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Rare beast indeed, have a look

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Rare beast indeed, have a look

Old 04-12-20, 04:39 PM
  #1  
reissue59
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Rare beast indeed, have a look

This is a Bertrand bicycle in Columbus SP
full Campy group with pedals and hubs,
a garage queen, pictures are as found, not washed.
she is clean! Spent most of her life in a garage
Bertrand had a go at making bikes for a short while.
to put this on perpective, Marinonis here are plentyfull, this in this condition is a unicorn
250$ CAN. Worth the 2 hour drive
enjoy,







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Old 04-12-20, 04:49 PM
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-----

there was a Bertrand cycle maker in Britain at one time -

https://thecabe.com/forum/threads/how-old-is-it.166645/


-----
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Old 04-12-20, 05:20 PM
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Gorgeous. Where did you find it?
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Old 04-12-20, 06:02 PM
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If you are familiar with the province, found it in Granby 1 hour south of montreal, marketplace ad, to which I promptly replied, I offered 250. The bike was advertised at 200.
you gotta be quick and.make.sure you secure the prize. When something good pops up, I offer more
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Old 04-12-20, 06:36 PM
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Happy to know I didn't miss it. Awesome catch though!
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Old 04-12-20, 07:17 PM
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Beautiful bike. Very nice find and a great deal at 250cdn. I'm in Toronto so I'm familiar with the brand...but I doubt most have heard of the small scale builder in Quebec.
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Old 04-12-20, 07:40 PM
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Every biker here knows Gardin , trust me
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Old 04-12-20, 08:10 PM
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Very nice bike. Interesting history of Bertrand cycles. Later bikes manufactured by Marinoni.
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Old 04-12-20, 08:51 PM
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Bicycle Guide magazine, April 1987 had a lengthy section on Bertrand from page 34 to page 39 including a test of the Neca Can-Am model, in case you are interested. Yours is a lovely bike with its Campy Triomphe gruppo and a real deal, definitely worth the 2 hour drive.
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Old 04-12-20, 10:51 PM
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Good ol' Triomphe.

Keep keep your eye out for a Victory rear derailleur.
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Old 04-12-20, 11:44 PM
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Triomphe vs Victory RDs

reissue59 Nice bike. Columbus SP is a good choice for that size frame. I especially like the font Bertrand used.

The red and yellow colors match my early 80's DeRosa that I built up at the beginning of the year.



Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
Good ol' Triomphe.

Keep keep your eye out for a Victory rear derailleur.
There's not that much difference between Triomphe and Victory RDs. The Victory quality is a little better. They both have the same Geometry as the Campy 4001 Super Record, also the 980 and 990 RDs. They had a 28T published rear sprocket capacity but don't believe everything....

Early Triomphe RD



Early Victory RD



Campy SR RD with 13-32T 7 speed FW with 50-38T chainrings.



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Old 04-12-20, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by verktyg View Post
There's not that much difference between Triomphe and Victory RDs. The Victory quality is a little better.
I'd say "a lot" ... and looks waaay better, too.

The rest of the group is a push.
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Old 04-13-20, 06:01 AM
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I first met Gilles Bertrand in the early 1970s, though I haven't seen him since the late 1990s. We always used to visit his little shop on Rue Eddy in Hull, when we were in the capital region for a race. The subject bicycle appears to be circa 1985-1987 and his lower end road frame based on the lack of chrome and the presence of dropout eyelets. While they are relatively rare, I wouldn't call them a unicorn. The vast majority of the guys from the 1980s Southern Ontario and Western Quebec racing scene would know the brand, courtesy of the team that the shop sponsored. I had a late 1980s Bertrand 3000 model with Columbus SLX

They were nice frames but one marketing faux pas was that Gilles eschewed embossing the logo into fittings. Inside he used decals. When cyclists were spending $1000+ CDN on a new bicycle, they didn't expect to see decals in place of embossing, on places like the fork crown and stay caps. Many felt that this cheapened the appearance of the bicycles. Had an investment been made in embossed fittings, cyclists would have been more receptive to the brand and it might have had a wider following.
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Old 12-20-20, 04:35 AM
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Bertrand bike

Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
I first met Gilles Bertrand in the early 1970s, though I haven't seen him since the late 1990s. We always used to visit his little shop on Rue Eddy in Hull, when we were in the capital region for a race. The subject bicycle appears to be circa 1985-1987 and his lower end road frame based on the lack of chrome and the presence of dropout eyelets. While they are relatively rare, I wouldn't call them a unicorn. The vast majority of the guys from the 1980s Southern Ontario and Western Quebec racing scene would know the brand, courtesy of the team that the shop sponsored. I had a late 1980s Bertrand 3000 model with Columbus SLX

They were nice frames but one marketing faux pas was that Gilles eschewed embossing the logo into fittings. Inside he used decals. When cyclists were spending $1000+ CDN on a new bicycle, they didn't expect to see decals in place of embossing, on places like the fork crown and stay caps. Many felt that this cheapened the appearance of the bicycles. Had an investment been made in embossed fittings, cyclists would have been more receptive to the brand and it might have had a wider following.
Apologies on jumping into the post, but as relatively recent and topic of interest - last night I picked up a Bertrand bike, nice lightweight (sort of) frame with good parts like DA 7100 black edition gearing, 27 1/4 wheels....could this be made by same frame builder? Would you be able to help? Checked their shop and only phone number given, so not sure if current shop staff would bother to look at anything lake that. Pics below.

