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Brifters: Do they all suck this badly?

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Brifters: Do they all suck this badly?

Old 04-10-19, 06:45 PM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
Before the age of litigation and heavy regulation required it, schools didn't close if they didn't have to. Plus the much higher cost now of snow removal, road maintenance, etc. Different era....
No such thing as school closures in my region. Both parents having to work is normal and if the schools close they scream because one of them has to stay home or they have to find and pay for babysitter. For the same reason, kids never stay home when they're sick.
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Old 04-10-19, 06:53 PM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
Very interesting. Who knew there are such drastic changes from generation to generation?
Even within 11s I would say Shimano made huge improvements between the x800 and Rx000 series. I only have 5800, R7000, and R8000 to compare, but the R8000 group on my race bike has been an absolute tank riding in some of the nastiest conditions I'd ever subject myself to on and sometimes off the road on a road bike. Like all things they all work best when properly maintained, but the new stuff is lightning fast and incredibly accurate shifts. I never seem to jump up (down?) two cogs when I only mean to jump up one like I do sometimes on my 5800 equipped bike.
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Old 04-10-19, 06:59 PM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
For the same reason, kids never stay home when they're sick.
Yep.

They come and give the flu to everyone.

The gift that keeps on giving.
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Old 04-10-19, 08:28 PM
  #104  
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This thread reminds me that I’m going to need to flush the Shimano 600 8-speed brifters when I drag that bike out of the basement this year. I usually use a mix of wd-40 and some silicon spray lube. When they work they work good.
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Old 04-11-19, 06:01 AM
  #105  
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I'm running Simplex delrin downtube shifters with a glued together front derailleur and an NOS Criterium rear derailleur and LOVING it. Vintage rocks. Steel is real. Merckx rules.

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Old 04-11-19, 06:47 AM
  #106  
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Originally Posted by gomango View Post
@ op Maybe I missed it in the thread.

Did you ever get those "brifters" unglued?
No, I just sold the whole bike. Well, actually two whole bikes, both equipped with the same Ultegra 9-speed brifters, both of which didn't work. I suppose if I encounter them again, I'll try the WD-40 fix. As for my personal bikes, I'm sticking with downtube, bar-end, and thumb shifters. Friction.
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Old 04-11-19, 08:19 AM
  #107  
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That's too bad. Although I have friction shifting bikes and ride them frequently, I cannot agree that friction is better. Indexed shifting can be excellent and makes life easier. Try double shifting on the downtube while standing on a climb? Ain't gonna happen, and you'll have to compromise somewhere to get that shift in, likely by sitting briefly. Ugh.

Also, I've ridden friction shifting bikes three days of commuting this week, one with bar ends and two days with downtube shifters. Friction shifting just isn't as precise and you can lose both momentum and rhythm with a slightly missed shift. Don't get me wrong, I love my friction shifting bikes, but for different reasons. Certainly not because of the ease of shifting.

We had gummed up 3x8 RSX shifters on my daughter's Volpe. It took some fiddling and WD40 to get them working again. Been terrific for 5 years now. I've put 2x7 or 3x7 A050 brifters on some vintage re-builds for friends. They work a charm, too.
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Old 04-11-19, 08:38 AM
  #108  
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Originally Posted by johnnyace View Post
No, I just sold the whole bike. Well, actually two whole bikes, both equipped with the same Ultegra 9-speed brifters, both of which didn't work.

Hope you explained that to the "lucky" winner on ebay.....
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Old 04-11-19, 09:04 AM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by gomango View Post
Hope you explained that to the "lucky" winner on ebay.....
Yup, and he owns a bike shop, so he wasn't too concerned.
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Old 04-11-19, 09:13 AM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by johnnyace View Post
Yup, and he owns a bike shop, so he wasn't too concerned.
Fair enough then.

Swapping out shifters will be no issue.

When I bought my Della Santa for my son, I just did the frameset and Chrome Molly installed a "mostly" 10 speed Chorus set.

Nicest groupset I've owned. Flawless.
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Old 04-11-19, 09:46 AM
  #111  
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Originally Posted by gomango View Post
When I bought my Della Santa for my son, I just did the frameset and Chrome Molly installed a "mostly" 10 speed Chorus set.

