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'82 Trek 412 Refurb/Upgrade

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'82 Trek 412 Refurb/Upgrade

Old 03-27-20, 12:26 AM
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jrupe
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'82 Trek 412 Refurb/Upgrade

I have an early 80s Trek that I'm looking forward to cleaning up. I live in a hilly area, so I'm thinking to swap the crankset, from the 52-40T to a 46-30T. I'm looking at the IRD Defiant, but I'm confused about the difference between the Double Compact Crankset and the Wide Double Compact Crankset. The descriptions are identical from what I can tell but the prices are not. Are they the same? Would either still work for me?

I'm new and still can't post any links, but Bike Mania has both the IRD Defiants I'm referencing, if that helps.

I also want to replace the rims and tires. Should I stay true to original wheel size? Would Wheel Master's 27" wheelset do the trick?

Thanks for any advice, I appreciate it.

1982 Trek 412
Sakae Ringyo Custom Crankset, 40-52, 5 pin
Suntour Vx-S Derailleaurs
Suntour Mighty-6 Freewheel, 14-16-19-23-27-30
Atom Hubs
Dia Compe Brakes
Mystery Rims (originallly Rigida)
Crappy Wheels (originally Michelin 27"x1")
Ishiwata Double Butted Chrome Molybdenum Frame
Nikko Bottom Bracket
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Old 03-27-20, 01:25 AM
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Most will say if the brakes will reach 700c, go ahead and convert.

A 40x30 is a pretty low gear. You may want to try it before changing cranksets.
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Old 03-27-20, 01:32 AM
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norcalmike
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Cool. Looking forward to seeing the build.
I have a 1980 414 (412) that i started a few years ago. Still a basket case
I never tried to fit 700c on it so i cant speak on fitment.
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Old 03-27-20, 07:33 AM
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Looks like the ‘82 412 and 613/614 are almost identical except for 1 cm shorter chain stays. I fit 650bx38 in my 614. Almost anything you want should work in that aspect.
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Old 03-27-20, 07:49 AM
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https://velo-orange.com/products/gra...-crankset-mkii

The 46 30 crank you mention uses a smaller bolt circle. The vo one here uses smaller yet.
If you went with a 50 34 110... the cheaper option your low gear would be quite managable at 34/30. Somewhere near 30 inches. Back in the day that was a touring gear.
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Old 03-27-20, 08:43 AM
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I had an 82 412 for awhile. There’s no reason to stay with 27” wheels. If you’re buying new wheels, at least go 700c, the stock brakes will reach fine. I had room for 700x32s with fenders, or 700x38 without.




If want to spend a bit more money, that bike is an excellent 650b conversion candidate with Dia Compe 750 centerpull brakes. My 82 412 cleared 650x42 with room for fenders


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Old 03-27-20, 08:44 AM
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Mr. 66
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I'm working on an '83 Trek 520 that looks great with 700 wheels. Works great with reagular reach brake calipers.
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Old 03-27-20, 09:04 AM
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nlerner
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I had an '82 Trek 412 that I purchased in 1982.

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Old 03-27-20, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
https://velo-orange.com/products/gra...-crankset-mkii

The 46 30 crank you mention uses a smaller bolt circle. The vo one here uses smaller yet.
If you went with a 50 34 110... the cheaper option your low gear would be quite managable at 34/30. Somewhere near 30 inches. Back in the day that was a touring gear.
This is good advice. Or go with a 110/74 and you have even more choices. Lot of either size sitting on the dock of E Bay, watching the tide roll away.
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Old 03-27-20, 11:20 AM
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Why Wheelmaster wheels? They don't look like an upgrade to me. Do you need new wheels? If so, are your current hubs in good shape?

Have you considered building your own wheels? If you haven't done it before, it could be frustrating, but it would probably give you a good sense of accomplishment. (And since I can do it, almost anyone can.) If you get something on the level of Wheelmasters, you'll probably have to do a lot of evening out the spoke tension and truing when you get 'em.
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Old 03-27-20, 02:51 PM
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Hey all, thanks for the feedback, I really appreciate it. Look forward to hitting my 10th post so I can send share links and images.

It sounds like I should upgrade to 700c only if and when I need to. For now I'll grab some fresh tubes, a pair of Panaracer Pasela ProTites and call it a day. Out of curiosity though, Mr. 66, what brand of 700c tires did you use for you '83?

Regarding the gearing, I considered a 50/34 but decided I would rather get to 1:1. I have a newish Trek 1 Series that runs a 50/34 crank and 11-28 cassette which allows me to get up the hills in my area. So pairing the same with the Mighty-6 14-30 would offer a lower gear, but I'm not sure if this would fully compensate for the extra weight of the bike and the types of rides I would like to do. I watched the 20th L'Eroica in Gaiole a few years back and would be stoked to participate in the California event at some point. My idea is to start training on Tam, so I'm looking for mtb type gearing. I'm sure a 110/74 BCD would be ideal most of the time, but I'm hoping to have the super low range when I need it.

I'm still pretty set on the IRD Defiant. Upon closer examination it seems the difference is that the Wide version can accommodate up to an 11 speed cassette, which I definitely don't need. Am I reading into this right? If so, should I be fine with the regular Double Compact?

