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I guess I need more tools...

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I guess I need more tools...

Old 07-08-19, 05:16 PM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by noglider View Post
You screw it on with your hand.
For some reason, this reminds me of an Easy Rider quote.

"You gotta hold it in your lungs lonnnger, George."


Anyhoo ... I use a tool in the hand to screw it on, which I find easier than without the tool.
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Old 07-08-19, 06:07 PM
  #52  
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$45 to overhaul a hub may be high for a front, low for a rear. $90/pair seems fair.

I have spare Park cone wrenches and some freewheel tools, as well as a spare dishing tool. Pm if you want to own them.
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Old 07-08-19, 08:18 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
I use a tool in the hand to screw it on, which I find easier than without the tool.
I guess a tool in the hand is worth a screw and a push.
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Old 07-08-19, 09:02 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Kilroy1988 View Post
The rim in question literally probably has one if not two adjacent spokes that are not quite right - only a slight wobble on one side.

Thanks for the list. I already have a grand majority of those things - I even have a little spoke wrench already. I just don't have a truing stand and I have no other frame set with the same size dropouts to set this wheel into, and the one it will be used on does not have brakes or pads attached yet. So I figured I could not true it decently just having it mounted on the frame right now.
A couple small zip ties on the stays. rotated as needed close to the rim.
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x6t5g46
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Old 07-09-19, 12:54 AM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by Kilroy1988 View Post
Different versions of this story keep popping up in this thread, and I get the point. It may apply for many. I'm not an incompetent, though. I've rebuilt carburetors, changed brake rotors and replaced flywheels and re-wired headlights, etc, etc... Much more intense and knowledge-based stuff than the practically intuitive work required for bicycle maintenance. I know how to true a few spokes, I just don't have a proper stand or much time to fiddle with things right now.

I would happily pay someone some cash to do some of this work for me because I'm very busy right now, but have decided I'd rather do it myself when I find time than pay someone a quarter of my daily wages to fix a couple spokes.

-Gregory
I know, i think i see where you're coming from, and i'm with you to a certain extent. My mom wanted a simple fix to the lighting on her bike and the lbs charged 80€ because they had manufactured a custom clamp from a piece of aluminum (1hr work) - for a bike that was worth just about that. Thats one of the problems, when the craftsman's hourly rate is higher than the value of the item he's working on...

There is a guy in my home town of Munich who offered *affordable* bike fixes, using salvaged parts. Get your brakes adjusted and the lights fixed for 20.- €. Started as a hole in the wall mini-shop, now expanded and seems to be very successful. There definitely is a market for that kinsd of thing.
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Old 07-09-19, 12:58 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by Pompiere View Post
I have heard another version of that story involving a retired engineer called back to the factory where he had worked. Being set in modern times, there were more zeros on his invoice.
another version of the story involves a retired computer expert for mainframe systems. My hopes of actually becoming one of those lucky fellas went down the drain, sadly... backed the wrong horse
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Old 07-09-19, 12:19 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by Kilroy1988 View Post
I even have a little spoke wrench already. I just don't have a truing stand and I have no other frame set with the same size dropouts to set this wheel into, and the one it will be used on does not have brakes or pads attached yet. So I figured I could not true it decently just having it mounted on the frame right now.

