Batavus Criterium frame steel?
04-13-19, 09:01 AM
#26
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If you'll allow me, I'll muddy the waters a little bit more. 
From what I think might be the correct 1984 Batavus US catalog, I got the following pic. It's difficult to read, but I think it says:
"Main frame triangle hand-made of Ishiwata 025 double butted chrome molybdenum steel tubing, rear fork and stays hand-made of Ishiwata 022 high-tensile steel tubing; (...) FRONT FORK: Hand-made of Ishiwata 022 high tensile steel tubing"
From what I think might be the correct 1984 Batavus US catalog, I got the following pic. It's difficult to read, but I think it says:
"Main frame triangle hand-made of Ishiwata 025 double butted chrome molybdenum steel tubing, rear fork and stays hand-made of Ishiwata 022 high-tensile steel tubing; (...) FRONT FORK: Hand-made of Ishiwata 022 high tensile steel tubing"
04-13-19, 09:19 AM
#27
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Hello,
I don't know nor really care much as to what tubing a frame has as long as it fits and feels comfortable for the type of riding you use a specific frame for. That being said I do, for historical and/or sales purposes, like to be able to identify what type of tubing is used for construction.
I presently ride a Critical for general city riding and training. It has 501 tubing, but I have no idea when Batavus started using it. The bike came with Camp 980 drivetrain, hubs dated 1984. I don't think it's later than 1986, and it could have been a transitional frame made in '84 after the 1984 catalogue was released. If someone has access to 1985-1986 catalogues I'd be curious to see when they changed tubing. I believe Reynolds came out with 501 around 1983-1984 so it would make sense for them to change materials, especially if it was more economically advantageous.
. Personally I love the frame, and I probably have the smallest size (51.5 cm c-c seat tube) keeping it light and stiffer than the bigger guys. I will say, one of the best rides I picked up for under $150, with that much value in the components alone. Great ride with multiple use 28mm tires, but feels way better with 23-25mm. Enjoy your Batavus!
(no photos, sorry not yet matured for that privilege)
I don't know nor really care much as to what tubing a frame has as long as it fits and feels comfortable for the type of riding you use a specific frame for. That being said I do, for historical and/or sales purposes, like to be able to identify what type of tubing is used for construction.
I presently ride a Critical for general city riding and training. It has 501 tubing, but I have no idea when Batavus started using it. The bike came with Camp 980 drivetrain, hubs dated 1984. I don't think it's later than 1986, and it could have been a transitional frame made in '84 after the 1984 catalogue was released. If someone has access to 1985-1986 catalogues I'd be curious to see when they changed tubing. I believe Reynolds came out with 501 around 1983-1984 so it would make sense for them to change materials, especially if it was more economically advantageous.
. Personally I love the frame, and I probably have the smallest size (51.5 cm c-c seat tube) keeping it light and stiffer than the bigger guys. I will say, one of the best rides I picked up for under $150, with that much value in the components alone. Great ride with multiple use 28mm tires, but feels way better with 23-25mm. Enjoy your Batavus!
(no photos, sorry not yet matured for that privilege)
04-14-19, 06:27 AM
#28
Barred @ Velocipedesalon
Batavus Criterium 501 tubing
First let me apologize for the "Critical, Criterion, Criteria" misspellings. I'm not used to my words being altered automatically. Criterium, Criterium, Criterium; good I think it's trained now!
Non-fixie, thanks for making me look closer at the catalogue images. I wasn't paying much attention since the conversation was on the Ishiwata tubing.
The "1985" Criterium pictured would be identical to my ride with the exception of the gruppo.
. T-mar thanks for the input. The bike has/had a Thun BB and crankset (Aero Coronado, I believe). Still has the OE BB, but had Camp mirage crankset with longer arms, thus the change there. You spot on with my bike, and I thought the 980 parts were added, cool to know that it wasn't altered much. Brakes when I got it had Dia Compe Aero levers (still on it), and Weinmann 605 calipers (replaced with Suntour Cyclone); not sure if any was OE. I removed the FD, since riding on Florida flatlands I never use a small chainring; gets put on for New England though.
Non-fixie, thanks for making me look closer at the catalogue images. I wasn't paying much attention since the conversation was on the Ishiwata tubing.
The "1985" Criterium pictured would be identical to my ride with the exception of the gruppo.
