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Low end Batavus conundrum

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Low end Batavus conundrum

Old 02-17-18, 06:06 PM
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Low end Batavus conundrum

I'm beginning to think this was money I should have never spent. Looking for options. I picked up a low end Batavus back in August. 68mm bb shell, cottered cranks, steel handlebars, seat post, wheels, etc. Figured it would become my new "errand" bike.

The cottered cranks were knarly so they went to the dump along with the cottered spindle as it was pitted. I decided I wanted to go with a cotterless crank anyway. Taking the cups out the drive side was left hand thread and the non-drive right hand side. Great, I thought, English threading. I tried a couple of cartridge English thread bb's that I had and the cups wouldn't thread in very far - and I was being cautious. So again, I think, "must be Swiss thread" I ordered a new IRD cartridge bb with Swiss cups and these also do not thread in very far before stopping.

Today I tried 3 different 68 mm bb spindles I have on hand (lower end with nutted ends) that had the narrowest distance between races.(I probably have 7 of these in total). Every one of them bottomed out before the right side cup was all the way threaded. Backing it out a little still had play in the bottom bracket. So, I'm at a loss for what kind of spindle I have and why the new cups don't want to thread in all the way.

In the two photos one shows the new Swiss thread cup (goes in further than the English) and the other is the original cup (I left it out to show the threads).

Where the new Swiss thread cup bottoms out and stops turning:



Threading on original cup
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Old 02-17-18, 07:38 PM
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It certainly sounds like Swiss threads. Any chance there's a LBS nearby with the correct tap to chase the threads?
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Old 02-17-18, 08:41 PM
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Perhaps your first step would be to hold your old cup next to each of your new cups and see which thread pitch matches up. Swiss is 25.4 threads per inch. English is 24 threads per inch. That will at least tell you which of your new bottom brackets is supposed to go in there.

Maybe try cleaning the threads in the bottom bracket with a small wire brush and a degreaser or solvent, brushing in the direction of the threads to try to dislodge and accumulated crud.
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Old 02-17-18, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Hudson308
It certainly sounds like Swiss threads. Any chance there's a LBS nearby with the correct tap to chase the threads?
The lbs here might have tools for it - same owner since 1982. But not sure I'd trust the young employees.
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Old 02-17-18, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by obrentharris
Perhaps your first step would be to hold your old cup next to each of your new cups and see which thread pitch matches up. Swiss is 25.4 threads per inch. English is 24 threads per inch. That will at least tell you which of your new bottom brackets is supposed to go in there.

Maybe try cleaning the threads in the bottom bracket with a small wire brush and a degreaser or solvent, brushing in the direction of the threads to try to dislodge and accumulated crud.
Brent
I sort of tried that and it seemed like it matched up best to the Swiss. But, I agree I probably need to clean it up even more. It's just strange that the cup just stops - granted I'm not trying to force it either. But, it sure seems to lock in pretty tight
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Old 02-17-18, 09:28 PM
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Threads are likely cross threaded at this point. No fun.
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Old 02-17-18, 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted by bikemig
Threads are likely cross threaded at this point. No fun.
Yeah, but the interesting thing is the original cups thread all the way in perfectly fine.
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Old 02-18-18, 12:39 AM
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Just my 2c, but I always chase/trace the whole threading with a right angle pick to clean and inspect the threads as it will tell you if there is a deviation or something blocking them. It seems to me that many times debris gets left in them on removal of the cup and then is lodged when you thread a cup back in, compounding the problem if there is also a thread mismatch.
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Old 02-18-18, 04:34 AM
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Can you return those new BB and get a Velo Orange threadless type?

Definitely need to chase them. Are the new cups deeper than the old ones?
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Old 02-18-18, 04:52 AM
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If the original cups are still fine i would go with a new spindle that has the same cone distance like your original pitted one.
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Old 02-18-18, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Kovkov
If the original cups are still fine i would go with a new spindle that has the same cone distance like your original pitted one.
That was the attempt yesterday. Unfortunately, not having the original cottered spindle presents the challenge in not knowing the exact difference.
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Old 02-18-18, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Bianchigirll
Can you return those new BB and get a Velo Orange threadless type?
And, that's even the bigger conundrum. Just getting a bb and I've spent what I paid for the entire bike. Ah, the joys of trying to resurrect and old, low end frame.
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Old 02-18-18, 07:25 AM
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My old Batavus (model Tour de l'Europe, if that's the same as yours) is hanging in a buddy's garage in Connecticut so I guess I could drive up there and take it apart to get more info for you, but that is waaaay down the list of priorities.
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Old 02-18-18, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by scozim
That was the attempt yesterday. Unfortunately, not having the original cottered spindle presents the challenge in not knowing the exact difference.
Measure it and then go to www.nusshold.ch if you donít mind ordering from switzerland. They have new cottered spindles in 3 different overall lengths that all fit classic swiss bikes. They also have all kinds of square tappered spindles.
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Old 02-18-18, 09:38 AM
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Maybe you tried this already, but can you thread in the cup any further if you don't have the cartridge installed? Sometimes the drive side threads aren't perfectly straight and the cartridge doesn't line up with the cup. I have run into this a couple times and was able to get them together by backing the cartridge out a couple turns, then threading the cup part way in. Once they are mated, I'll torque the cartridge and cup.
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Old 02-18-18, 10:08 AM
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Any pics of the bike and model? Might take the guesswork out.
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Old 02-18-18, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by scozim
And, that's even the bigger conundrum. Just getting a bb and I've spent what I paid for the entire bike. Ah, the joys of trying to resurrect and old, low end frame.
If it doesn't have a RD hanger cut your losses
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