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Originally Posted by TenGrainBread
(Post 20221329)
From an engineering standpoint, a system which requires less maintenance by design is always better than a system that needs maintenance, no matter the willingness of the rider to do said maintenance (most bike riders aren't dedicated nutheads like ourselves ;) ).
Star nuts are not consumable parts and are not meant to break. The only time I've seen them break is when the user doesn't understand that they are there to simply eliminate play in the bearings, and not to be tightened until the bolt can turn anymore. If this concept is understood, changing stems or adjusting spacer/stem position is a 2 minute job, I have done it on the road before and it is just as quick and easy as in the shop. I think a lot of C&V enthusiasts like working on their bikes and doing maintenance on old parts because they find them beautiful, engrossing, and fun. And in many cases these parts are just what we're used to. Acknowledging that habit, aesthetic appreciation, and mechanical curiosity can contribute to the love of a part separate from its design superiority or inferiority to modern parts is an exercise I think we all would benefit from. In other words, rather than scrambling to come up with ways in which threaded is better than threadless, and spouting off conspiracies on how the bike companies are just trying to get us to buy the newest thing, we should just say "I like C&V parts, and that's it." |
Originally Posted by fietsbob
(Post 20221071)
If you had a fork threading die , and the tool handle to guide it in ideal alignment, then you would not have to find a frame builder that does.
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The reduction in labour and warehousing costs associated with threadless front end allows the average bicycle buyer, who rarely puts tools to their bikes, a better quality bike for the same amount of money. for those of us who do our own work, both are fine aren't they?
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Originally Posted by gugie
(Post 20220789)
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The other disadvantage of a threadless stem is the stack of spacers sticking above the stem, when the stem is in a low position. Its about as sleek and elegant as a clunky set of stem shifters sticking up in the wind. Of course you can cut the steerer, but then the stem is no longer adjustable.
With a threaded / quill, the stem looks just as sleek when raised as when lowered. |
Originally Posted by fietsbob
(Post 20221105)
how difficult is it to shuffle some spacers from under the stem to over it, If you left the steerer long enough..
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You can get a Soma Quill-inator. Costs about $80. Thta makes it possible to slap a quill stem on a threadless fork.
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Originally Posted by Ungaro
(Post 20222327)
You can get a Soma Quill-inator. Costs about $80. Thta makes it possible to slap a quill stem on a threadless fork.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_hTyj3OL-9C...or_on_bike.jpg Brent |
Originally Posted by obrentharris
(Post 20222390)
An interesting idea but perhaps the ugliest solution of all.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_hTyj3OL-9C...or_on_bike.jpg Brent |
Originally Posted by jonwvara
(Post 20222115)
I've never bought a new bike with a threadless stem--just that one Surly frame, which came with an uncut steerer--so this is an honest question: when you buy a new bike from a shop, do they start with an uncut steerer which they cut to any length you request, or do they provide a precut and preassembled steerer in a length that the manufacturer has decided will suit most riders for that frame size? Or does it depend on the shop?
I quit working in shops in the very early days of threadless steer tubes. At that time you had to cut them. If you buy a custom frame, it will most likely come with an uncut steerer. Mine did. IMO whatever your issue is, it's probably going to be easier to solve with a different stem or whatever than by sweating in a new steer tube. Also, I can't imagine 1 1/8" threaded headsets and stems will be very easy to come by. They only existed for a few years -- a short blip in time. As long as everyone is weighing in, my preference is for threadless. It's stronger, lighter and better. :D I do like the adjustability of the old quill stems though. It was useful for me to have a quill stem on my Rivendell Clem, since I hadn't ridden north road type bars for any great distance since I was like 12. It helped me dial it in. For road bikes, I kind of know my position, and am not inclined to change it. |
Originally Posted by Salamandrine
(Post 20222718)
I really have no idea how it is now. I'd guess they come precut nowadays (?), as it's no great hassle to cut them to length in a factory, and it would eliminate the possibility of the bike shop messing it up.