Nicest groupset I've owned. Flawless.
I keep hearing good things about the Chorus group lately, so I was actually looking at some on ebay earlier today. Sounds like the brifters are actually pretty good, haha.
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Old 04-11-19, 10:01 AM
  #112  
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I haven't used Chorus, but I have a bike with Campagnolo Veloce. I think it's bottom of the line, which is strange to me, because it looks, feels, and works fantastically. The price was pretty low. My trouble with Campagnolo is that it's usually incompatible with Shimano stuff, and I often have enough Shimano stuff lying around that I can't justify building stuff up with Campagnolo.
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Old 04-11-19, 10:17 AM
  #113  
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Originally Posted by johnnyace View Post
I keep hearing good things about the Chorus group lately, so I was actually looking at some on ebay earlier today. Sounds like the brifters are actually pretty good, haha.

My favorites.

Haven't used friction on a regular basis since the 80's.

I just put a 10 speed Chorus set on my Weigle.

That was an easy choice.

FWIW My McLean has a Super Record set with Simplex Retros.

Works fine.
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Old 04-11-19, 10:20 AM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
I haven't used Chorus, but I have a bike with Campagnolo Veloce. I think it's bottom of the line, which is strange to me, because it looks, feels, and works fantastically. The price was pretty low. My trouble with Campagnolo is that it's usually incompatible with Shimano stuff, and I often have enough Shimano stuff lying around that I can't justify building stuff up with Campagnolo.
Veloce works great, as does Centaur.

I run Centaur on my Monstercross.

Set and forget.

Clean and lube the chain after a mud ride and it won't bite back.
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Old 04-15-19, 12:12 PM
  #115  
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Originally Posted by jamesdak View Post
I'm with the others. Not usual to find old Shimano shifters all gummed up and not working. Really
simple job to flush well with WD40 and then relubricate with something like Triflow. I've rescued several sets like this that weren't working at all. Once fixed they've stayed good for years.
I generally agree but prefer to not use WD40. It contains waxes that may gum up later. I use PB Blaster or similar and follow up with tri flow.
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Old 04-15-19, 12:19 PM
  #116  
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Originally Posted by jdsyachts View Post
I generally agree but prefer to not use WD40. It contains waxes that may gum up later. I use PB Blaster or similar and follow up with tri flow.
To be honest I actually prefer PB Blaster too. As to WD40, I believe the wax worry is unfounded.

Found this and other supporting info a while ago:

"WD-40 does not contain fish oil, contrary to a popular myth, nor does it contain silicone, kerosene, water, wax, graphite, chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs)"
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Old 04-15-19, 02:20 PM
  #117  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
My trouble with Campagnolo is that it's usually incompatible with Shimano stuff, and I often have enough Shimano stuff lying around that I can't justify building stuff up with Campagnolo.
I've built a few "Shimergo" bikes w/8sp Campy shifting 7sp Shimano. Works great. Actually, that's what I have one my one remaining brifter-equipped bike.
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Old 04-15-19, 02:41 PM
  #118  
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Originally Posted by jeirvine View Post
I've built a few "Shimergo" bikes w/8sp Campy shifting 7sp Shimano. Works great. Actually, that's what I have one my one remaining brifter-equipped bike.
Hmm, I may be ready to do just that. I have a bike I'm renovating, going from Campagnolo Veloce 2x10 with a 8/9/10 speed Shimano rear hub. I guess that means I should buy an 8-speed cassette, eh?
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Old 04-15-19, 03:14 PM
  #119  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
Hmm, I may be ready to do just that. I have a bike I'm renovating, going from Campagnolo Veloce 2x10 with a 8/9/10 speed Shimano rear hub. I guess that means I should buy an 8-speed cassette, eh?
Maybe.
I have only personally done 8-to-7. Plenty of good info here, though:
https://www.google.com/search?q=shim...bikeforums.net
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Old 04-15-19, 09:29 PM
  #120  
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12t cogs

Originally Posted by Kuromori View Post
Straight blocks were invented before brifters and brifters do not necessarily have to run straight blocks. What is basically being implied is that having options is bad, something like an ad braklus fixae argument.

