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Unknown Frame Identification with Zeus Dropouts

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Unknown Frame Identification with Zeus Dropouts

Old 06-01-20, 11:54 PM
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HPL
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Unknown Frame Identification with Zeus Dropouts

Trying to help a friend ID a repainted frame, presumably mid-late '70s. It has Zeus dropouts front and rear. Fairly distinctive head lug and seat cluster cutouts, and seat stay caps. No BB vent cutout. It does have a serial (?) number on the BB. BB top mount cable guides, no other braze-ons that I know of. I have not been provided with the BB width or thread specs. Sorry for the limited info/photos. I have seen the lug cutouts before, but cannot recall maker; nothing in my inventory matches. Some other components (not sure if OE):Balilla side pull brakes, Huret lower end "ECO" steel rear derailleur, Maeda/Sun Tour "Perfect" 5 speed FW (14t-24t), Nervar alloy cranks (BSA; maybe 63x model?), NISI Moncalieri rims, Michelin hubs/skewers.
( Photo credits P. Drost)


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Old 06-02-20, 12:19 AM
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I have seen that lug cutout once before, too, but now am drawing a blank. Somebody will remember but it's an obscure one! Do you mean the Nervar cranks have BSA (BSC) pedal threads, and are the hubs Miche (not Michelin, tho the family names are related they tell us)? Bet this is one that MauriceMoss could nail for you!
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Old 06-02-20, 08:23 AM
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-----

not as yet mentioned is frame tubing and threading standard employed

if frame of Iberian origin it is early enough to still be all metric

how did your friend determine it to be a respray? there is adhesive residue from a head transfer visible.

lug pattern Prugnat 62/d

seat stay treatment is one widely employed in France

ID should come fairly quickly as frame clearly "production" as opposed to "artisanal" - not made by a lone workperson labouring in a garret

-----

Last edited by juvela; 06-02-20 at 09:51 AM. Reason: addition
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Old 06-02-20, 09:48 AM
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#1 on the swaged seatstay "caps" being FRENCH. the fork tip treatment is
very unusal.
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Old 06-02-20, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by juvela View Post
-----

not as yet mentioned is frame tubing and threading standard employed

if frame of Iberian origin it is early enough to still be all metric

how did your friend determine it to be a respray? there is adhesive residue from a head transfer visible.

lug pattern Prugnat 62/d

seat stay treatment is one widely employed in France

ID should come fairly quickly as frame clearly "production" as opposed to "artisanal" - not made by a lone workperson labouring in a garret

-----
Originally Posted by unworthy1 View Post
I have seen that lug cutout once before, too, but now am drawing a blank. Somebody will remember but it's an obscure one! Do you mean the Nervar cranks have BSA (BSC) pedal threads, and are the hubs Miche (not Michelin, tho the family names are related they tell us)? Bet this is one that MauriceMoss could nail for you!
I have asked for more photos and descriptions; threads, diameters, etc. I have not been given adequate info regarding components and frame. I assumed about a mid '70s French frame, without knowledge of the BB. Parts are typical boom parts for the period. Inner side of crank stamped B.S.A. The owner does not know the bike's history. I can only assume that he was told it was a repaint; I asked for a head tube photo from the front to see the "headbadge" outline.

Edit: Concerning the hubs; I was told that they were Michelin (no identifying photo), skewers are Michelin from photo evidence.
I agree regarding the "production" vice "artisanal" manufacture; although from what I have seen in the few photos, it appears to be of decent quality.

Thanks

Last edited by HPL; 06-02-20 at 10:28 PM.
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Old 06-03-20, 05:41 PM
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The frame looks a lot like the Carlos-branded bike here. Hope this helps.
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Old 06-03-20, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by non-fixie View Post
The frame looks a lot like the Carlos-branded bike here. Hope this helps.

-----

"Ve haff a vinner!"

"..if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck it's a ________"

---

BTW - the B.S.A. marking on the inner face of the crank arm is one employed by manufacturer Peyrard on NERVAR brand chainsets to indicate that the pedal thread is 9/16"

-----
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Old 06-03-20, 11:42 PM
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Those lug cutouts are a hallmark of a company called Tecnotelai (of Bologna). I've always thought the cutouts looked like old school flying saucers, but they're probably meant to look like the outline of their logo:






Tecnotelai did quite a few contract builds in the 70s and maybe early 80s (and yes, I've run across Tecnotelai frames that had British threaded BBs). I'm not sure when they stopped making bicycle frames; I think they now only do furniture.

