Stiffening Touring Shoes?
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Concord, NC
Posts: 699
Bikes: 1984 Bianchi Tipo Corsa, 1985 Cannondale SM600 (24/26)
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 235 Post(s)
Liked 349 Times
in
190 Posts
Stiffening Touring Shoes?
I have been using my old Avocet Mod 20s "forever". I've loved everything about them for decades. Lately, I seem to be getting some cramping in the sole of my right foot and (maybe my imagination?) I seem to be able to "feel" the pedal pressure more (Campy Records). I was thinking of some type of insert. Any type of insoles I've seen are designed to cushion - not stiffen as would seem to be what I need. Has anyone had a similar issue with Vintage cycling shoes? Have you found some type of stiffening insert that works? I really don't want to replace these shoes because everything else about them rules!
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 2,107
Bikes: Trek 800 x 2, Schwinn Heavy Duti, Schwinn Traveler, Schwinn Le Tour Luxe, Schwinn Continental, Cannondale M400 and Lambert, Schwinn Super Sport
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 809 Post(s)
Liked 1,018 Times
in
664 Posts
I work with circuit boards. A .020" circuit board would work well. I have been temped to do this with my street shoes. Just trace the insole and place it in the shoe, then put the insole back on top. I haven't tried it yet.
You might be able to get some material from DigiKey. They have .031" material. You might also find it on Amazon and other suppliers. The copper is anti bacterial. That could be a bonus. Try a search for .031" copper clad pcb material.
You might be able to get some material from DigiKey. They have .031" material. You might also find it on Amazon and other suppliers. The copper is anti bacterial. That could be a bonus. Try a search for .031" copper clad pcb material.
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Posts: 27,547
Mentioned: 217 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18349 Post(s)
Liked 4,502 Times
in
3,346 Posts
I thought the typical circuit boards were rather brittle. Are there boards that aren't brittle?
I have a Specialized SPD type shoe around somewhere where the cleat plate (half the insole) cracked. I've thought about trying ABS plastic to replace it. ABS should be fairly pliable and easy to shape with moderate heat.
I have a Specialized SPD type shoe around somewhere where the cleat plate (half the insole) cracked. I've thought about trying ABS plastic to replace it. ABS should be fairly pliable and easy to shape with moderate heat.
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Concord, NC
Posts: 699
Bikes: 1984 Bianchi Tipo Corsa, 1985 Cannondale SM600 (24/26)
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 235 Post(s)
Liked 349 Times
in
190 Posts
Thanks, good suggestions; maybe I should do some trial and error fabrication.
#5
Me duelen las nalgas
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,513
Bikes: Centurion Ironman, Trek 5900, Univega Via Carisma, Globe Carmel
Mentioned: 199 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4559 Post(s)
Liked 2,802 Times
in
1,800 Posts
Different pedals? Unless you prefer period and style appropriate quill or other pedals.
Also, check out Profoot Miracle insoles. Only $8-$10, best insoles I've ever used. And with foot problems since I was a kid, I've tried 'em all, including custom made orthotics. The Profoot Miracles are the best. Thin to fit even snug-fitting shoes, ultra-lightweight yet dense and resilient foam, not gel. I have 'em in my Scott and Fizik shoes and bought extras in case Walgreens doesn't have 'em next time I need a set. They're good for at least a year. Prevents hotspots in my metatarsals and reduces arch cramps.
On my hybrids without clipless pedals/shoes, I found larger platform pedals relieved cramps in my arches. Spreads out more of the effort so I could ride with almost any reasonable shoe, even some deck shoes with thin soft rubber.
And looking back at my Strava logs, I'm not much faster now in the two years since going clipless than I was using platform pedals on my road bike. Different technique, maybe a little beneficial over longer rides with hills. I actually do pull up a bit on the pedals for climbs.
Same years ago when I switched from platform pedals to toe clips and cleated Detto Pietros. Didn't really add any power or speed. Just made it a bit more efficient over 50-100 mile rides.
Also, check out Profoot Miracle insoles. Only $8-$10, best insoles I've ever used. And with foot problems since I was a kid, I've tried 'em all, including custom made orthotics. The Profoot Miracles are the best. Thin to fit even snug-fitting shoes, ultra-lightweight yet dense and resilient foam, not gel. I have 'em in my Scott and Fizik shoes and bought extras in case Walgreens doesn't have 'em next time I need a set. They're good for at least a year. Prevents hotspots in my metatarsals and reduces arch cramps.
On my hybrids without clipless pedals/shoes, I found larger platform pedals relieved cramps in my arches. Spreads out more of the effort so I could ride with almost any reasonable shoe, even some deck shoes with thin soft rubber.
And looking back at my Strava logs, I'm not much faster now in the two years since going clipless than I was using platform pedals on my road bike. Different technique, maybe a little beneficial over longer rides with hills. I actually do pull up a bit on the pedals for climbs.
Same years ago when I switched from platform pedals to toe clips and cleated Detto Pietros. Didn't really add any power or speed. Just made it a bit more efficient over 50-100 mile rides.
