Whats the deal with aftermarket jockey wheels (pulleys)? Is it for better or..?
11-08-17, 06:26 PM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Whats the deal with aftermarket jockey wheels (pulleys)? Is it for better or..?
Looking at an item with aftermarket pulleys (rear derailleur), good idea to buy or find original? Would it be worse than non-metal pulley wheels?
11-08-17, 06:51 PM
#2
weapons-grade bolognium
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Across the street from Chicago
Posts: 6,344
Bikes: Battaglin Cromor, Ciocc Designer 84, Schwinn Superior 1981
Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 985 Post(s)
Liked 2,378 Times
in
891 Posts
I'm running a set of Carmichael pulleys in an 8sp indexed setup. Works flawlessly and quietly.
11-08-17, 08:45 PM
#3
Friendship is Magic
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 22,984
Bikes: old ones
Mentioned: 304 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26410 Post(s)
Liked 10,376 Times
in
7,204 Posts
Nothing lasts very long if you don't maintain your chain.
11-08-17, 08:52 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 833
Bikes: '68 Raleigh Suberbe, '92 (German) Centurion Equipe, '85 Schwinn Peloton, 1983ish Zunow Road Racer project, '69 Squanch Super Tourer, 1980 Bianchi Super Corsa, '82 Austro-Daimler Vent Noir, '89 Miyata 914 project, 1982ish Bianchi Rallye
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 294 Post(s)
Liked 9 Times
in
9 Posts
...the after market metal ones often have bearings instead of bushings. I don't think they work any better or worse in terms of shifting your chain (which is what they are supposed to do), but they probably last longer.
Nothing lasts very long if you don't maintain your chain.
Nothing lasts very long if you don't maintain your chain.
Is that a 30t sprocket? Can your NR RD shift to it??
11-08-17, 10:23 PM
#5
Friendship is Magic
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 22,984
Bikes: old ones
Mentioned: 304 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26410 Post(s)
Liked 10,376 Times
in
7,204 Posts
...I don't remember what setup I had when I took that photo, but I usually try to limit myself to 28 with a NR derailleur. I've heard you can get then to handle 30, but you need to experiment with the wheel positioning in the dropouts. If you look hard, I think you can see the large sprocket marked as a 28.
11-08-17, 10:52 PM
#6
Senior Member
Not sure on the limits of an NR RD, but I have an SR RD shifting a 30t sprocket. But in all fairness, the front chainrings are tightly spaced at 42/47.
__________________
My bikes: '81 Trek 957, '83 Trek 720, '85 Trek 500, '85 Trek 770,'81 Merckx, '85 Centurion Cinelli, '85 Raleigh Portage, '92 RB-2, '09 Bianchi
My bikes: '81 Trek 957, '83 Trek 720, '85 Trek 500, '85 Trek 770,
11-08-17, 11:51 PM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 833
Bikes: '68 Raleigh Suberbe, '92 (German) Centurion Equipe, '85 Schwinn Peloton, 1983ish Zunow Road Racer project, '69 Squanch Super Tourer, 1980 Bianchi Super Corsa, '82 Austro-Daimler Vent Noir, '89 Miyata 914 project, 1982ish Bianchi Rallye
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 294 Post(s)
Liked 9 Times
in
9 Posts
11-09-17, 04:06 AM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Central Virginia
Posts: 4,780
Bikes: Numerous
Mentioned: 150 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1677 Post(s)
Liked 3,091 Times
in
913 Posts
On the Campy especially, it can be cheaper to find non- Campy pulleys. I have some with Suntour pulleys. I have one Super Record with red anodized pulleys like in 3alarmers pic. I can’t say I’ve noticed a performance difference.
__________________
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '82 Colnago Super, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, '84 Basso Gap, ‘89 Cinelli Supercorsa, ‘83 Bianchi Specialissima, ‘VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, '84 Paletti Super Prestige, Heron Randonneur
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '82 Colnago Super, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, '84 Basso Gap, ‘89 Cinelli Supercorsa, ‘83 Bianchi Specialissima, ‘VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, '84 Paletti Super Prestige, Heron Randonneur
11-09-17, 04:08 AM
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Central Virginia
Posts: 4,780
Bikes: Numerous
Mentioned: 150 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1677 Post(s)
Liked 3,091 Times
in
913 Posts
There is always laps at Ocean Beach and the Marina ha ha.
__________________
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '82 Colnago Super, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, '84 Basso Gap, ‘89 Cinelli Supercorsa, ‘83 Bianchi Specialissima, ‘VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, '84 Paletti Super Prestige, Heron Randonneur
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '82 Colnago Super, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, '84 Basso Gap, ‘89 Cinelli Supercorsa, ‘83 Bianchi Specialissima, ‘VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, '84 Paletti Super Prestige, Heron Randonneur
11-09-17, 05:04 AM
#10
What??? Only 2 wheels?