IRD Defiant Double Compact Crankset ($191.95)
+ Retro styled
+ CNC-machined 7075 aluminum rings
+ Cold forged 6061 T6 aluminum arms
+ JIS square taper
+ 50-34t has a 110 BCD spider
+ 46-30t has a 94 BCD spider
IRD Defiant Wide Double Compact Crankset ($201.95)
+ Retro styled crankset
+ 11 Speed + Silver + CNC-machined 7075 aluminum rings
+ Cold forged 6061 T6 aluminum arms
+ JIS square taper
+ 50-34t has a 110 BCD spider
+ 46-30t has a 94BCD spider


Last two questions, for now .

I need to replace the drops as I believe they are about 36 cm. I want to stay in the SR family and am looking at either a World Custom 42 cm or a Sakae Randnner 42 cm. I'm leaning toward the randonneur version. Any opinions here?

Lastly about the pulleys on the rear derailleur. The upper pulley is pretty dull and it won't hold the chain (was somehow still rideable before I began removing everything for cleaning). They are 10T pulleys. Would the Sunrace SP850 Rear Derailleur Replacement Pulley work?

Thanks again!
John

1982 Trek 412
Sakae Ringyo Custom Crankset, 40-52, 5 pin
Suntour BL RD-3600 (S)
Suntour Mighty-6 Freewheel, 14-16-19-23-27-30
Atom Hubs
Dia Compe Brakes
Mystery Rims (originallly Rigida)
Crappy Wheels (originally Michelin 27"x1")
Ishiwata Double Butted Chrome Molybdenum Frame
Nikko Bottom Bracket
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Old 03-27-20, 03:03 PM
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Just chiming in with an 80 414, with 700c wheels. My best fitting bike.
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Old 03-27-20, 05:19 PM
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UPDATE on the IRD Defiant Double Compact. Just got off the phone with IRD, super nice support there! The Wide is indeed for an 11 speed. The regular lists 9/10 speed but of course can accommodate anything less, duh! At least I'm learning.

I think I'll get the Sakae Randnner drops. If anyone knows whether the Sunrace SP850 Rear Derailleur Replacement Pulley will work for the BL (S), please let me know!

Thanks again
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Old 03-27-20, 06:42 PM
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For tires I just have some old crappy Specialized Turbos on the 520 at the moment. You got me wondering how big tire I can fit, it's gonna be big. There's a mile of clearance. Here's a quick shot of it.
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Old 03-28-20, 03:11 AM
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Do you have access to some kind of bike co-op? You can often find lots of vintage parts at co-ops. they often have used wheels, it’s how I find 700c wheels for 700c conversions.

Tires? I use Paselas, just like the 27” tires. If your 27” wheel set is in good shape, it will be way cheaper to just get a new pair of tires. If you want a project or can easily/reasonably find 700c wheels, go for it.

My ‘81 412 took 700c wheels easily. It also helped that I swapped out the Dia Compe side pulls with 610 centerpulls. I can just barely squeeze 35’s and fenders - it’s quite tight. 38’s without fenders is also doable.

For way less than $200 you can find a nice SR Apex or Super Custom crank in 86 BCD and have options all the way from 28t on up and you don’t have to worry about two different BCD’s. It’s what I put on my wife’s 710 and my 412. She has a 45/28 and I have a 50/45/32.

This one is not my favorite with the imperfect taper, but has the perfect rings for your project, just remove the 50t, swap in chainring bolts for a double and Bob’s your uncle! Might not even have to change the spindle in your bottom bracket!

We both have long cage rear derailleurs to handle the chain wrap. Your Suntour BL 3600 (S) should be able to handle it.

Last edited by mountaindave; 03-28-20 at 03:28 AM.
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Old 03-28-20, 04:58 PM
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Thanks Mountain Dave, you're the man! I was able to track down a Super Custom 86 BCD 28/45/50 and will convert to a double. So much better staying in the Sankae Ringyo family and saving the money!

Thanks for the feedback, really appreciate it!
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Old 03-28-20, 05:59 PM
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I have one of those IRD Defiant cranksets. I have the triple, with the Velo Orange name on it. I thought it would be OK but I find it to be of extremely good quality. I'm not that strong, but it certainly is as stiff as I can tell, and it shifts better than any other I've used.
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Old 03-28-20, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by jrupe View Post
Thanks Mountain Dave, you're the man! I was able to track down a Super Custom 86 BCD 28/45/50 and will convert to a double. So much better staying in the Sankae Ringyo family and saving the money!

Thanks for the feedback, really appreciate it!
It's a bit of an odd duck with the 86 BCD, but one can still find new rings from Europe if needed. I'm not sure why it didn't stick around. Even though it predated mountain bikes, it's probably the 110/74 combo that became MTB ubiquitous that killed it off. For road I find it just perfect.
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Old 03-28-20, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by mountaindave View Post
It's a bit of an odd duck with the 86 BCD, but one can still find new rings from Europe if needed. I'm not sure why it didn't stick around. Even though it predated mountain bikes, it's probably the 110/74 combo that became MTB ubiquitous that killed it off. For road I find it just perfect.
those are nice cranks. There is one at my local coop.
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