#6
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Seattle
Posts: 147
Bikes: Masi Gran Criterium, Derosa, Ron Cooper, Davidson, Miyata 912, Le Jeune, Klein Rascals, AMP Research B3, B4, B5, PX10,Holdsworth, Schwinn Paramount, Frejus, Erickson, Simoncini SLX, Cecil Walker
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 54 Post(s)
Liked 115 Times
in
52 Posts
i actually tried making thin hardwood plywood insoles to stiffen. couldn't get them in the shoes because they don't flex. only way they would go in is if i trimmed them down and that would be unpleasant inside the shoe. I need to find just the right plastic i think.
Likes For Salamandrine:
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 2,107
Bikes: Trek 800 x 2, Schwinn Heavy Duti, Schwinn Traveler, Schwinn Le Tour Luxe, Schwinn Continental, Cannondale M400 and Lambert, Schwinn Super Sport
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 809 Post(s)
Liked 1,018 Times
in
664 Posts
This is why my first recommendation was for .020" thick board. It is flexible enough to work. .031" should still be flexible enough to work. It might be stiff to walk in. I'm not sure about that.
Perhaps if if you don't have access to thin pcb material, try the other suggestions first.
perhaps I need to try out the pcb material in my street shoes and report back.
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA
Posts: 1,257
Bikes: 2017 Salsa Carbon Mukluk frame built with XT, 2018 Kona Rove NRB build with Sram Apex 1,2008 Salsa El Mariachi, 1986 Centurion Ironman
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 286 Post(s)
Liked 100 Times
in
65 Posts
I've thought about something like this
https://steelflex.com/products/soleg...oles-by-stlflx
For riding my fat bike with my mukluks. Looks like it could work for you.
For riding my fat bike with my mukluks. Looks like it could work for you.
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 3,681
Bikes: Puch Marco Polo, Saint Tropez, Masi Gran Criterium
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1163 Post(s)
Liked 441 Times
in
314 Posts
I work with circuit boards. A .020" circuit board would work well. I have been temped to do this with my street shoes. Just trace the insole and place it in the shoe, then put the insole back on top. I haven't tried it yet.
You might be able to get some material from DigiKey. They have .031" material. You might also find it on Amazon and other suppliers. The copper is anti bacterial. That could be a bonus. Try a search for .031" copper clad pcb material.
You might be able to get some material from DigiKey. They have .031" material. You might also find it on Amazon and other suppliers. The copper is anti bacterial. That could be a bonus. Try a search for .031" copper clad pcb material.
Also, how do you cut it? With a cut-off wheel? Do you glue it to the bottom of your insole?
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 2,107
Bikes: Trek 800 x 2, Schwinn Heavy Duti, Schwinn Traveler, Schwinn Le Tour Luxe, Schwinn Continental, Cannondale M400 and Lambert, Schwinn Super Sport
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 809 Post(s)
Liked 1,018 Times
in
664 Posts
At .020" thick, you can use tinsnips. At .030" a Dremel with a cut-off wheel might be better (dust mask required). I would cut it to fit the entire insole. If needed later on some more material can be added under the ball of the foot.
#12
Extraordinary Magnitude
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waukesha WI
Posts: 13,641
Bikes: 1978 Trek TX700; 1978/79 Trek 736; 1984 Specialized Stumpjumper Sport; 1984 Schwinn Voyageur SP; 1985 Trek 620; 1985 Trek 720; 1986 Trek 400 Elance; 1987 Schwinn High Sierra; 1990 Miyata 1000LT
Mentioned: 84 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2607 Post(s)
Liked 1,694 Times
in
933 Posts
I had a set of Cannondale shoes- they had what looked like a wood insole in them and then a separate foam insole to go over that.
__________________
*Recipient of the 2006 Time Magazine "Person Of The Year" Award*
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
#13
Senior Member
No one has said it but I will.
BUY SOME NEW SHOES.
Really, do it. There are a lot of great options out there right now (unlike 5-10 years ago).
BUY SOME NEW SHOES.
Really, do it. There are a lot of great options out there right now (unlike 5-10 years ago).
Likes For Bad Lag:
Likes For Bianchi84:
#15
aka: Dr. Cannondale
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 7,724
Mentioned: 234 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2152 Post(s)
Liked 3,401 Times
in
1,203 Posts
Try Kydex, maybe 1/8". Flexible but not too flexible. Easy to cut with tin snips. Can be heated and shaped if needed to fit into the shoe.
Takes a lickin' and keeps on tickin'.
Takes a lickin' and keeps on tickin'.
__________________
Hard at work in the Secret Underground Laboratory...
Hard at work in the Secret Underground Laboratory...
Last edited by rccardr; 08-29-19 at 08:08 PM.
#16
aged to perfection
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: PacNW
Posts: 1,801
Bikes: Dinucci Allez 2.0, Richard Sachs, Alex Singer, Serotta, Masi GC, Raleigh Pro Mk.1, Hetchins, etc
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 829 Post(s)
Liked 1,240 Times
in
655 Posts
so you could get some hard plastic orthotic inserts. I have these in my cycling shoes. They are custom made. I think they cost about $400 bucks.
they really help !
Mark Petry
Bainbridge Island, WA USA
they really help !
