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Modern Dutch chaincase with C&V Raleigh Sports/Superbe?

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Modern Dutch chaincase with C&V Raleigh Sports/Superbe?

Old 06-21-19, 12:55 PM
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brianinc-ville
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Modern Dutch chaincase with C&V Raleigh Sports/Superbe?

I'm thinking about using a 1974 Raleigh Superbe as a regular commuter, which for me means it needs an enclosed chain. On other bikes, that can use 3/32" chain, I'm a big fan of the Hebie Chainglider, but I've found that it doesn't work very well with 1/8" chain, and I don't want to get into changing the BB and cranks on this one. It'd be great to find an original Raleigh chaincase, but I've given up hope there (though if you've got one, let me know).

So, I think I'll buy a current-production chaincase from the Netherlands (like one of these).

Does anybody have advice on which modern chaincase is easiest to install on / works best with a vintage Raleigh Sports/Superbe (46t chainwheel, 26" wheels)?
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Old 06-21-19, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post
I'm thinking about using a 1974 Raleigh Superbe as a regular commuter, which for me means it needs an enclosed chain. On other bikes, that can use 3/32" chain, I'm a big fan of the Hebie Chainglider, but I've found that it doesn't work very well with 1/8" chain, and I don't want to get into changing the BB and cranks on this one. It'd be great to find an original Raleigh chaincase, but I've given up hope there (though if you've got one, let me know).

So, I think I'll buy a current-production chaincase from the Netherlands (like one of these).

Does anybody have advice on which modern chaincase is easiest to install on / works best with a vintage Raleigh Sports/Superbe (46t chainwheel, 26" wheels)?
Hi Brian,

I have a chain guard from a 1979 Sports that I used for parts recently. It is brown in colour, and in perfect shape. I have no need for it. I think it would protect your chain reasonably well, considering how heavy the full on chaincases are.
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Old 06-21-19, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Ged117 View Post
Hi Brian,

I have a chain guard from a 1979 Sports that I used for parts recently. It is brown in colour, and in perfect shape. I have no need for it. I think it would protect your chain reasonably well, considering how heavy the full on chaincases are.
Thanks, Ged, but I definitely need full enclosure here. Weight is not an issue. Light-colored pants are the issue.

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Old 06-21-19, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post

Does anybody have advice on which modern chaincase is easiest to install on / works best with a vintage Raleigh Sports/Superbe (46t chainwheel, 26" wheels)?
I'd say don't risk it. The tolerances on enclosed guards are tight and are designed for specific chainstay lengths, angles, mounts etc. I have a 50's Hercules case that won't fit anything other than a Herc of that era. Superbes usually have a 2 point welded tab setup for stick style chainguards that would likely have to be removed. Finally, if you haven't owned one of these before, they make rear flat changes a pain in the rear.
But it's your bike and if you find one that fits, be sure to buy lotto tickets too. Good luck.

edit. I understand the need for clean pants, perhaps a custom gator that velcros around the right leg. It's bike gear and function is more important than fashio imo.

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Old 06-21-19, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by clubman View Post
I'd say don't risk it. The tolerances on enclosed guards are tight and are designed for specific chainstay lengths, angles, mounts etc. I have a 50's Hercules case that won't fit anything other than a Herc of that era. Superbes usually have a 2 point welded tab setup for stick style chainguards that would likely have to be removed. Finally, if you haven't owned one of these before, they make rear flat changes a pain in the rear.
But it's your bike and if you find one that fits, be sure to buy lotto tickets too. Good luck.
Seconded in regards to fit, but they're worth the tradeoff in practicality (except for the DL-1 type).

Find a frame with the chaincase boss or start off with one that already has the chaincase. That's the best way when dealing with a Raleigh.

-Kurt
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Old 06-21-19, 04:14 PM
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There is one person in US who imports and sells fully enclosed chaincases. For Raleighs. He has a real good idea what they fit and what they won't fit. Ask him. Andy Muzi at Yellow Jersey.
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Old 06-21-19, 10:46 PM
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Hmm. Now I'm thinking about whether a half-enclosed chainguard like this one (i.e., the entire outside of the chain is covered, but the side toward the frame is not) would do the job. Has anybody tried to mount one on a Sports/Suberbe?
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Old 06-21-19, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post
Hmm. Now I'm thinking about whether a half-enclosed chainguard like this one (i.e., the entire outside of the chain is covered, but the side toward the frame is not) would do the job. Has anybody tried to mount one on a Sports/Suberbe?
My concern is that most of these modern chainguards use the BB cup flange for installation (though it seems as if the AXA doesn't show mounting hardware at all).

Provided the BB mounting is a necessity (which I suspect it is), that'd also force you into the VO threadless BB and square taper cranks. The Raleigh drive side cups are flangeless, as are the Indian repops, and the Phil cups for sealed BBs in 26TPI bottom brackets.