Many thanks in advance


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Old 12-20-20, 02:48 PM
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Pretty cool!

And with crank arm spider drillium no less.
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Old 12-20-20, 04:55 PM
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Kekec1965-

I think, based on frame fittings and design, that you have one of the British Bertrands not a Canadian one. Check here: https://www.classiclightweights.co.u...rs/bertrand-c/
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Old 12-20-20, 06:39 PM
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Sounds a lot more plausible indeed.
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Old 12-20-20, 06:47 PM
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Even rarer than the OP's Bertrand road bike is my Bertrand touring bike

I know several people who own Bertrand road bikes in the Montreal area
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Old 12-20-20, 09:54 PM
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Here's my slightly too small GB3000.




Originally Posted by alcjphil View Post
Even rarer than the OP's Bertrand road bike is my Bertrand touring bike
I know several people who own Bertrand road bikes in the Montreal area
Still waiting to find one in 57cm
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Old 12-21-20, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Kekec1965 View Post
Apologies on jumping into the post, but as relatively recent and topic of interest - last night I picked up a Bertrand bike, nice lightweight (sort of) frame with good parts like DA 7100 black edition gearing, 27 1/4 wheels....could this be made by same frame builder? Would you be able to help? Checked their shop and only phone number given, so not sure if current shop staff would bother to look at anything lake that. Pics below.

Many thanks in advance
As others before me suggested, yours is likely of British origin. The seatstay ends, lugs, and decal styling all suggest as much. The 27" wheels and top tube cable stops also suggest 70's FWIW.

Lovely bike!
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Old 12-21-20, 10:52 AM
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@jonny7 - The top of the SS look very small in diameter!
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Old 12-21-20, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by verktyg View Post
reissue59 Nice bike. Columbus SP is a good choice for that size frame. I especially like the font Bertrand used.

The red and yellow colors match my early 80's DeRosa that I built up at the beginning of the year.





There's not that much difference between Triomphe and Victory RDs. The Victory quality is a little better. They both have the same Geometry as the Campy 4001 Super Record, also the 980 and 990 RDs. They had a 28T published rear sprocket capacity but don't believe everything....

Early Triomphe RD



Early Victory RD



Campy SR RD with 13-32T 7 speed FW with 50-38T chainrings.



verktyg
RE: Campy SR RD with 13-32T 7 speed FW with 50-38T chainrings
Did not think this range possible, thought a 13-28T would be stretching it?
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Old 12-21-20, 11:29 AM
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Great looking find OP. I grew up
in Mtl and picked up cycling in ‘86 and opined for a Bertrand or a Marinoni but as a teen ended up with a velo sport touring bike that I used for years and toured with.

later in the late 80’s up to about ‘90 I had a side gig lacing wheels for Marinoni at $5/pop. Great time but still couldn’t afford one until much later lol
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Old 12-21-20, 02:59 PM
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Campy RD Capacities

Originally Posted by joesch View Post
RE: Campy SR RD with 13-32T 7 speed FW with 50-38T chainrings
Did not think this range possible, thought a 13-28T would be stretching it?
READ PUBLISHED DERAILLEUR CAPACITY SPECS AS THE MAXIMUM OR MINIMUM THAT WILL WORK WITHOUT A PROBLEM ON MOST BIKES.

Campy Record and Nuovo Record RDs were rated at 26T maximum freewheel sprocket size. Since the early 70's I've had very few problems running 28T FWs with those derailleurs both on my own bikes and customer's bikes that we set up at our shop.

Frequently it's a matter of trial and error - adjusting chain length and wheel position in the dropouts.

The other thing is the tooth difference between the chainrings, chain stay length too. Also, you may not be able to use all of the gear combos: e.g. big-big, or small-small.

On a Classic Rendezvous Geezer Ride back in 2013 there were 2 bikes running 34T large sprockets and 2 running 32T with standard Campy NR RDs.

34T


32T


13-31T on my 1970 Gitane SC


I was trying to use 50-36T chainrings on my Holdsworth pictured above but the 2nd gen SR RD didn't have enough chain wrap so I had to settle for 50-38T. I can hit all of the gears on that bike.

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Old 12-21-20, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
I'd say "a lot" ... and looks waaay better, too.
In finish only; both RD's are pretty much constructed the same way.

I'd argue that if one goes into a Triomphe knowing that it works best on narrow-spaced freewheels, and that its best to file the upper pivot stop to get decent chain wrap with it, it's arguably superior to the Victory. At least there's no three-position ring-shaped pivot stop to break (as they do) or lose (as is common).

-Kurt
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