-Gregory
Zip-ties on the seat stays may be the ticket. Use them as a feeler gauge to the rim, rotate about the SS axis as needed. Painters tape to protect the paint, perhaps. Granted, I haven’t used this method and only read about it on the internets, but it sounds sufficient. Not sure in practice, but worth a shot for the small adjustment you described.

~~~

Edit: Ah, I see I replied after reading the first page w/o noticing the second and third...already covered.
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Old 07-09-19, 01:29 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by Bikerider007 View Post
Yea buy tools, you dont need Park unless you are doing tons of work. Cheap Ebay tools have done fine by me.

Although, when I come across tool deals I jump on. My Campy headset and BB tools have served me well. I even use on BMX.
I would disagree...buy good tools. they last and work better. as as simple example the difference between the chain tool in one of the 50 buck or so kits and a park is night and day. I used the cheap one for years and cursed my self for doing so when I got a park.

doesn't have to be park, but get good quality
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Old 07-09-19, 03:52 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by squirtdad View Post
I would disagree...buy good tools. they last and work better. as as simple example the difference between the chain tool in one of the 50 buck or so kits and a park is night and day. I used the cheap one for years and cursed my self for doing so when I got a park.

doesn't have to be park, but get good quality
+1 Exactly this

Good tools will up your game, poor ones will cause you more trouble when you are already ill equipped.
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Old 07-09-19, 04:55 PM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by verktyg View Post

Recently I was looking over my inventory of personal belongings for my home owner's insurance. I spent over $7200 on Snap-on tools back in 1972-73.


I also have several thousand in bike specific tools that I've acquired over the years including a fairly complete set of VAR tools in a case.




verktyg
But yet- still missing the 10mm socket and 5mm Allen wrench..
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Old 07-09-19, 05:44 PM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by The Golden Boy View Post
But yet- still missing the 10mm socket and 5mm Allen wrench..
There are some tools you keep two of (even if one is from Horrible Fright).....
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Old 07-09-19, 05:56 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by madpogue View Post
There are some tools you keep two of (even if one is from Horrible Fright).....
Or so you don't have to walk back to the tool box or workbench depending on which one you're already at.
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Old 07-09-19, 05:57 PM
  #63  
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What is up with the idea that the less something costs or is valued at, the less the labor should be to repair it?

Now let's look at the other side. For every repair that takes five minutes, there is one that takes an hour and 20 minutes that they charge for only an hour. You also have plenty of the repairs where you spend 1/2 - 1 hour working up the repair estimate. You call up the customer, give the estimate and they don't want it repaired. You're out the labor of working up the estimate. There's also the, "I looked online and that is a $5 part. Why are you charging me $25?"
"Well, you think it's free shipping to get it here? Shipping was $16.45."
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Old 07-09-19, 06:04 PM
  #64  
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As for tools, that is one thing that the labor charge is paying for. One of the best examples is replacing a front CV joint/axle. It's an easy job...................if you have a cv axle puller. If you don't, don't even attempt it until you get the tool, period.
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Old 07-09-19, 06:11 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by squirtdad View Post
I would disagree...buy good tools. they last and work better. as as simple example the difference between the chain tool in one of the 50 buck or so kits and a park is night and day. I used the cheap one for years and cursed my self for doing so when I got a park.

doesn't have to be park, but get good quality
Agree to disagree. I break bikes down to every last piece and have no probs.
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Old 07-09-19, 06:19 PM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by seypat View Post
What is up with the idea that the less something costs or is valued at, the less the labor should be to repair it?
Because of the amount of expertise and the cost of the necessary equipment/facilities to make the repair possible. Do you think that a bicycle mechanic is as qualified to earn $X per hour as a Ferrari technician?
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Old 07-09-19, 06:23 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by Kilroy1988 View Post

I only came here to say that I was confounded by the price being charged for two very simple tasks that I know from experience will not take more than a few minutes to execute - not to mention the fact that I was told I had to wait two weeks for the work to be done.
And after 3 pages, your clearly absolute lack of experience is still showing. Take a minute and actually think about it.

Did you ever think that sometimes it can be an absolute ***** to remove a freewheel? Have you ever done a search here? Threads about soaking freewheels in Kroil for weeks? Stripped notches? Are bike mechanics psychic and just know everything about a job before it starts? They should believe you, Mr. I Have Done Hardly Any Bike Wrenching, that the job will be easy?

2 weeks wait at this point in the season seems about right for a good shop. In May, early June, expect to wait 3-4 weeks. Why? Because people are stupid and get tune ups when the weather is nice instead of January when the wait is a day, maybe two.

So Mr. Craftsman, you are slammed with work, do you offer discounts? Do you allow people to jump the line? All of your jobs go smooth? Do regale us with tales of a perfect 60 hour week. (Hint, no such thing)
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Old 07-09-19, 06:26 PM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by Kilroy1988 View Post
