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Roadside Fresh Mystery Frame

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Roadside Fresh Mystery Frame

Old 12-19-19, 07:40 AM
  #1  
velomateo
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Roadside Fresh Mystery Frame

Finishing up a ride on a local loop yesterday, I passed a pile of junk illegally dumped on the roadside of an open area...several bike frames and a large box. Curiosity got the best of me, and I had to stop and check the one frame that wasnít a kids bike. At first glance it looks like it was a victim of the fixed gear craze, bad rattle-can paint job and straight bars. When I picked it up I notice the top of the seat tube was damaged, but that it was also something nice. I snapped a few pics of the details to search it later, set it down and rode off. About a quarter mile away, it was eating at me that it would probably get picked up by one of the many scrappers that patrol the town - and it would get crushed. I just couldnít live with that, so I hammered home, got in my car and drove back and picked it up.

The first maker that came to my mind was Olmo, due to the lug style. I did find pics of an old Olmo Gran Sport, that is very similar. Can anyone confirm? Head tube has holes for a missing head badge, 70 mm bottom bracket. Measure 56x56 ctc (which is another reason I went back for it)🙂. The one remaining fixed cup is Campagnolo, and the dropouts are probably Campy as well, I havenít verified it yet.







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Old 12-19-19, 07:50 AM
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Old 12-19-19, 08:14 AM
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No doubt Italian.
i would probably sleeve the seat tube as Cinelli did. Go to a 26.2 or 26.4 seatpost.
the headset I think is an early Campagnolo unit. So, a good economic save.
the only item that pushes it later than earlier for me is the bottom bracket shell- correct style but chainstay sockets... ?
57? 58cm center to top of top tube less collar extension?
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Old 12-19-19, 08:15 AM
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Check for head tube badge holes
minir chance it is an Ideor
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Old 12-19-19, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by repechage View Post
Check for head tube badge holes
minir chance it is an Ideor
It has holes for a head badge. Sorry I didnít photograph how theyíre configured, but I think two, vertically.
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Old 12-19-19, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by repechage View Post
No doubt Italian.
i would probably sleeve the seat tube as Cinelli did. Go to a 26.2 or 26.4 seatpost.
the headset I think is an early Campagnolo unit. So, a good economic save.
the only item that pushes it later than earlier for me is the bottom bracket shell- correct style but chainstay sockets... ?
57? 58cm center to top of top tube less collar extension?
I didn’t measure to the top, but it’s 56 ctc. Win!

I wouldn’t expect to repair the seat tube sleeve to be that complicated. I wasn’t sure of the size though, 26.2 - 26.4 sounds about right.

The cable stops were confusing to me as well. I would expect clamp-on style, but possibly a transitional year.
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Old 12-19-19, 08:46 AM
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Nice score! Definitely worth reviving IMO.
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Old 12-19-19, 08:47 AM
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@repechage I did a search for Ideor and I think you may have nailed it.
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Old 12-19-19, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Hudson308 View Post
Nice score! Definitely worth reviving IMO.
I think it would make a classy townie. Iím thinking Brooks, fenders, Milan bars.
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Old 12-19-19, 09:27 AM
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I would be sure I had a solution for the seat tube/ seat post before doing much else but it would be a cool save if you can resolve that
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Old 12-19-19, 09:28 AM
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-----

The Magistroni fixed cup tells us it began life as one of the midline models.

The top four Ideor models employed the same Columbus DB frameset; differing only in their kitting.

No seat tube sleeve is present; that is the end of the seat tube seen in the photo.

Kitting:

Magistroni-Ideor chainset

Campag GS gear ensemble

MAFAC brakes

Ambrosio Champion stem/bar set

Sheffield pedals

Campag Record hubs

plain steel saddle pillar

Italia leather saddle with Italia clip

FIAMME red label tubular rims

Magistroni-Ideor forged seat binder collar

two sizes of head emblem were employed depending on frame size
this frame would have received the larger one

-----
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Old 12-19-19, 09:28 AM
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Italian for sure and to me the slots in the fork crown and head lugs say "Ideor." The top of the seat tube will need some kind of repair before it's not in danger of breaking off.
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Old 12-19-19, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Feldman View Post
Italian for sure and to me the slots in the fork crown and head lugs say "Ideor." The top of the seat tube will need some kind of repair before it's not in danger of breaking off.
Of course the seat tube will need addressing before anything else. Just off hand, I donít see it being that complicated or expensive, but Iíll need to make some inquiries.
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Old 12-19-19, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by juvela View Post
-----

The Magistroni fixed cup tells us it began life as one of the midline models.