I quit working in shops in the very early days of threadless steer tubes. At that time you had to cut them. If you buy a custom frame, it will most likely come with an uncut steerer. Mine did. IMO whatever your issue is, it's probably going to be easier to solve with a different stem or whatever than by sweating in a new steer tube. Also, I can't imagine 1 1/8" threaded headsets and stems will be very easy to come by. They only existed for a few years -- a short blip in time. As long as everyone is weighing in, my preference is for threadless. It's stronger, lighter and better. :D I do like the adjustability of the old quill stems though. It was useful for me to have a quill stem on my Rivendell Clem, since I hadn't ridden north road type bars for any great distance since I was like 12. It helped me dial it in. For road bikes, I kind of know my position, and am not inclined to change it. |
then it's easy, get a Custom fork made..
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Originally Posted by gugie
(Post 20222888)
The OP has already stated his need - adjustable stem height "on the fly", and minimal breakdown size for rinko. Quill seems to win there.
Just to be thorough, I fully admit that these are completely hideous, but there is such a thing as an adjustable threadless stem. http://bikeisland.com/images/SM4831.jpg But I agree, for a touring/rinko bike, yeah, for sure quill is the most elegant and the most functional. A replacement threaded steer tube for a LHT is going to be beefy enough that the chance of any potential downside is essentially nil. Since no one mentioned it, I still think that Rene Herse stems were beautiful. They were the original threadless stem. :) (sort of) https://www.compasscycle.com/wp-cont...tInstalled.jpg |
Originally Posted by jyl
(Post 20221910)
That's not bad. Placing the bolts forward of the steerer helps make it look less like a radiator hose clamp.
http://fstatic2.mtb-news.de/f/73/48/...rek-stem.JPG?0 Not my picture, but looks a lot like the one or two system 3? stems that I have in my parts box. Only 2 bolts on the faceplate, I'm not sure if that was a hazard or not. I do wish there were attractive quill stems with removable faceplates in more sizes/styles that were easily available. |
Originally Posted by fietsbob
(Post 20222900)
then it's easy, get a Custom fork made..
https://www.lyonsport.com/frames-0 |
Originally Posted by Salamandrine
(Post 20222926)
Hmm, must have missed the "on the fly" and rinko comments. Still can't find them. On another thread perhaps?
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Originally Posted by Trevtassie
(Post 20221841)
Except threaded stems are thicker walled, to allow for the metal cut away by a thread die.
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How about this? https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.4...jwHaHa&pid=Api
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Originally Posted by fietsbob
(Post 20223126)
How about this? https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.4...jwHaHa&pid=Api
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the Larry Vs Harry cargo bikes use them, as a fleet shared bike TECHNICAL INFO - Larry Vs. Harry
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Originally Posted by fietsbob
(Post 20222900)
then it's easy, get a Custom fork made..
This might be nuts, but as a guy who works closely with machine shops, it seems to me that it might also be possible to make some sort of double-ended expandable internal plug fitting that would allow one to cut off a threaded steerer a couple of inches above the fork, and mechanically fasten on a threaded steerer from there upward. That would not be a trivial design project, and it would have to be executed with precision, given that the cost of screwing it up could be very high. A custom fork is probably a better idea all around. |
long list of bike business links via UBI bikeschool.com
One may be able to machine a steerer tube which was thick wall 7/8" ID for most common quill stems, with a 1.125" OD.. sleeve inside, effectively butted .. typical OD steerer, 1" ID, 1/16" tube wall, for 9/8" ... 1/8" tube wall for 7/8 inside, 9/8" outside rolling threads displaces metal rather than cutting it, thats how spokes are threaded. .... |
Originally Posted by SquidPuppet
(Post 20223063)
When you say stem, I'm assuming you mean steerer. I haven't measured every threadless steerer made, but everyone that I have measured has the same ID/OD as a threaded. ~.0625" wall.
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Originally Posted by Trevtassie
(Post 20223363)
I've never measured one, it's just what I remember being told, and took it as gospel....
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I think the biggest issue with threading an unthreaded steerer is getting the die started straight. If you want to experiment a guy has a couple 1-1/8" threading dies on ebay super cheap right now, no pilots or handle though. It's heresy to talk about threading a threadless fork, but if it was mine I'd probably just try anyway.
Went and measured the longest 1-1/8" threaded steerer I personally have, about 8.5" and that's the longest non replacement fork I've ever seen. The frame it came off was gigantic by mountain bike standards, 23" or 24" at least. |
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