Mark Petry
Bainbridge Island, WA USA
#17
climber has-been
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Palo Alto, CA
Posts: 7,080
Bikes: Scott Addict R1, Felt Z1
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3405 Post(s)
Liked 3,535 Times
in
1,778 Posts
How much are you willing to spend on a stiff insole?
If the answer is “plenty”, then consider the Solestar BLK. Carbon fiber from heel to toe.
Review here
If the answer is “plenty”, then consider the Solestar BLK. Carbon fiber from heel to toe.
Review here
#18
señor miembro
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Pac NW
Posts: 6,597
Bikes: '70s - '80s Campagnolo
Mentioned: 92 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3860 Post(s)
Liked 6,450 Times
in
3,190 Posts
Hard to believe there's not a $10 cut-to-fit solution out there.
#19
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Posts: 27,547
Mentioned: 217 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18349 Post(s)
Liked 4,502 Times
in
3,346 Posts
My guess it is a fairly narrow market.
Nobody will do anything custom for 30 year old shoes.
There might be some market for stiffening non-cycling shoes for use with flats. But, since cycling shoes can also be used with flats, there would be no big need to do it.
And, for cycling shoes, one likely chooses the shoes with the desired characteristics.
Nobody will do anything custom for 30 year old shoes.
There might be some market for stiffening non-cycling shoes for use with flats. But, since cycling shoes can also be used with flats, there would be no big need to do it.
And, for cycling shoes, one likely chooses the shoes with the desired characteristics.
#20
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,321
Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 767 Post(s)
Liked 1,898 Times
in
889 Posts
How much are you willing to spend on a stiff insole?
If the answer is “plenty”, then consider the Solestar BLK. Carbon fiber from heel to toe.
Review here
If the answer is “plenty”, then consider the Solestar BLK. Carbon fiber from heel to toe.
Review here
The insoles clearly need to be made from a high grade chrome-moly or manganese-molybdenum alloy steel!
In all seriousness, I'm a pretty thrifty guy, but even I would bite the bullet and buy some new shoes. New shoe day is, after all, usually a good day.
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,693
Bikes: 82 Medici, 2011 Richard Sachs, 2011 Milwaukee Road
Mentioned: 55 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1946 Post(s)
Liked 2,004 Times
in
1,105 Posts
I used some Kydex to stiffen my Vans thinking they might be the ticket for toe clip shoes. There was not enough height in the shoe for the 1/8 inch kydex insole and my foot was cramped. If I find a wide shoe with room for them, I still have the kydex onsoles. Kydex can be purchased on eBay for about $10 for two 12x12 inch sheets. Try it. Before that I tried 1/8 inch plexiglass and it broke after about 35 miles.
to the op: will your feet bother you on any ride, or only the longer slow ones? I find that my feet will be bothered if I just cruise.
to the op: will your feet bother you on any ride, or only the longer slow ones? I find that my feet will be bothered if I just cruise.
#22
Extraordinary Magnitude
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waukesha WI
Posts: 13,641
Bikes: 1978 Trek TX700; 1978/79 Trek 736; 1984 Specialized Stumpjumper Sport; 1984 Schwinn Voyageur SP; 1985 Trek 620; 1985 Trek 720; 1986 Trek 400 Elance; 1987 Schwinn High Sierra; 1990 Miyata 1000LT
Mentioned: 84 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2607 Post(s)
Liked 1,694 Times
in
933 Posts
I wish I could find some of the old 5-10 Dirtbags in my size.
__________________
*Recipient of the 2006 Time Magazine "Person Of The Year" Award*
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!
"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
#23
Senior Member
Personally, I prefer a steel shank in the sole instead of any of the plastics or fiber composites mentioned.
#24
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Concord, NC
Posts: 699
Bikes: 1984 Bianchi Tipo Corsa, 1985 Cannondale SM600 (24/26)
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 235 Post(s)
Liked 349 Times
in
190 Posts
I used some Kydex to stiffen my Vans thinking they might be the ticket for toe clip shoes. There was not enough height in the shoe for the 1/8 inch kydex insole and my foot was cramped. If I find a wide shoe with room for them, I still have the kydex onsoles. Kydex can be purchased on eBay for about $10 for two 12x12 inch sheets. Try it. Before that I tried 1/8 inch plexiglass and it broke after about 35 miles.
to the op: will your feet bother you on any ride, or only the longer slow ones? I find that my feet will be bothered if I just cruise.
to the op: will your feet bother you on any ride, or only the longer slow ones? I find that my feet will be bothered if I just cruise.
#25
feros ferio
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: www.ci.encinitas.ca.us
Posts: 21,793
Bikes: 1959 Capo Modell Campagnolo; 1960 Capo Sieger (2); 1962 Carlton Franco Suisse; 1970 Peugeot UO-8; 1982 Bianchi Campione d'Italia; 1988 Schwinn Project KOM-10;
Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1390 Post(s)
Liked 1,322 Times
in
835 Posts
This thread certainly makes me miss my old Avocet Touring and Touring II shoes, which are still my favorites among all I have ever owned, although my Giro Rumble VRs come pretty close.
__________________
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069