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Headbadge re-mounting

Old 01-08-20, 02:38 PM
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krems81 
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Headbadge re-mounting

Hi Iíve had some vintage frames refinished and obviously had to remove the original rivets on the head badges.

To remount them itís been recommended to me that I get some self-starting screws from McMaster in a very small size.

There are a lot of options there though, and I could use some help figuring out which ones to order.

Any advice on this would be much appreciated.

Thanks!


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Old 01-08-20, 03:21 PM
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unterhausen
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This seems like a very C&V sort of question. Maybe someone from there will follow you in here or I can move this thread
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Old 01-08-20, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by unterhausen View Post
This seems like a very C&V sort of question. Maybe someone from there will follow you in here or I can move this thread
Sure. Thatís my usual home on the forums but I thought the real knowledge on this might be here. Happy to have it moved
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Old 01-08-20, 03:57 PM
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I'm sure the real expertise is here in C&V. Moved here from framebuilding
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Old 01-08-20, 04:24 PM
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Drive pins are the usual way to fasten the headbadge if it was done that way originally. Some headbadges used pop rivets these are also available in small sizes.

This is the link to drive pins on McMaster-Carr:

https://www.mcmaster.com/drive-pins
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Old 01-08-20, 06:12 PM
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Screws in thread sizes of 3 X.5 mm are available and should be easy enough to tap out on the frames. Next size up is 4 X.7 mm and the heads may be too bulky but if using stainless screws they can be ground down to an acceptable size head. HTH, MH
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Old 01-08-20, 06:31 PM
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I use small screws, as mentioned above, although I should try small pop rivets.
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Old 01-08-20, 06:32 PM
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CoRide59 has surplus drive screws in a few different sizes and was very generous to share. You should reach out to him.
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Old 01-08-20, 06:35 PM
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I have some small taps in sizes like 4-48 and 3-56 and like to tap and use short screws with loctite. Brass or stainless, flat or pan head depending on how it sits.
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Old 01-08-20, 06:50 PM
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Headbadge Mounting Method Using Brass Rivets
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Old 01-08-20, 06:53 PM
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I have 198 extra drive screws in sizes 00 and 0 that I bought from McMaster-Carr. I'm happy to put a few of each size in an envelope to you, just let me know. PM is fine.
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Old 01-08-20, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by John E View Post
I use small screws, as mentioned above, although I should try small pop rivets.
...using a standard pop rivet is problematic because the interior of the rivet projects far enough into the head tube to interfere with the steerer tube.
It would probably work if you could find some way to flatten the interior projecting stub. The space between these two tubes is pretty tight.
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Old 01-08-20, 07:25 PM
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I have quite a few extra 2-56 1/8Ē brass screws. Also willing to share.
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Old 01-08-20, 07:35 PM
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Drive screws, then set them (also deforms to clear the steerer with a solid rod inside the tube, or really really thick wall pipe.
A nail set with a concave head helps too, there are different sizes around.

Cinelli used screws, hard to find, as they are "countersunk with a slot and slight domed head- Think Sewing machine bobbin case leaf spring fasteners.
Those vary in size- Industrial machine, "Big Bobbin" machines.
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Old 01-08-20, 07:41 PM
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krems81-

Head badge rivets from Velo Heaven? Come in 3 different sizes: https://www.velo-heaven.co.uk/collec...d-badge-rivets

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Old 01-08-20, 10:28 PM
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Use a little bit of copper wire off an electrical house mains cable to form a rivet, using a chisel inside the tube as an anvil.Toffee hammer and careful blows.
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Old 01-09-20, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by 3alarmer View Post
...using a standard pop rivet is problematic because the interior of the rivet projects far enough into the head tube to interfere with the steerer tube.
It would probably work if you could find some way to flatten the interior projecting stub. The space between these two tubes is pretty tight.
I have used copper rivets in the past and just used a half round file to file them down inside the headtube after I had set the rivets.
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Old 01-09-20, 04:47 AM
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Old 01-09-20, 05:43 AM
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Really helpful compilation here, thanks!
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Old 01-09-20, 06:17 AM
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It can be tricky setting drive screws by hand. The body of the screw is supposed to be .001 to .002 over the size of the hole, so it has to be a perfect match. I think .002" might be a bit too tight for the harder steel used in bike frames. You would need a concave ended punch or the head of the drive screw will flatten. Then it's a 4 handed operation trying to line everything up and drive in the screw. I think you would be better off using a screw and tapped hole with lock tight or a rivet that clinches on the inside of the head tube.
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Old 01-09-20, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by BigChief View Post
It can be tricky setting drive screws by hand. The body of the screw is supposed to be .001 to .002 over the size of the hole, so it has to be a perfect match. I think .002" might be a bit too tight for the harder steel used in bike frames. You would need a concave ended punch or the head of the drive screw will flatten. Then it's a 4 handed operation trying to line everything up and drive in the screw. I think you would be better off using a screw and tapped hole with lock tight or a rivet that clinches on the inside of the head tube.
Yeah, I bought some from McMaster Carr, drilled to their spec, and when I tried to tap the screws in, I could see the head tube was starting to deform. I bailed and just stuck the badge on with silicone and glued on dummy brass heads.
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Old 01-09-20, 11:15 PM
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Ive used aluminum rivits a few times. I used to be an aircraft mechenic many years ago so riviting is something im very familiar with..

I ordered some small rivits from McMaster Carr, I cut the length down because too long of a rivit will interfere with the steerer fok tube. Theres not alot of clearance in the head tube so a small rivits work best. I made my own rivit set using a piece of small round stock. All I did was use a 1/4 drill bit to fit the size of the rivit head. I then used a piece of solid round stock that I had in my metal junk pile. I put it in a vise, I slid the steering tube over it, and I used the round stock as a bucking bar , A few small light taps on the head of the rivit and bingo!
I was concerned with slipping off the rivit head and damaging my headbadge , So far Ive been more lucky than good.

Maybe if I get some time I can go take pictures of how Ive done it.
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Old 01-10-20, 12:34 AM
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Originally Posted by due ruote View Post
Yeah, I bought some from McMaster Carr, drilled to their spec, and when I tried to tap the screws in, I could see the head tube was starting to deform. I bailed and just stuck the badge on with silicone and glued on dummy brass heads.
Ditto to this one.
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Old 01-10-20, 06:58 AM
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My standard practice is to glue the head badge back on and then glue faux rivets in the holes. I’ve made those from spoke heads and alu rod.
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Old 01-10-20, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by due ruote View Post
Yeah, I bought some from McMaster Carr, drilled to their spec, and when I tried to tap the screws in, I could see the head tube was starting to deform.
To prevent the head tube from denting, find a socket that will fit into the head tube to use while tapping in the screws. You might want two, one above the hole and one below.
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