The top four Ideor models employed the same Columbus DB frameset; differing only in their kitting.

No seat tube sleeve is present; that is the end of the seat tube seen in the photo.

Kitting:

Magistroni-Ideor chainset

Campag GS gear ensemble

MAFAC brakes

Ambrosio Champion stem/bar set

Sheffield pedals

Campag Record hubs

plain steel saddle pillar

Italia leather saddle with Italia clip

FIAMME red label tubular rims

Magistroni-Ideor forged seat binder collar

two sizes of head emblem were employed depending on frame size
this frame would have received the larger one

-----
Lots of
great info there, thanks.

Several Olmo seat clamps, for similar style seat stay configs on eBay right now. Do you think these would be the same size as what was original to this frame?
Wonít be looking to put this back to 100% original condition, just functioning and somewhat period.

Last edited by velomateo; 12-19-19 at 09:48 AM.
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Old 12-19-19, 10:30 AM
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https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/...034079966.html


address of a butchered Ideor for sale, someone cut off the brazed on shifter bosses to fit a cable stop clamp for bar end controls... a drew before the fixie craze.
note the top tube cable stops are the same too.
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Old 12-19-19, 10:43 AM
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-----

The generic Italian seat binder collars will fit fine.

They are produced of stamped sheet rather than forged like the machine's original.

Two common patterns are the interlocking rings and a greco zig-zag.

I would not fit a collar bearing the name of a differing marque...but then it is your project.






---

The frame's bottom bracket cable guides and the chain stay stop may be post-manufacture additions.

Shift lever bosses and top tube housing stops are OEM.


-----

Last edited by juvela; 12-20-19 at 03:33 PM. Reason: add images
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Old 12-19-19, 10:44 AM
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Quill seatpost
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Old 12-19-19, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by thinktubes View Post
Quill seatpost
Thatís an excellent idea.
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Old 12-19-19, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by thinktubes View Post
Quill seatpost
on the Ideors I am aware they used a 26.8
I was suggesting a sleeve to be silver soldiered in ( lower temp than bronze)
to keep everything happy
a quill post will solve one issue but the top 20 mm will still have a slot- no lateral strength. A collar clamp would help- as it needs renovation why not solve the problem- money aside but hey it was free and the headset could be sold off to an eager eBay audience
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Old 12-19-19, 10:58 AM
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I've never seen a fixed cup like that one. It's interesting.

My 1980s bike with Dura Ace AX and my bike with Adamas AX both have the same locations for the cable guides.

When that frame gets stripped of the old paint and a nice new thin layer(s) paint applied, I think it'd be a great candidate for pinstriping the lugs.

Cheers
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Old 12-19-19, 11:06 AM
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I took these pic's earlier this(?) year of the early-60's Ideor that I found locally.

It's a repaint of course, so it's possible that changes could have been made.

The steering geometry isn't too steep on these, so presumably would be a good candidate for use as a townie. I'm keeping this one as is for now, as a functional rider.



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Old 12-19-19, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by repechage View Post
Check for head tube badge holes
minir chance it is an Ideor
Amazing.
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Old 12-19-19, 11:21 AM
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Man, I love when you all do this !
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Old 12-19-19, 11:32 AM
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Clean the inside of the post as well as you can and tap out the dents against a curved tube. Get an extremely thin steel tube that fits in there - 3" long at least - and have a framebuilder silver solder it in.

If the original seattube breaks off, cut another seattube, slide it down, and have it soldered over. Then cut the thin steel tube to the factory length, ream it out as much as you can without structurally compromising the repair, and install an undersized seatpost as a compromise (this is why you should aim for the thinnest steel tube in the first place instead of trying to ream three inches worth).

-Kurt
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Old 12-19-19, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by juvela View Post
-----

The generic Italian seat binder collars will fit fine.

They are produced of stamped sheet rather than forged like the machine's original.

Two common patterns are the interlocking rings and a greco zig-zag.

I would not fit a collar bearing the name of a differing marque...but then it is your project.

---

The frame's bottom bracket cable guides and the chain stay stop may be post-manufacture additions.

Shift lever bosses and top tube housing stops are OEM.


-----
looking again it has water bottle braze ons- those were added too.
Ideor was unusual as they went with braze on shifter points- especially at that time.
this could also be a good gravel bike.
50's Italian road geometry.
a guy in my old club had one.
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