Eugenio Rampinelli (of Roto) tapped a frame builder named Orazio Grenzi (his Viriginia frames are gorgeous btw) to manage the bicycle frame building venture of Tecnotelai. Grenzi then had Luciano Paletti take over his old business.


While I'm sure there were other builders in Italy that may have used Zeus dropouts here and there, I can't think of any off the top of my head. Tecnotelai is the only Italian manufacturer that used them extensively.







As for Carlos (of Maurage, Belgium), the only documentation I've seen isn't really clear whether it was a shop that built frames or rebadged contract builds (I guess being a grossiste might mean likely contracts?):





The linked Carlos is the first by Tecnotelai I've seen, but I have seen a few that looked like they were made by some other Italian contractors (one even had that "Modello Serie Elegant / A Torresini" sticker). Whether these are all legit Carlos frames or owner-decaled, it's hard to tell.
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Old 06-04-20, 07:42 AM
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WOW!

Maurice hits another grand slam.

Huge thanks.

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Old 06-04-20, 10:47 AM
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Thanks, MauriceMoss! Much appreciated.

WRT the Carlos brand, the other tidbit I have to offer is that they also sold re-branded Alans. This is fellow C&V (and Alan) enthusiast Fabio Farelli's Carlos, which I photographed a while back in Haarlem (the original post is here):

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Old 06-13-20, 02:36 PM
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Tecnotelai Frame Identification

Thanks @MauriceMoss, and @non-fixie for the information and images. I had gotten this marque confused with the Tecnotrat frames, but still didn't know that particular lug cut-out. I have yet to receive anymore information regarding the frame itself regarding threading and dimensions since my friend was looking to purchase, but no more information given by the seller. It could be a higher end frame (possibly Columbus SL, etc.) or some other proprietary tubing that they used. I found an alternate seat tube decal without Columbus markings. If I find more information about this frame I will post it for reference purposes.


(photo credit: Schermata 08-2456532 alle 18.09.36)
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Old 03-27-21, 03:50 AM
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Braze preventing clamp on shifters slipping down.

Hi

I have seen some Zeus bikes have a "v" type braze on the down tube that apart from aesthetics, I assume prevents the shifters from slipping down.

Did any other frame manufacturers use this idea?

I am trying to confirm I have a Zeus but I don't see and "z" on the lugs and the serial number - 3013 - is under the bottom bracket. I see many Zeus frams have Serial Numbers on the headtube.

Here is some other information:
Frame ??
Fork ??
Fork Crown Vagner No.11
Fork Drop outs Zeus
Rear Dropouts Zeus
Headset ??
Stem Cinelli
Bars Cinelli 66 Campione del Mondo (early logo)
Brake Levers Weinmann AG (with quick releases)
Brak Calipers Weinmann AG 750 Vainqueur 999 (black label)
Shifters Zeus Gran Sport
Bottle cage None
FD Zeus
RD Zeus GrandSport
Bottom Bracket ??
BB Width 70mm
Cranks Zeus
Chain
Casette 5 speed
Axelwidth 130mm
Seat post Zeus
Saddle
Peddals Zeus
Hubs Campagnolo Record 1035 High Flange
Rims Fiamme Pista Tubular
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Old 03-27-21, 09:58 AM
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-----

Hello ItalianPassion and welcome to the forum!

Your text description certainly sounds like a Zeus bicycle.

The one piece of information which does not fit is the 70mm shell width.

Actual Zeus produced cycles were done with BNA standard where shells were 68mm.

Another oddity in the text is the statement of a 130mm rear spacing paired with a 5V gear block. A spot of "mix & not match" hath been done here. Perhaps the machine began life at 120mm with a 5V block and someone altered it to 130mm to accommodate a wider stern hub.

Have owned three Zeus machines from the early 1970's and all exhibited the vee-shaped no-slide braze-on you describe.

There are some workarounds for not being able to post images until you have ten posts.

One is in your member's area there is a place to create a member photo album for yourself. It is not necessary to have made ten postings in order to do this. Readers can visit the album and post a URL for it or the actual images to a thread for you.

Another approach is to post your images to a third party image host and then post the URL in a munged form here on the forum in order to get it past the censor. You will of course need to include instructions as to how to de-munge it.

Suggest you commence a new thread on your cycle rather than do this add-on type of procedure.

There are a number of forum members who own or have owned Zeus bicycles who will be able to post some solid information for you.

Hope this assists a bit.

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Last edited by juvela; 03-27-21 at 04:23 PM. Reason: addition
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Old 03-29-21, 12:23 AM
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Thanks, helps a lot.

I may well have got BB shell wrong. I did not remove the crank to measure so will not be 100% accurate.
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