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C&V Resuscitation: Rust, Paint & Chrome

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C&V Resuscitation: Rust, Paint & Chrome

Old 11-28-19, 12:54 PM
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deux jambes 
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C&V Resuscitation: Rust, Paint & Chrome





Both of the above definitions of the word seem appropriate here.

A classic & vintage frame/fork exhibiting a certain amount of neglect as it appears itíd been ridden hard & put away wet. Itís in a certain state of deterioration, yet absolutely worthy of receiving a good dose of love & attention so that it may ride again for years to come.

The main issue at hand is rust. From minor oxidation just on the surface, to somewhat deep, pitted, bubbling, flakey cancer. Damaged paint & chrome being both a cause & a consequence.

Speaking of chrome... the Benotto 3000 would have come with a fully chromed fork. I believe this fork is original, but it appears to have been painted at some point in time as evidenced by paint runs & areas of bright chrome showing through in places.

Fortunately, the rust seems to live primarily on the exterior. Looking down into the tubes with a light, and peering into the bb shell, all looks well. The tubes ring out nicely with a bright ping when flicked. And to the naked eye, the lug joints seem to be without compromise (a bit of poking/prodding may or may not tell a different story).

Iíve read up a bit on different approaches to arresting rust. Common materials/methods seem to be oxylic acid, Naval Jelly, Evaporust, vinegar... Coca-Cola even! I see frames submerged in solution & I see spots treated piecemeal with a wet wrap. And of course thereís media blasting.

So whatís the best way to tackle a job like this? Opinions will vary, and my only clear, personal answer so far is, ďI donít know.Ē

But letís look at the situation. Iím on a strict & very low budget (more time than money). I live in tight quarters which offer no practical outdoor work space. I have concerns for my own health & for that of the environment. Iím also not sure yet if this frame/fork will see a full on restoration which includes a respray, decals & rechrome... OR if an honest preservation which includes patina, and battle scars might be the right course of action.

Presently, Iíd rather build & ride the bike sooner than later. That means that ďshowroomĒ paint & chrome are not an option at this time. And that means that while I have to start somewhere, Iíll have to start NOW & with what I have on hand.

If my first chosen approach to the rust, paint & chrome proves not ineffective then Iíll step things up until I achieve the results Iím looking for. Right now Iím looking to ďkillĒ the rust. And Iím looking to strip the silver paint from the fork & bring some bright shine back to itís underlying chrome. Iíd like to retain as much of the frameís paint & patina as possible, keep as many decals as I can, and cover any bare steel with a rust preventative substance. If aspirations are raised in the future & time/money allows it, I can always strive towards a higher level of restoration. In the meantime... Iíll be more than happy with a ďrider.Ē

So hereís the thread where Iíll document my efforts to resuscitate this frame & fork set. And hereís where Iíll look forward to reading your overall comments of feedback & observation should they surface.

And finally, hereís the initial ďbeforeĒ pics:

Last edited by deux jambes; 11-28-19 at 04:05 PM.
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Old 11-28-19, 12:57 PM
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Old 11-28-19, 02:20 PM
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I trust Evaporust.
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Old 11-28-19, 02:35 PM
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That’s the condition of the Lemond frame I have on my bike trainer!
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Old 11-28-19, 03:55 PM
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Evaporust - wire brush treat till you are satisfied - spot prime, mask and be done with it till you have mo' money.

the trouble is you basically wrote you have no place to paint.

if mine I would chemically strip it, aircraft type danger to all chem warfare
with proper protection- glasses, respirator, correct gloves, maybe even at a park near running water faucet.

This because you stated you might want to restore the chrome.

bike has btw the sought after diamond cross section chainstays.
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Old 11-28-19, 05:09 PM
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I remember that frame. It has made the rounds on BF. What I thought in the beginning still holds, there is no where to go but up!

My .02, do a physical strip first then see what you really have to work with.
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Old 11-28-19, 06:28 PM
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Does anyone near Eugene have a running oxalic acid bath the young man can use? Surely someone has space and needs a six pack...
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Old 11-28-19, 06:35 PM
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With minimal money, I'd just run it as it sits, rat rod style, build it up and ride it, there isn't a bicycle on earth that was bummed somebody climbed on it and turned the cranks!


With more money, I would get it media blasted and powder coated.
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Old 11-28-19, 06:42 PM
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Does anyone near Eugene have a running oxalic acid bath the young man can use? Surely someone has space and needs a six pack...

