on a 42-17. That would have been a nightmare on plastic cleats.

Now, if I were a pro BITD, I woujld have loved those light pedals, used aluminum cleats and just had my mechanic replace the rattraps as needed.

Ben
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Old 12-07-18, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by johndthompson View Post
super record pedals use 1/8" balls; 16 per race for a total of 64 balls.

Record and superleggero pedals use 5/32" balls, 12 per race, for a total of 48, just as you thought.
thank you!
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Old 12-09-18, 09:03 AM
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I just picked up two sets of Superleggera pedals in very nice condition. After reading this, I'm never going to take a wrench to them.
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Old 12-09-18, 08:00 PM
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Perhaps these folks near Detroit can turn a batch of copy Campy Ti spindles.

http://www.titaniumspindles.com/site...t_Us.html#3007

and

http://www.titaniumspindles.com/site...ucts.html#2867
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Old 12-09-18, 09:35 PM
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Can somebody explain to me how titanium spindles can hurt the knees?
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Old 12-09-18, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Reynolds 531 View Post
Can somebody explain to me how titanium spindles can hurt the knees?
they flex under load, do not equate with modern pedal designs, they also flex but not as much.
So, what happens is that under load, the pedal bends the foot as viewed from the front, which also changes the alignment of the two lower leg bones and in turn loads the knee differently. As the load on the pedal is not constant through the crank cycle, there is unwanted movement.
A similar situation can happen with a bent pedal spindle. Way back we had a few customers who came into the shop complaining of knee pain, we looked at their pedals for major gouges on the end for major dust cap damage. Sure enough, bent pedal spindles. One guy did not believe it, so we traded that pedal for another. He came back a week later, no more knee pain. He bought a new spindle then and we installed it. It is a challenge to observe the problem, but it happens.
In the steel crank days I was told the cranks could be suspected too.

poor cleat placement can also screw up knees pretty fast. I have come up to many a rider where they pedal in such an observable uncomfortable way. The knee swinging in and out through the crank rotation. I have when possible asked such riders how their knee pain was. They all wonder how I knew! Go have your cleats readjusted or professionally set, that will surely help!

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Old 12-10-18, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
I just picked up two sets of Superleggera pedals in very nice condition. After reading this, I'm never going to take a wrench to them.
The Super Leggera (a.k.a. "SL") pedals have a steel axle, so they are quite reliable.
The flip tabs on the aluminum cages are another story, though... they break off now and then. Maybe not as much of an issue with plastic cleats, or especially when not using cleats at all??
The plastic dust caps on the SL pedals don't survive pedal strikes as well either.
Other than that... no reason to not use SL pedals.

Steve in Peoria
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