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Boston-ish, MA
Posts: 13,434
Bikes: 72 Peugeot UO-8, 82 Peugeot TH8, 87 Bianchi Brava, 76? Masi Grand Criterium, 74 Motobecane Champion Team, 86 & 77 Gazelle champion mondial, 81? Grandis, 82? Tommasini, 83 Peugeot PF10
Mentioned: 189 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1222 Post(s)
Liked 645 Times
in
232 Posts
Aftermarket pulleys give you the option of trying different sizes. My Masi has a NR RD with Rally-style long cage. The guide pulley was a bit too far from the sprockets for some gear combinations, but with a larger pulley and careful fiddling with chain length and other stuff I got it to shift nicely.
With long commuting miles in all kinds of weather I have also worn out pulleys, both the teeth and the bushing hole. I would expect metal pulleys with real bearing might last longer.
With long commuting miles in all kinds of weather I have also worn out pulleys, both the teeth and the bushing hole. I would expect metal pulleys with real bearing might last longer.
__________________
Real cyclists use toe clips.
With great bikes comes great responsibility.
jimmuller
Real cyclists use toe clips.
With great bikes comes great responsibility.
jimmuller
11-09-17, 05:38 AM
#11
multimodal commuter
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NJ, NYC, LI
Posts: 19,808
Bikes: 1940s Fothergill, 1959 Allegro Special, 1963? Claud Butler Olympic Sprint, Lambert 'Clubman', 1974 Fuji "the Ace", 1976 Holdsworth 650b conversion rando bike, 1983 Trek 720 tourer, 1984 Counterpoint Opus II, 1993 Basso Gap, 2010 Downtube 8h, and...
Mentioned: 584 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1908 Post(s)
Liked 574 Times
in
339 Posts
The pulley wheels on indexed derailleurs often have some side-to-side play. Shimano ones are marked "Center-on." That side to side play is essential for proper indexing-- without it, the drive train may be noisy.
I've seen some beautifully made aftermarket pulley wheels that did not have any side-to-side play. I'm sure they would be fine on many derailleurs, but perhaps not ideal for an indexed system.
I've seen some beautifully made aftermarket pulley wheels that did not have any side-to-side play. I'm sure they would be fine on many derailleurs, but perhaps not ideal for an indexed system.
__________________
www.rhmsaddles.com.
www.rhmsaddles.com.
11-09-17, 07:02 AM
#12
Extraordinary Magnitude
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waukesha WI
Posts: 13,646
Bikes: 1978 Trek TX700; 1978/79 Trek 736; 1984 Specialized Stumpjumper Sport; 1984 Schwinn Voyageur SP; 1985 Trek 620; 1985 Trek 720; 1986 Trek 400 Elance; 1987 Schwinn High Sierra; 1990 Miyata 1000LT
Mentioned: 84 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2608 Post(s)
Liked 1,699 Times
in
935 Posts
I love the idea of the colorful aftermarket pulleys. I've got several sets of Bullseye pulleys in use.
Do I think they make a difference? Not at all. It's bling. The idea of them having bearings is good to me, but I think the physical benefit is infinitesimal.
I think the aluminum may be more harsh on chains...
As @rhm mentioned, the lack of play in the upper jockey pulley may not be best in an SIS system- I do have Bullseyes running fine on an M900 XTR running 7 speed SIS just fine. I also have them working well in 6 speed Accushift systems where the "slop" in the jockey isn't good.
The other thing is noise. I find the aluminum pulleys to be louder- if that's an issue to you.
I think they make a statement visually- that's about it.
Do I think they make a difference? Not at all. It's bling. The idea of them having bearings is good to me, but I think the physical benefit is infinitesimal.
I think the aluminum may be more harsh on chains...
As @rhm mentioned, the lack of play in the upper jockey pulley may not be best in an SIS system- I do have Bullseyes running fine on an M900 XTR running 7 speed SIS just fine. I also have them working well in 6 speed Accushift systems where the "slop" in the jockey isn't good.
The other thing is noise. I find the aluminum pulleys to be louder- if that's an issue to you.
I think they make a statement visually- that's about it.
__________________
*Recipient of the 2006 Time Magazine "Person Of The Year" Award*
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
Last edited by The Golden Boy; 11-09-17 at 07:13 AM.