. T-mar thanks for the input. The bike has/had a Thun BB and crankset (Aero Coronado, I believe). Still has the OE BB, but had Camp mirage crankset with longer arms, thus the change there. You spot on with my bike, and I thought the 980 parts were added, cool to know that it wasn't altered much. Brakes when I got it had Dia Compe Aero levers (still on it), and Weinmann 605 calipers (replaced with Suntour Cyclone); not sure if any was OE. I removed the FD, since riding on Florida flatlands I never use a small chainring; gets put on for New England though.
04-14-19, 06:43 AM
#29
Barred @ Velocipedesalon
Reynolds introduced 501 for the 1983 model year, but we know based on the extant catalogue that Batayus wasn't using it that year. I don't have any literature for the 1984 Criterium but it was spec'd with Reynolds 501 and Campagnolo 980 derailleurs in 1985. It employed the same tubing and derailleurs in 1986 but a Thun crankset replaced of the Campagnolo Gran Sport. You said it has "980 drivetrain, hubs dated 1984", so it sounds like you have a 1985 or possibly 1984 model. As suggested by non-fixie , the serial number may allow us to increase our confidence, one way or the other.
I'm still not mature enough for photos, but I believe there should now be some available in my album. Access is open to members.
04-14-19, 06:47 AM
#30
Barred @ Velocipedesalon
Batavus Criterium 501 tubing
First let me apologize for the "Critical, Criterion, Criteria" misspellings. I'm not used to my words being altered automatically. Criterium, Criterium, Criterium; good I think it's trained now!
Non-fixie, thanks for making me look closer at the catalogue images. I wasn't paying much attention since the conversation was on the Ishiwata tubing.
The "1985" Criterium pictured would be identical to my ride with the exception of the gruppo.
. T-mar thanks for the input. The bike has/had a Thun BB and crankset (Aero Coronado, I believe). Still has the OE BB, but had Camp mirage crankset with longer arms, thus the change there. You spot on with my bike, and I thought the 980 parts were added, cool to know that it wasn't altered much. Brakes when I got it had Dia Compe Aero levers (still on it), and Weinmann 605 calipers (replaced with Suntour Cyclone); not sure if any was OE. I removed the FD, since riding on Florida flatlands I never use a small chainring; gets put on for New England though.
Non-fixie, thanks for making me look closer at the catalogue images. I wasn't paying much attention since the conversation was on the Ishiwata tubing.
The "1985" Criterium pictured would be identical to my ride with the exception of the gruppo.
. T-mar thanks for the input. The bike has/had a Thun BB and crankset (Aero Coronado, I believe). Still has the OE BB, but had Camp mirage crankset with longer arms, thus the change there. You spot on with my bike, and I thought the 980 parts were added, cool to know that it wasn't altered much. Brakes when I got it had Dia Compe Aero levers (still on it), and Weinmann 605 calipers (replaced with Suntour Cyclone); not sure if any was OE. I removed the FD, since riding on Florida flatlands I never use a small chainring; gets put on for New England though.
04-14-19, 07:05 AM
#31
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That looks more like a Danish bicycle registration number than a serial number. If so, the frame was manufactured in 1985 but the format doesn't break it down any further than that, so it could still be a 1986 model manufactured in late 1985. FYI, Weinmann 605 calipers were OEM in both 1985 and 1986.
04-14-19, 07:41 AM
#32
Barred @ Velocipedesalon
That looks more like a Danish bicycle registration number than a serial number. If so, the frame was manufactured in 1985 but the format doesn't break it down any further than that, so it could still be a 1986 model manufactured in late 1985. FYI, Weinmann 605 calipers were OEM in both 1985 and 1986.
I'm not familiar with any Europian postal codes/registration codes. Again, probably why I don't spend time tracking down numbers.
Note: dropouts are Gipiemme front and rear.
Brief note: All photos have been removed from my album. Less than 48 hrs and I'm doing it all over again.
04-14-19, 08:29 AM
#33
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Denmark has a federally regulated bicycle identification numbering system that was instituted during the second World War. All manufacturers selling in Denmark must comply. Whenever you see a number with a three to four character alpha prefix starting with 'W" and a single character alpha suffix, it is almost invariably the Danish system.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danish_bicycle_VIN-system
04-21-19, 10:07 AM
#34
Barred @ Velocipedesalon
Batavus Criterium 501 tubing
'86 BATAVUS CRITERIUM, REYNOLDS 501, CAMP 980 DRIVETRAIN, GPM DROPOUTS
'86 BATAVUS CRITERIUM, REYNOLDS 501
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