It may be worth it if you're determined to put a chaincase on. The BB mounting works really well, even though some of the included brackets on these guards (SKS comes to mind) are a bit bendier than I'd prefer.

-Kurt
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Old 06-21-19, 11:49 PM
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Good point, Kurt. I'm definitely not up for changing the BB or cranks on this bike...if I were, then I'd just put a 3/32" chain on it and get a Hebie Chainglider. Hmm. There has to be some way to do this.

Y'know, it seems to me that I worked on a '70s Canadian-built Raleigh Sports a few years back, which had come from the factory with a P-shaped (German-style) chainguard; here's a kind of annoying video
featuring two of them. I can't exactly remember how it connected to the BB, but it must have had a flange. Were they using different BBs in Canada?
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Old 06-22-19, 12:01 AM
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Those mount to the frame with two tabs - one on the seattube, the other on the downtube - just like the later hockey stick guards.

Pretty sure your '74 Superbe should already have these tabs. Come to think of it, if you can find a modern guard that extends inboard far enough with the right chainring diameter, you could drill it for these mounting tabs. Not sure how floppy the bottom would be though. Perhaps a reverse C-shaped backing strip could hold it all in place?

-Kurt
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Old 06-22-19, 04:41 PM
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I have a Hesling chaincase from dutchbikebits.com on my ANT frame. The ANT is about halfway between a Sports and a Tourist in its dimensions. I have it geared 44x18 and had to install the chainring on the "wrong" side of the flange of the crank arm. Worth noting: It's an even bigger pain to get the wheel off with this chaincase than it is with a Raleigh one.


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Old 06-22-19, 05:04 PM
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Nice build agmetal!
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Old 06-22-19, 05:51 PM
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That is an utterly sweet ride, @agmetal!

So, it sounds like the lateral position of the chainring is pretty important (and not adjustable on the Superbe, without a new BB and cranks)...oy. It's looking more and more like trouser straps are in my future.

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Old 06-22-19, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post
That is an utterly sweet ride, @agmetal!

So, it sounds like the lateral position of the chainring is pretty important (and not adjustable on the Superbe, without a new BB and cranks)...oy. It's looking more and more like trouser straps are in my future.
With a Raleigh crank you'll probably be fine. I had to do what I did because I used a SunXCD crank with the 50.4mm BCD and one of the VO single rings. Took some experimentation to get it to work right.
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Old 06-23-19, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
Those mount to the frame with two tabs - one on the seattube, the other on the downtube - just like the later hockey stick guards.

Pretty sure your '74 Superbe should already have these tabs. Come to think of it, if you can find a modern guard that extends inboard far enough with the right chainring diameter, you could drill it for these mounting tabs. Not sure how floppy the bottom would be though. Perhaps a reverse C-shaped backing strip could hold it all in place?

-Kurt
Concept: what if I were to get the AXA VS (seems difficult to find a German seller who'll ship to the US, but I can keep digging), attach it to the two existing mounting tabs as you say, and then attach the BB-flange-mount-bracket around the downtube with zipties, rather than behind the nonexistent flange?
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Old 06-23-19, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post
Concept: what if I were to get the AXA VS (seems difficult to find a German seller who'll ship to the US, but I can keep digging), attach it to the two existing mounting tabs as you say, and then attach the BB-flange-mount-bracket around the downtube with zipties, rather than behind the nonexistent flange?
I was thinking about it last night, and I think the AXA's tabs might be too far outboard for the guard to sit in the right place.

However - you could take a strip of aluminum and bend it to the radius of the AXA in front in a half moon shape - then mount the factory AXA hardware to the outboard of the aluminum radius, and the inside to the two Raleigh tabs. Should be stiff enough when mounted to the two Raleigh tabs.

-Kurt
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Old 06-23-19, 11:30 PM
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Interesting idea -- I'm gaining enthusiasm for it.
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Old 06-24-19, 05:28 AM
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Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post
Interesting idea -- I'm gaining enthusiasm for it.
If you've got access to an English wheel somewhere, it should be really easy.

Might as well order up the AXA guard to get things moving - then figure out where it must sit and what mounting holes need to be addressed.

-Kurt
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Old 06-24-19, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
If you've got access to an English wheel somewhere, it should be really easy.
I don't -- my technique will definitely involve vise-grips and swearing. But let's see how it goes.
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Old 06-24-19, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post
I don't -- my technique will definitely involve vise-grips and swearing. But let's see how it goes.
If not, find something curved and hammer-and-dolly the metal into the shape. Would recommend this method with steel rather than aluminum.

It'll take some patience, but it'll be worth it.

-Kurt
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