I was about to do the same thing for a frame when the weather here changed for the worse. I was planning on buying a used kiddie pool but buying a tarp, folding it to allow it to hold a large puddle of liquid, adding water and oxalic acid and frame/forks and then letting it sit covered and undisturbed for a few days might work just as well. All you'd need then would be a space and a bit of time.
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Old 11-28-19, 08:47 PM
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deux jambes

Minimal funding = elbow grease, Turtle Wax rust remover and chrome polish and scotch brite.

Slather it on the bad spots and let it soak in, sit, slather again and scrub with the pads, also slathered, repeat as necessary, may be several times. if the first tries are weak let it sit and soak longer, even overnite.

Depending on how bad, this will remove most/a lot of the rust so you can see, if it takes it all off you can prime or touch up those spots for now while you figure out what to do with the really bad. It will usually get it down to where it can be sanded out the rest of the way.

A drill with a wire wheel would also be a great help if you have or can borrow one.

Evaporust also makes a gel that works ok but is spendy, regular liquid with rag wrap in a garbage bag should work pretty good once you get the top layers off with the remover and elbow grease.

Last edited by merziac; 11-28-19 at 08:52 PM.
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Old 11-28-19, 10:07 PM
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deux jambes,
Nice frame. What are you thinking for the build. I may be able to assist if you need anything I have laying around. It's a karma thing just cover postage.

: Mike
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Old 11-28-19, 10:09 PM
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Barkeepers’ Friend is primarily OA and is easy to apply with a scotch bright pad on the worst of those rusted areas.
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Old 11-28-19, 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by nlerner View Post
Thatís the condition of the Lemond frame I have on my bike trainer!
Is the Lemondís condition why youíve appointed it as a trainer? And/or have you considered doctoring it up any?

ó ó ó

Originally Posted by 3speedslow View Post
I remember that frame. It has made the rounds on BF. What I thought in the beginning still holds, there is no where to go but up!

My .02, do a physical strip first then see what you really have to work with.
What!? So this frame has been passed around C&V like a thanksgiving dinner?I canít seem to find it in any older threads.

I was told that itís second to last owner had been a team mechanic. Whatever the case may be, Iíd like to be the one finally responsible for upgrading its status from ďbike parts,Ē to ďa bike!Ē

I agree with your .02 btw. Tomorrow Iím going to begin phase 1 by exploring it a bit with the dull blade of a pocket knife.

ó ó ó

merziac sounds like good advice as usual. Iíve got piles of elbow grease I can spend on this project!

I keep envisioning classic cars in progress where the slow, laborious job of body & fender work is evident by spot primed sections of panels. Not necessarily in a paint shop, but rather rolling down the road!
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Old 11-28-19, 10:44 PM
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Curious about this thread because I'm in the same boat with my Superior. Lots (and lots) of small nicks and a little bit of surface rust.

I've been diligently cleaning and waxing, but I would like to address the rust and bare metal. A repaint is out of the question, so I'm wresting with methodically going over the frame spot-by-spot. More concerned about preservation than looks at this point.
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Old 11-29-19, 06:18 AM
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nlerner
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Originally Posted by deux jambes View Post
Is the Lemondís condition why youíve appointed it as a trainer? And/or have you considered doctoring it up any?
Yes, I have another Lemond thatís a regular rider, so this one is ideal to be a dedicated trainer bike (and itís a bit lower-end model than the one in the regular fleet). I havenít done anything to deal with the rust, but it lives in a dry environment, so I donít expect it to get much worse.
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Old 11-29-19, 07:18 AM
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I have heard that the easiest way, still decent to nature, wallet and body is wire brush, toothbrushes and barkeepers friend. Haven't tried the barkeepers friend on chrome parts yet however.
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Old 11-29-19, 07:50 AM
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This approach takes more time, but it is compact, and not too costly:


Wallpaper pan $3, 1 gallon Evapo-rust ~$20. The seat tube needs to be dealt with using a different method, but the rest of the frame can be submerged. I used jars of water to raise the bath level. Stones in a plastic bag would work too. I've done two frames this way using the same gallon. White decals were slightly yellowed on the 2nd frame, however. Perhaps this wouldn't happen with fresh E-R.