Regarding 9t/10t cogs, this is largely misinformed. 9t are predominantly used for 20" wheel bikes and sometimes mountain bikes with small single chainrings where the goal is to maximize gear range in the cassette. If you start off with a 10-50t cassette and you want to increase range by 10% you can either make it 9-50 or 10-55. The same goes for 10t, except with SRAM 2x12, which also comes with smaller chainrings.

Regarding 11t cogs, this has almost nothing to do with brifters and time trialists were already using larger than standard chainrings to get higher gears. It has to do with hyperglide freehubs and mountain bike chainring clearance. 11t cogs were rare on road bikes during the 9 speed era, with 12t small being standard. They weren't even common when 10 speed was first introduced and only became common on road bikes when compact doubles became common.

Regarding 12t cogs, these were already finding their way onto 6/7sp downtube systems and even freewheels.
Still have a couple 1983 vintage Regina 6SP CX's with 12t cogs. My go-to setup in those days was 22-19-17-15-13-12 coupled to 52-41 or 54-45 chain rings for most RR's. 17-12 for TT's. Went to 24-21-18-16-14-12 when it got steep. Never saw an Oro 12t though. Have since upgraded the vintage stuff to America's.
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Old 04-16-19, 12:29 PM
  #121  
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I think one of the big differences between old crap (dt shifters/bar end shifters) vs new crap (ergo's/brifters) is that the old crap can go through ww3 and still be made to work like new. New crap can go through ww3 also, and maybe even be fixed up (wd40 trick for example), but it will never be exactly like new, most of the time anyway.

Have you ever tried to polish a brifter for example? Bad idea. Have you drillium'ed an RSX shifter? I mean i have, as a last resort, but thats for another topic.

Fixing up some old busted DT shifters is like working on a 1978 Chevy Blazer. You can have a polka dance in the engine compartment and then take a nap, all before you try to remove that starter. There is that much room. It's that easy.

Fixing up a 9 speed campy ergo shifter is like working on your wifes 2014 Subaru. You can do it, but you're really only doing it because you're a cheap bass-tard , and it's going to take 6 times as long as it should, and your hands are too freaking big to even fit in there (twss). You're going to get angry,

So, I'm not going as far to say that the new crap is throw away because a lot of it's not, but some people like to be able to have sex in their engine compartments without the anger and frustration of getting your hand stuck between the exhaust manifold and the spark plug hole.
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Old 04-16-19, 12:42 PM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by -holiday76 View Post
Fixing up some old busted DT shifters is like working on a 1978 Chevy Blazer. You can have a polka dance in the engine compartment and then take a nap, all before you try to remove that starter. There is that much room. It's that easy.
Having a1976 K20 P/U I can vouch for the accuracy of this statement and will include with the engine running and the hood closed.
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Old 04-16-19, 03:51 PM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
What's it matter if people like staying in a cadence range?
In ancient Greece, two columns marked the entrance to the Oracle of Delphos, And one of the columns beared the inscription, "Nothing in excess".
Staying in a single cadence range is an excess. I learned this the hard way, with knee trouble. Now I have learnt to listen to my knees and switch from a 90-100 cadence to something in the range 40-60 standing on the pedals, especially while climbing. This activates other muscle groups and brings relief to my knees and allows me to return to higher cadence later without my knees complaining.

In case you are wondering, the other column read, "Know thyself". What works for me might not work for you.
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Old 04-16-19, 04:36 PM
  #124  
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Having tightly-spaced gears isn't about staying within a fixed cadence range, it's about being able to be close to where your body wants to be in at a given moment.
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Old 04-16-19, 05:30 PM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by HTupolev View Post
Having tightly-spaced gears isn't about staying within a fixed cadence range, it's about being able to be close to where your body wants to be in at a given moment.
I can relate.

I rode yesterday on an 11-sp corncob. It was windy and I was on an aero carbon bike with aero wheels. I could hardly tell when I shifted, and it was kind of annoying.

I rode today on a 7sp medium range steel Italian bike, "normal" wheels with 700x22's. Huge gap between gears, but after about 20 minutes, I was definitely not annoyed.

My legs need to learn that they can't have everything.
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