Because of the amount of expertise and the cost of the necessary equipment/facilities to make the repair possible. Do you think that a bicycle mechanic is as qualified to earn $X per hour as a Ferrari technician?
Here's me, changing the fuel pump on this car. I got paid $12/hour. Do Ferrari mechanics come with gold chains?

gt402 by iabisdb, on Flickr

gt40 by iabisdb, on Flickr
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Old 07-09-19, 06:35 PM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
And after 3 pages, your clearly absolute lack of experience is still showing. Take a minute and actually think about it.

Did you ever think that sometimes it can be an absolute ***** to remove a freewheel?
Yeah, actually, the last time I took one into this shop they stripped the notches on my '70s Campy freewheel and broke their tool in the process, and called it even when they handed it back to me still stuck to the Record hub.

The rest of your commentary makes little sense to me, because it has nothing to do with what I said. Changing the fuel pump on a vintage GT40 back in the day has little in common with working as a technician in a Ferrari dealership today.

I have no delusions, but if you think you're worth as much as the fellow working in the Ferrari dealership and can get the job done, then more power to you!

-Gregory

Last edited by Kilroy1988; 07-09-19 at 06:51 PM.
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Old 07-09-19, 06:41 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
So Mr. Craftsman, you are slammed with work, do you offer discounts? Do you allow people to jump the line? All of your jobs go smooth? Do regale us with tales of a perfect 60 hour week. (Hint, no such thing)
I would never be a craftsman full-time because even the best of them that I know (and I know many) often seem to live through states of flux and times of insecurity. I work 60 hours a week during peak season as a quality control manager for industrial agriculture. And no, of course all of my projects don't go smoothly, but I have very little overhead and would never compare my work to a brick-and-mortar shop.

I was only pointing out that I'm not some incompetent who can't learn how to use tools. I have some confidence in my capabilities. I don't think that's a bad thing.

-Gregory
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Old 07-09-19, 06:42 PM
  #71  
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The best takeaway here is that you shouldn't have been "confounded" by both the price and timeframe for the service. Nothing wrong with learning that. No argument about the value of labor necessary.

It's not like bike shops are high profit businesses.

Some pay the price happily. Some gasp and then invest in tools, which can often be purchased from the same shop. Or not.

Whatever you decide to do is a choice, and it's great to have options available.

All is good.
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Old 07-09-19, 06:54 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by BFisher View Post
The best takeaway here is that you shouldn't have been "confounded" by both the price and timeframe for the service. Nothing wrong with learning that. No argument about the value of labor necessary.
My father has been an agricultural mechanic for most of his life. I work in an stone fruit packing facility with extremely experienced technicians who can fix all of the heavy duty industrial equipment that these plants are equipped with to pack hundreds of millions of dollars of produce each year. And they're required to make massive repairs right in the middle of a shift while hundreds of employees wait to get back to work.

These men make about $20-30 per hour average in this region (the San Joaquin Valley).

I think I have every right to make an argument about the value of labor in a case like this. Sure, a bicycle shop has plenty of overhead compared to an industrial mechanic, but they also have two or three technicians working on different orders at the same time, accumulating to perhaps two hundred dollars or more per hour. To tinker on bicycles! I do think it's bull, honestly.

More power to them, of course, but I've decided to do it myself instead.

-Gregory

Last edited by Kilroy1988; 07-09-19 at 06:59 PM.
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Old 07-09-19, 06:59 PM
  #73  
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But it solves nothing and your bike is still broken.

Good luck with your repairs.

Happy riding.
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Old 07-09-19, 07:01 PM
  #74  
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You are a good craftsman, as your flickr stream shows. Do you charge for your skill? If so, you would know that your rates sometimes seem strange to your clients. Pricing your labor can be tricky, and there will always be clients who think your figuring is off. And you'll know you're right, especially if you keep getting business.
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Old 07-09-19, 07:06 PM
  #75  
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I really don't mean to come off as being offensive here, and in fact a lot of the responses have echoed some or most of my sentiments. I understand I'm treading on sacred ground given the forum where the discussion is taking place, and mean no slight to bicycle mechanics in general.

@noglider I do such work as a hobby and with whimsy. I have some clients who I low ball my quotes for in order to make something I would actually like to make, and sometimes I ask much more because I'm not particularly in the mood to make what's being asked for. Above all, I need to be having fun while doing the work and I have never expected to make a living wage at such things. I'll be the first to admit that I don't have the tenacity or patience for it. So whatever comments I could make about the prices of my handiwork (which can sometimes reach into four figures but might still break down to less than minimum wage) would not be applicable to the labor arguments presented here.

I much prefer to be a hard-working employee with a reliable source of income.

@BFisher If I'd known what I'd be charged (definitely should have called first) then I'm pretty sure I would have ordered the tools straight away and had them in hand well before the two weeks went by. Perhaps my bicycle wouldn't be broken so long after all... In this particular case I'm still gathering components anyway and won't be riding for months, so it's a moot point!

-Gregory

Last edited by Kilroy1988; 07-09-19 at 07:14 PM.
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