Last edited by Schreck83; 11-29-19 at 07:54 AM.
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Old 11-29-19, 07:56 AM
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Sandpaper and steel wool to knock off the rust. A cheap can of primer from Wal-Mart is a couple bucks. A few quick blips of the can over the bare steel spots to protect it.
or for the patina look maybe oil or wax.
throw parts on
ride

Last edited by norcalmike; 11-29-19 at 08:03 AM.
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Old 11-29-19, 08:28 AM
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I've got a bunch of beater beach cruisers that are going back into service next year. I'm going to try knocking knocking off the looses stuff, then treating with Ospho, clear coating with Penetrol and then waxing. I figure a year or two back at the beach will be dog years as far as a durability test.
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Old 11-29-19, 10:25 AM
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deux jambes

My poor choice of phrase! I think, if I recall correctly, seeing this frame for sale some time ago. Better put I Hope!

thinktubes

Must show pic of your Superior when you talk about it! ( My Rule...)
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Old 11-29-19, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Nemosengineer View Post
deux jambes,
Nice frame. What are you thinking for the build. I may be able to assist if you need anything I have laying around. It's a karma thing just cover postage.

: Mike
Thank you! Fast, light, and 1984ish period correct is the basic outlying plan. Also, your kind gesture has been met with a PM.

Cheers!
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Old 11-29-19, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by thinktubes View Post
Curious about this thread because I'm in the same boat with my Superior. Lots (and lots) of small nicks and a little bit of surface rust.

I've been diligently cleaning and waxing, but I would like to address the rust and bare metal. A repaint is out of the question, so I'm wresting with methodically going over the frame spot-by-spot. More concerned about preservation than looks at this point.
Safe to say that weíll both be learning here, and thatíd be to the benefit of a couple frames in need? A perfect example of why this forum absolutely ROCKS!

Good luck with your endeavors. I hope to see the Superior posted sometime!
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Old 11-29-19, 11:43 AM
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The fastest and cheapest way to get that back on the road, Powdercoat. I ve had frames sandblasted and powdercoated for $50 to $70. Luckily for you, the Benotto is just one single color. You MUST make sure the Powdercoater knows to go thin in the Pantograph areas as they will sometimes cover up the Panto. The color choices available nowadays are broad, you can get some cool bright silver colors and make that Benotto POP..

The fork, back to the Chromer. All the time and effort involved in getting it to look good will never add up to what a chromer can do. Shop around and you might find a spot for under $100.

Do the math, $150 to $170 for a old bike that looks New is a very inexpensive.

This powdercoat on the Guerciotti cost $60.

Last edited by Manny66; 11-29-19 at 11:46 AM.
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Old 11-29-19, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by deux jambes View Post
Safe to say that weíll both be learning here, and thatíd be to the benefit of a couple frames in need? A perfect example of why this forum absolutely ROCKS!

Good luck with your endeavors. I hope to see the Superior posted sometime!

Here's a post that shows the frame in all its glory. Probably, beyond a simple "touch-up", but not interested in a repaint.
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Old 11-29-19, 01:40 PM
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I work on bikes like yours all the time for the bike exchange. Unless you have a painter custom color some paint for you you will not be able to blend the rusted areas in to your existing paint. When you have bubbling , crusted rust spots the best thing to do is scrape the rust off with a blade. A single edged razor blade , often bought is packs of ten or more, is scraped sideways over the rust and will take all the scale off. wire brushing will remove loose rust but will just burnish the scale. After scraping as much rust off as you can with the blade, take a small brush or q tip and heavily coat the areas with naval jelly. Use rubber gloves . Don't worry to much if you get some on your skin, just wash off immediately with water. Let the naval jelly sit for 15 or 20 minutes then put in the shower and rinse. This should take care of the rust. If necessary repeat the scrapping then sanding then naval jelly .



Sometimes when I have a frame with lots of small nicks and surface rust in/ on the paint I will brush naval jelly on the entire frame. This can do wonders. after treating all the rust I would use white polishing compound and rub out the whole frame with it. This will get rid of lots of minor blemishes that have been ground into the paint. Now you can slot prime the rust spots with a self etching primer and then carefully paint the spots with a color of your choosing. With dark colors, black is usually less noticeable than trying to match the original color. finally, if you can set the frame up out doors or in a garage, set up a table or hang the bike from the ceiling and spray it with rustolium clear Automotive enamel. You will be surprised how good it will look. If you are worried about doing this indoors, Years ago a room mate painted an entire car in our living room ( body panels removed from old MGA) with 20 spray cans. covering the floor and walls with plastic. first. Throw down a 7 x 11 ft tarp and you could spray the bike without anyone noticing . you are going to be using less than one spray can of clear . Any other color could lead to disaster so just spray the clear.

Last edited by capnjonny; 11-29-19 at 01:46 PM.
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