11-09-17, 07:43 AM
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 23,223
Mentioned: 654 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4722 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3,036 Times
in
1,874 Posts
Bullseye was the first aftermarket pulley system that I recall. They claimed the sealed cartridge bearings used less energy than a metal journal bearing pulley. Many of the competitive cyclists during the early 1970s would replace their journal bearing Campagnolo pulleys with ball and cone units from Huret. Resin pulleys definitely wear and can get brittle and break. It seemed to me that we got the best of all worlds when Shimano started using metal pulleys with ceramic journal bearings on New Dura-Ace. I haven't looked at anything else since that time, as they've been working flawlessly for decades.
Edit: Here is a 1975 Bullseye advertisement, showing their efficiency claims.
Edit: Here is a 1975 Bullseye advertisement, showing their efficiency claims.
Last edited by T-Mar; 11-09-17 at 11:56 AM.
11-09-17, 08:01 AM
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,515
Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3241 Post(s)
Liked 2,512 Times
in
1,510 Posts
It hasn't been mentioned yet.........The real deal with aftermarket pulleys is they look really cool. It's all about the bling!
11-09-17, 09:05 AM
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 23,223
Mentioned: 654 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4722 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3,036 Times
in
1,874 Posts
11-09-17, 10:03 AM
#16
Friendship is Magic
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 22,984
Bikes: old ones
Mentioned: 304 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26410 Post(s)
Liked 10,376 Times
in
7,204 Posts
11-09-17, 10:10 AM
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Zang's Spur, CO
Posts: 9,083
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3375 Post(s)
Liked 5,513 Times
in
2,856 Posts
On my winter bike I once developed a noisy RD.
When I put it up on the stand to adjust it, I discovered it didn't need adjustment;
The gunk had built up on the sides of the upper pulley, preventing the lateral float.
I just needed to remove the pulleys, clean them, and re-install.
11-09-17, 10:23 AM
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Peoria, IL
Posts: 4,476
Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1829 Post(s)
Liked 3,374 Times
in
1,580 Posts
A couple of my bikes are also equipped with the nice sealed bearing pulleys that SunTour made for a while.
For me, the visual effect is not a consideration. My goal was/is the lack of maintenance required. When I used the plain pulleys (SunTour or Shimano) with bushings, the lube didn't last long. Plus, the lube would attract dirt, causing more wear. To back up Bulleye's claims of reduced drag, I will say that a plain pulley with lube that has dried up or oozed out of the pulley will certainly have more drag. Does it matter?? Probably not (for me, at least).
IIRC, the only bike that I've got that doesn't have sealed bearing pulleys is equipped with Campy C-Record(?) pulleys with ball bearings and adjustable cones. They came on a used bike that I bought, and so far, I think they are novel and fun. Haven't noticed a problem with grease migrating out of them, but I haven't been watching them much.
Steve in Peoria
11-09-17, 11:53 AM
#19
weapons-grade bolognium
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Across the street from Chicago
Posts: 6,344
Bikes: Battaglin Cromor, Ciocc Designer 84, Schwinn Superior 1981
Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 985 Post(s)
Liked 2,378 Times
in
891 Posts
I got the Charmichaels I'm using in a parts lot. Wasn't opitimisic that they would work. I gave them a try because they were on hand and the stock pulleys on the 600 derailleur were worn into sharp points.
I've seen the comments online about noise and lack of float, but they seem to work fine in an 8 speed index system. Quiet too.
I've seen the comments online about noise and lack of float, but they seem to work fine in an 8 speed index system. Quiet too.
11-09-17, 12:22 PM
#22
Extraordinary Magnitude
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waukesha WI
Posts: 13,646
Bikes: 1978 Trek TX700; 1978/79 Trek 736; 1984 Specialized Stumpjumper Sport; 1984 Schwinn Voyageur SP; 1985 Trek 620; 1985 Trek 720; 1986 Trek 400 Elance; 1987 Schwinn High Sierra; 1990 Miyata 1000LT
Mentioned: 84 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2608 Post(s)
Liked 1,699 Times
in
935 Posts
Correct!
And I wracked my brain for an hour this morning trying to remember what the lower pulley is called.
Tension.
And I wracked my brain for an hour this morning trying to remember what the lower pulley is called.
Tension.
__________________
*Recipient of the 2006 Time Magazine "Person Of The Year" Award*
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
11-09-17, 12:39 PM
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 23,223
Mentioned: 654 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4722 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3,036 Times
in
1,874 Posts
11-09-17, 01:04 PM
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,515
Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3241 Post(s)
Liked 2,512 Times
in
1,510 Posts
Someone had to mention Bullseye pulleys. Dang! They are so sweet looking with the cool colors. Every time I am cruising Ebay I have to pull them up and ogle for a moment. Then I look at the prices to see if they have dropped. And I hope, and I hope, but they never go down! Same ol same ol. I just can't get myself to hit the buy button so I move on, dejected.